$AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256542.005B2A88; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 08:38:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA21298 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 08:29:08 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA18305 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 10:09:45 -0600 Received: from ts38-06.tor.istar.ca [204.191.149.85] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xRg5y-0003MF-00; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 11:08:19 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 01 Nov 1997 11:14:18 -0500 To: , beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Hello, Can you give me a clue Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Hello, Can you give me a clue PostedDate: 11/01/97 08:14:18 AM SendTo: ams@newcel.newcrest.com.au,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/01/97 08:35:49 AM-11/01/97 08:35:49 AM DeliveredDate: 11/01/97 08:35:49 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi Drew; Brian Bush posted this to the BEAM mailing list on your behalf. At 09:20 PM 10/31/97 -0500, Andrew Stokes (NC OPR)" (by way of wrote: > >I stumbled upon Andrew Millers Web page (and consequently yours and >others) about a month ago and since then have been facinated by this >subject. Subsequently I have read as much as I can about any work >revolving around Mark Tilden's concept. It is fascinating stuff. Even more fascinating when you see this stuff happening in a creature of your own design. > >I'd like to think one day I will build some of the stuff I have seen, >but for now I have questions. These questions probably come from the >fact I have some (but not much really) knowledge of electronics, please >bare with me........ > >I read Living Machines and while I didn't understand everything I get >the picture. My questions mostly come from here. > >The Symbol Lexicon in Figures 4 and 5 is reasonably self explanitory >after reading the text however > >1. What does the + or - mean when it is behind Nu "Excitory vs. Inhibitive" the "+" lengthens the process. > >2. Why haven't I seen an Nv+ Looking in the wrong places? :-) > >3. Why are the tactile sensors labeled with + or - "Excitory vs. Inhibitive" as above. > >4. Is the line from the centre to the outside of an Nu just a quick >visual indicator that it is an Nu or does it mean something more. Visual sensor. > >5.The reversable Motor Symbol, how is this facilitated. All of the motors are "reversable." The Circle-with-an- "X"-through-it symbol is used to make the _robot_ go backwards. It is facilitated by reversing the connection of the motor(s) to the MicroCore. Think of it as a multiplexor. When you start building we can get into more detail. > >6. I understand what DOF means but where does 1.25 or 2.5 come from. I >guess I was wrong to assume that each degree represented 1"pivot point". >How is it that .25's and .5's can be used. The fractional degrees of freedom are a single degree of freedom that is then shared among several limbs. As an example: A four legged 'bot with a motor per leg and a waist motor could be said to have a) "...four 1-DOF legs and a 1-DOF torso," b) "...four 1.25-DOF legs." > >7. Is there such a thing as the perfect solar engine. Has any one used a >control light source, solar panel and motor to test variations of >resistors, transistors, capacitors or diodes. It's probably to time >consuming I realise, but has it been done, if so is it possible to get a >look at the results. "Perfect" in what way? More energy-out than energy-in? :-) We've evolved some pretty good ones, but manufacturers keep improving their products, so the SolarEngines should keep improving, too. > >8. I noticed that nobody has mentioned composites for use in >structural/exoskeleton construction. I assume weight is an issue when >dealing with small mechanical devices such as these, is it just to early >in the evolutionary scheme of things to be "weight watching" or has this >been over looked in the search for electronic perfection. Well, if you have experience with composites, perhaps you will share that information with the mailing list when you apply your skills to one of your robots. There are a bunch of regular contributors that have R/C experience, so it could be that some of them are doing a composite-body as I type. > >I enjoy reading what has come from the mailing list and hope that >someone cares to answer these questions > >I hope emailing you direct is okay. :-) Nope. Write to the list. Share. :-) Remember that admin. issues like (un)subscribe only go to: beam-request@webconn.com Also check that your mail program doesn't automatically change "piority" to "high" that's like "SHOUTING." :-) > >thanks in advance > >Andrew Stokes. >(Drew) > Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256542.006F532E; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 12:18:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA00572 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 12:09:15 -0800 From: IMIvar@aol.com Received: from mrin44.mail.aol.com (mrin44.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.154]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18630 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 13:53:54 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin44.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id OAA06720; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 14:52:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 1 Nov 1997 14:52:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971101145207_2036404707@mrin44.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com cc: ams@newcel.newcrest.com.au Subject: Re: Hello, Can you give me a clue SMTPOriginator: IMIvar@aol.com From: IMIvar@aol.com Subject: Re: Hello, Can you give me a clue PostedDate: 11/01/97 11:52:07 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com CopyTo: ams@newcel.newcrest.com.au $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/01/97 12:16:09 PM-11/01/97 12:16:10 PM DeliveredDate: 11/01/97 12:16:10 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In a message dated 97-10-31 21:24:52 EST, you write: > The Symbol Lexicon in Figures 4 and 5 is reasonably self explanitory > after reading the text however > > 1. What does the + or - mean when it is behind Nu Not quite sure, but I believe it had something to do with the neuron running on positive or negative logic. i.e. the output is a positive signal when the neuron is operating. Please feel free to correct me on anything... > 2. Why haven't I seen an Nv+ Dunno. Probably something to do with Nv neurons circuit. (see Tildens patent for more info) To help you understand what a nervous neuron is, here's a quote from John DeVries... "A _nervous_ neuron is similar, except there isn't the notion of integration (summing over time.) In fact, the model of a nervous neuron is still a summer, followed by a DIFFERENTIATOR (the capacitor) followed by a threshold unit." My guess is, that a Nervous neuron will not work (or won't work effectivly) using positive logic. Again, correct me if I'm wrong. > 3. Why are the tactile sensors labeled with + or -? The tactile sensor extends the length of a pulse going through a neuron when it has a "+" on it, decreases the length of the pulse when it has a "-" on it. > 4. Is the line from the centre to the outside of an Nu just a quick > visual indicator that it is an Nu or does it mean something more. Probably a visual indicator. > 5.The reversable Motor Symbol, how is this facilitated. The reversable waist motor is located at the "waist" (Oh boy...now I am getting redundant...) of the robot. From a side view, it's parallel to the ground, and it rotates along the robot's front to back lenthwise axis. It lifts the legs off the ground in a 5 motor walker, and gives it good turning abilities. > 6. I understand what DOF means but where does 1.25 or 2.5 come from. I > guess I was wrong to assume that each degree represented 1"pivot point". > How is it that .25's and .5's can be used. Probably has somthing to do with the wasit motor. Perhaps the motor can only turn 90 degrees or so, so it has limited DOF in that area? > 7. Is there such a thing as the perfect solar engine. Has any one used a > control light source, solar panel and motor to test variations of > resistors, transistors, capacitors or diodes. It's probably to time > consuming I realise, but has it been done, if so is it possible to get a > look at the results. Kinda broad question, so here's a kinda broad answer. Yes, there is such a thing as a perfect solarengine, but no, it has never been built (although some roboticists particularly proud of their work would beg to differ...). I don't know wabout using a standardized test for solarengines. Anybody got any info on that? That would be an interesting comparison. > 8. I noticed that nobody has mentioned composites for use in > structural/exoskeleton construction. I assume weight is an issue when > dealing with small mechanical devices such as these, is it just to early > in the evolutionary scheme of things to be "weight watching" or has this > been over looked in the search for electronic perfection. I'm working on a simple bot using some composites as a frame, but haven't had any time lately. Fiberglass is ideal for mass production if you have the female molds, tools, equipment, etc, but it is difficult to machine. If the 'bot works, I might put up a page on it. As for weight watching, the lighter the better, in my opinion. > I enjoy reading what has come from the mailing list and hope that > someone cares to answer these questions Sure. > I hope emailing you direct is okay. :-) Fine with me. > thanks in advance > Andrew Stokes. > (Drew) Ivar Thorson, 15 -- http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/9879/homepage.htm -- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256542.00753D57; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 13:20:34 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA02103 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 13:10:51 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA18799 for ; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 15:06:44 -0600 Received: from ts83ip4.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA80390; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 14:03:31 -0700 Received: by ts83ip4.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCE6D7.73A9DB80@ts83ip4.cadvision.com>; Sat, 1 Nov 1997 15:04:29 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCE6D7.73A9DB80@ts83ip4.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'IMIvar@aol.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Hello, Can you give me a clue Date: Sat, 1 Nov 1997 15:04:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Hello, Can you give me a clue PostedDate: 11/01/97 02:04:26 PM SendTo: IMIvar@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/01/97 01:20:39 PM-11/01/97 01:20:40 PM DeliveredDate: 11/01/97 01:20:40 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > 7. Is there such a thing as the perfect solar engine. Has any one used a > control light source, solar panel and motor to test variations of > resistors, transistors, capacitors or diodes. It's probably to time > consuming I realise, but has it been done, if so is it possible to get a > look at the results. Kinda broad question, so here's a kinda broad answer. Yes, there is such a thing as a perfect solarengine, but no, it has never been built (although some roboticists particularly proud of their work would beg to differ...). I don't know wabout using a standardized test for solarengines. Anybody got any info on that? That would be an interesting comparison. They are VERY similar except for the setup, 1 pnp ,1 npn, 1 cap, ,1 diode, 1 resistor, 1 input 1 output. A few engineers have changed brian or daves SE and made them "More efficent". Perfect is a very hard, to reach, think of it as 100% now, There are little things which might be modifyed, but as tech moves on, there will be newer and less current components, When something new happens, the se we use now will be scraped to the trash, somewhat like the HBS The test could be if it beats millers #1 solar roller, Did I forget to mention that his can go 1 m in around 25 secs or less Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256543.0061612F; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 09:43:38 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA26761 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 09:33:52 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA19342 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 11:09:02 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA00510 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:07:30 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711021707.MAA00510@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp9.buffnet.net(205.246.19.188) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma018366; Sun, 2 Nov 97 12:07:00 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:15:30 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. PostedDate: 11/02/97 09:15:30 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 09:43:46 AM-11/02/97 09:43:46 AM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 09:43:46 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I Have decided to put together motor driver kits to be used with Biocore's, microcores and other applications. The kit will use three stacked 74XX245's to controll motors. I was looking for any suggestion's anyone had for things I might look to including in the kit. I will put up a web page soon giving more information. Possibly after creating the motor driver kits I may offer Microcore kits, however I'm going to try to start simple. The kit will be aimed twards begginers but I may also source 74XX245 chips, I can obtain the 74ALS245 chip for under 40cents each. Pretty good. Please e-mail me with any suggestions. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256543.00657A1F; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 10:28:24 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA21916 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 10:18:43 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA19479 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:10:47 -0600 Received: from ts83ip4.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id LAA18824; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 11:08:32 -0700 Received: by ts83ip4.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCE788.3A3128C0@ts83ip4.cadvision.com>; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:09:53 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCE788.3A3128C0@ts83ip4.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Dennison'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:09:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. PostedDate: 11/02/97 11:09:50 AM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 10:28:34 AM-11/02/97 10:28:34 AM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 10:28:34 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US First, it's patented, you MUST give him a % of profits . You should have asked him before sending it. You might want to read "BEAM Technology is not a public domain". Buying the components from mail order costs ALOT more than going to a component store. To do this succesfully you need to buy stuffin the 10,000, then you save Blah , and put the prices very reasonable, and make a small gain (over 100%). You really put yourself in a sticky situation, talk to mark about it, I Have decided to put together motor driver kits to be used with Biocore's, microcores and other applications. The kit will use three stacked 74XX245's to controll motors. I was looking for any suggestion's anyone had for things I might look to including in the kit. I will put up a web page soon giving more information. Possibly after creating the motor driver kits I may offer Microcore kits, however I'm going to try to start simple. The kit will be aimed twards begginers but I may also source 74XX245 chips, I can obtain the 74ALS245 chip for under 40cents each. Pretty good. Please e-mail me with any suggestions. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256543.00681AE9; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 10:57:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA07917 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 10:47:21 -0800 Received: from m3.sprynet.com (m3.sprynet.com [165.121.2.55]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA19622 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 12:44:44 -0600 Received: from dan-s-p166 (ad03-107.arl.compuserve.com [199.174.130.107]) by m3.sprynet.com (8.6.12/8.6.12) with ESMTP id KAA22345 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 10:47:48 -0800 Message-Id: <199711021847.KAA22345@m3.sprynet.com> From: "Dan Stormont" To: Subject: Re: feeler? Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 11:42:03 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dstormon@sprynet.com From: dstormon@sprynet.com Subject: Re: feeler? PostedDate: 11/02/97 10:42:03 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 10:57:12 AM-11/02/97 10:57:13 AM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 10:57:13 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Only problem I could see with this design is that most variable resistors tend to be very "stiff". I doubt if the typical BEAMbot would have enough mass to move the resistor via the feeler. Cool idea though, and would probably work fairly well on a larger robot (i.e., something the size of a micromouse or larger). Dan Stormont stormontd@acm.org ---------- > From: Cybermurf@aol.com > To: beam@webconn.com > Subject: feeler? > Date: Sunday, October 26, 1997 5:42 PM > > i think i have designed a "feeler" that will locate something along an X an Y > axis. any feedback would be appriciated > thanks > Mike O'Gorman > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256543.00799857; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 14:08:08 -0800 Received: from mail2.noc.netcom.net (mail2.noc.netcom.net [199.183.9.3]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA24949 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 13:58:29 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by mail2.noc.netcom.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA09536 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 14:11:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA19898 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 15:44:36 -0600 Received: from ts83ip4.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA59266 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 14:42:31 -0700 Received: by ts83ip4.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCE7A6.216B5180@ts83ip4.cadvision.com>; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 15:43:57 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCE7A6.216B5180@ts83ip4.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 15:43:54 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. PostedDate: 11/02/97 02:43:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 02:08:18 PM-11/02/97 02:08:19 PM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 02:08:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US from Dennisom fwd from me.. This question goes out to Mark Tilden, which after Hyndman scared me to DEATH that lawyers would eat my bowls by morning, I wanted to check to make sure, If I made a kit, with ONLY three 74hc245's some wire and a PCB from radio shack, and sold it with documentation would I be in trouble? All I'm trying to do is set up a kit for driving motors with high current logic drivers so people who are new can easilly build it and get it working. (for things like Pic's tiny robots or mabey Microcore's) I wouldn't even need to mention that you could use it with BEAM technology. Just a driver kit. I haven't read your full patent yet, but how far does it really extend? Does it include stuff like long duration timers, used in a Microcore pulse neutralization circuit using a cap, and resistors? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.000475E1; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 16:48:43 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA25093 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 16:39:03 -0800 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA20077 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 18:01:09 -0600 Received: from [206.25.228.220] (dialup01.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.220]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA19619; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 19:19:30 -0500 Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 19:19:30 -0500 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BCE7A6.216B5180@ts83ip4.cadvision.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Hyndman , "'beam@webconn.com'" From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. SMTPOriginator: bushbo@xtdl.com From: bushbo@xtdl.com Subject: Re: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. PostedDate: 11/02/97 04:19:30 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 04:48:54 PM-11/02/97 04:48:55 PM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 04:48:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >If I made a kit, with ONLY three 74hc245's some wire and a PCB from radio >shack, and sold it with documentation would I be in trouble? Drivers, I believe are not covered under Tilden's patent from my understanding of the patent. Using the 74x245 is just another example of using tek for something it was never designed for. if someone wants a driver for a motor in a situation other than BEAM tek, they can find more powerful drivers elsewhere. >I haven't read your full patent yet, but how far does it really extend? I would suggest reading it to its extent to fully understand what is patented and what is not. Besides, alot of good info is packed into that document. >Does it include stuff like long duration timers, used in a Microcore pulse >neutralization circuit using a cap, and resistors? PNCs are covered under claim 12. And timers/oscillators that activate a PNC, is a basic device. the key is the PNC. Cheers, Brian --- brian o bush, gearhead "the moment of terror is the beginning of life." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Robotics FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.000A6ED1; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 17:53:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA01748 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 17:44:17 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA20281 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 19:41:43 -0600 Received: from ts20-13.tor.istar.ca [204.191.150.156] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xSBUe-0005w1-00; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 20:39:53 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 02 Nov 1997 20:45:35 -0500 To: Dennison , BEAM From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: 74HC/ALS245 Motor dirver kits. PostedDate: 11/02/97 05:45:35 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 05:54:08 PM-11/02/97 05:54:09 PM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 05:54:09 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 12:15 PM 11/2/97 -0500, Dennison wrote: >I Have decided to put together motor driver kits to be used with Biocore's, >microcores and other applications. The kit will use three stacked 74XX245's >to controll motors. I was looking for any suggestion's anyone had for >things I might look to including in the kit. I will put up a web page soon >giving more information. Possibly after creating the motor driver kits I >may offer Microcore kits, however I'm going to try to start simple. The kit >will be aimed twards begginers but I may also source 74XX245 chips, I can >obtain the 74ALS245 chip for under 40cents each. Pretty good. Please e-mail >me with any suggestions. > > >Dennison [Devin Hyndman did not maintain the attribution information here, but I am presuming that all of the following is also from 'Dennison'] At 03:43 PM 11/2/97 -0700, Hyndman wrote: >from Dennisom fwd from me.. > >This question goes out to Mark Tilden, which after Hyndman scared me to >DEATH that lawyers would eat my bowls by morning, I wanted to check to make >sure, > >If I made a kit, with ONLY three 74hc245's some wire and a PCB from radio >shack, and sold it with documentation would I be in trouble? > >All I'm trying to do is set up a kit for driving motors with high current >logic drivers so people who are new can easilly build it and get it >working. (for things like Pic's tiny robots or mabey Microcore's) I >wouldn't even need to mention that you could use it with BEAM technology. >Just a driver kit. > >I haven't read your full patent yet, but how far does it really extend? >Does it include stuff like long duration timers, used in a Microcore pulse >neutralization circuit using a cap, and resistors? > >Dennison Dear Dennison; I think that there are a few more questions that you will want answered, before you get into the kit-biz, Dennison. Is there a need for the kit? Is it needed because there is no other source for the parts? . . .for small quantities? . . .for the instructions? How much will it cost? . . .for packaging? ...for instruction manuals? . . .postage? . . .phone lines? . . .fax machine? . . .credit card processing? Perhaps the best next step would be for you to get a basic business course or two under your belt. You are paying attention in class, right? :-) Not spending *too much* time with your robots? If you find the general purpose business class doesn't address the specific questions that you have, try cornering your instructor after class or during study-hall. Now there are others on this list with way more business-savvy than I have, perhaps they can steer you in the right direction. If you want my opinion ("what the heck; I'm already typing. :-) ) I think that your suggested kit has a few problems. Your kit will have a small number of commonly available parts, plus instructions. Essentially you are selling the instructions, which are available elsewhere. The development and printing cost of good documentaion may equal the cost (to you) of the parts. The packaging and postage are *each* likely to be more expensive than the parts. You are aiming your kit at beginners; they will want support by phone. They will send you "returns" that are defective (or that they broke :-) ) Make sure that you consider as many problems as possible before you offer your kit for sale. Some people might see your "offer for sale" and their mailling you a cheque as a contract, and if you don't deliver what they are expecting they could release the laywers. All of this having been said (and said rather poorly, if I may say so.) it is nice that you want to do something to help beginners. How is your school robotics club doing? That is an ideal forum for helping beginners; they bring their own goodies that you can trade for, and you get to build stuff for yourself too. Good luck, and Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.00195A85; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 20:36:55 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03409 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 20:27:10 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA20503 for ; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 22:10:38 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA23777; Sun, 2 Nov 1997 23:09:13 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711030409.XAA23777@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp13.buffnet.net(205.246.19.120) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma014558; Sun, 2 Nov 97 23:08:48 -0500 From: Dennison To: Hyndman , "'beam@webconn.com'" , "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Specific PNC for uP reset Date: Sun, 2 Nov 1997 23:17:12 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Specific PNC for uP reset PostedDate: 11/02/97 08:17:12 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com,beam@webconn.com,bushbo@xtdl.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/02/97 08:37:14 PM-11/02/97 08:37:15 PM DeliveredDate: 11/02/97 08:37:15 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > >Does it include stuff like long duration timers, used in a Microcore pulse > >neutralization circuit using a cap, and resistors? > > PNCs are covered under claim 12. And timers/oscillators that activate a > PNC, is a basic device. the key is the PNC. > To be a little more specific, the reset circuit for Jan Axelson's 8052-basic computer, described by her in her "The Microcontroller Idea Book" which some of you may have is the same as the PNC. This brings up and interesting question as to how patents and copyrights etc... can interact. Who become's the owner? and which has precident over the other? It could have legal ramifications, who knows. Oh well. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.00560578; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 07:39:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA16023 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 07:29:50 -0800 Received: from oasis.novia.net (oasis.novia.net [204.248.24.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA20983 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:37:41 -0600 Received: from jlz.mylink.net (208-149-120-148.novia.net [208.149.120.148]) by oasis.novia.net (8.8.7/Novia) with SMTP id IAA27498; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:35:32 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971103084336.006c0b14@pop.novia.net> X-Sender: jlz@pop.novia.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 08:43:36 -0600 To: Steven Bolt , beam@webconn.com From: John Leo Zimmer Subject: A Robot Attracted to the Cricket Species Gryllus bimaculatus In-Reply-To: References: <19971031.060942.7583.0.nytwulf@juno.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: jlz@novia.net From: jlz@novia.net Subject: A Robot Attracted to the Cricket Species Gryllus bimaculatus PostedDate: 11/03/97 06:43:36 AM SendTo: sbolt@xs4all.nl,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 07:39:41 AM-11/03/97 07:39:42 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 07:39:42 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- At 12:10 31 10 97 +0100, Steven Bolt wrote: >On Fri, 31 Oct 1997, Earik Wulf wrote: > >> [ cricket bot ] > >...a recent and detailed paper about the cricket bot can be >found at: > > ftp://ftp.daimi.aau.dk//pub/stud/hhl/Lund.gryllus.ps.Z > >It's a clear and well illustrated 10 page document. Should aid >development of sound tracking. > Thanks for finding this great article. I think this is really worth looking into. I was most struck by the complexity and size of the circuit boards sitting atop the Khepera robot, Fig 2, compared to the size of a cricket. The block diagram describing the circuit along with the text also describes the physical device the cricket uses. The Beam approach seems to me to try replacing these circuits with a physical "ear" properly tuned to Nv inputs. Seems that the much discussed interaction between legs and Microcore may directly apply here. jlz... still mostly lurking, but my breadboard is running, too. -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP for Personal Privacy 5.0 iQCVAwUBNF3irT9/ILSC7Jt1AQElHAQAnbZ2oHycAr1eEgywnn24M7DVpKoe2xD9 sCo1b2YSlBb2MoUZUCk2VqipUGNLIjmvbV3qgTfUk4sYTtuoicmrdA54ScSgNQGj CbGplsmG6Y7mdSgrU9rvLfMVPKrrNWpSmWmcdNLEaJh30mV2KBZoKElWjpsrN5nH w/Z5umDN9dY= =oOft -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.005A05E1; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:23:17 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA10542 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 08:13:35 -0800 Received: from fh101.infi.net (fh101.infi.net [208.131.160.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA21113 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 09:37:26 -0600 Received: from dcp1-47.nc5.infi.net (dcp1-47.nc5.infi.net [207.2.241.47]) by fh101.infi.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA28112 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:35:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19971103093744.438faa0e@nc5.infi.net> X-Sender: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 03 Nov 1997 09:37:44 To: beam@webconn.com From: Terry Newton Subject: Re: Specific PNC for uP reset In-Reply-To: <199711030409.XAA23777@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net From: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net Subject: Re: Specific PNC for uP reset PostedDate: 11/03/97 01:37:44 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 08:23:27 AM-11/03/97 08:23:27 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 08:23:27 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 11:17 PM 11/2/97 -0500, Dennison wrote: >To be a little more specific, the reset circuit for Jan Axelson's >8052-basic computer, described by her in her "The Microcontroller Idea >Book" which some of you may have is the same as the PNC. This brings up and >interesting question as to how patents and copyrights etc... can interact. >Who become's the owner? and which has precident over the other? It could >have legal ramifications, who knows. Oh well. > >Dennison Actually, this is a very good question... I look forward to Mark's response. Nv/Nu circuits have existed since chips, they just didn't call them that. I made a bi-core back in '77, called it an LED flasher. A Nv/Nu element is just three components (well 2 1/6) if the inverter is treated as a single thing... can't get much simpler than that. Charging a cap thru a resister to a trigger has been the standard way to delay since I can remember (.. how else would it be done? cut and dried to me..), most of the elements of Nv Tech are nothing but Circuits 101. But that's not the point. This is all just my opinion... but it's not the circuits themselves that matters, it's the topology and purpose that matters. The patent speaks of delay mechanisms connected together in a network for the purpose of driving motors to effect walking gates. Outside of that application they are just circuits and I don't think the patent is to prevent people from hooking up resistors and capacitors to make a delay, even though it is a Nu or Nv. Any way you hook it up it'll be one or the other (and if the circuit itself were patented, someone would have to make up a lot of meghenry-range coils :) It is only a neural element when the circuit is used to walk, otherwise it's just a delay. Likewise, I'd think *any* sort of delay element connected in rings for the purpose of walking, irregardless of the actual circuit or how common it was, *would* be covered by the patent, since what's patented is the ultra-cool effects that happen when delay units are connected in networks. Something like that. - Terry $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.0064AAFF; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:19:33 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA15190 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:09:48 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA21427 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 11:29:02 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-04.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.5]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id SAA11085; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:26:27 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:31:05 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: John Leo Zimmer cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: A Robot Attracted to the Cricket Species Gryllus bimaculatus In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19971103084336.006c0b14@pop.novia.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: A Robot Attracted to the Cricket Species Gryllus bimaculatus PostedDate: 11/03/97 09:31:05 AM SendTo: jlz@novia.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 10:19:49 AM-11/03/97 10:19:50 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 10:19:50 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Mon, 3 Nov 1997, John Leo Zimmer wrote: > > [ cricket bot ] > > > > ...a recent and detailed paper about the cricket bot can be > > found at: > > > > ftp://ftp.daimi.aau.dk//pub/stud/hhl/Lund.gryllus.ps.Z > > > > It's a clear and well illustrated 10 page document. Should aid > > development of sound tracking. > > > Thanks for finding this great article. > I think this is really worth looking into. > I was most struck by the complexity and size > of the circuit boards sitting atop the Khepera robot, Fig 2, > compared to the size of a cricket. > The block diagram describing the circuit along with the text > also describes the physical device the cricket uses. Some, if not most of the complexity arises from the designer's wish to have programmable delay lines and so on. A less flexible approach should result in simpler hardware. But Fig 2 does indeed look a bit top heavy :) > The Beam approach seems to me to try replacing these circuits > with a physical "ear" properly tuned to Nv inputs. Seems that > the much discussed interaction between legs and Microcore may > directly apply here. > > jlz... still mostly lurking, but my breadboard is running, too. I've done some investigating, and the `Spider's ear' is now past the desperation phase - I hope. Sound direction finding in the indoor environment is not at all easy. You've noticed that they ran their tests with the `bot starting no more than 2 meters from the sound source? As to the `physical ear' you speak of, well, if you can make that approach work, you will earn my deepest respect. For the time being I am aiming for a fairly simple electronic approach, with a little micro-controller (AT90S1200) doing the hardest bit... Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.00655878; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:26:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA19342 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:17:12 -0800 Received: from proxy.webconn.com (proxy.webconn.com [206.42.142.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA21571 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 11:56:02 -0600 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by proxy.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA22415 for ; Sat, 18 Oct 1997 22:45:10 -0500 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA24519 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:48:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA09277; Mon, 3 Nov 97 10:47:47 MST Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <01BCE7A6.216B5180@ts83ip4.cadvision.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:52:09 -0800 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Re: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Re: FW: Is using stacked 74xx245's patented. PostedDate: 11/03/97 10:52:09 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 10:27:09 AM-11/03/97 10:27:11 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 10:27:11 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >I haven't read your full patent yet, but how far does it really extend? >Does it include stuff like long duration timers, used in a Microcore pulse >neutralization circuit using a cap, and resistors? Hi. Once again, the Nv patent covers any self-sustaining loop of differentiator circuits used for control purposes. It does not cover filters, or delay lines, or drivers. However, the idea of stacked 245s is copyrighted, so if you sell it, please ask for permission, and give credit to the invention in your instructions. Again, if this is only for you and your friends, don't sweat it. If it's for Radio Shack, we talk more serious turkey. But seriously, stacked 245s is not a recommended practice nor a kit I would recommend selling. First of all, it's well beyond the specs of such devices, secondly, there are better driver chips and circuits out there that are cheaper and more reliable. 245s as drivers are only recommended for BEAM style interfaces where you are matching low current motors to Nv nets where you need a specific current bleed (based on the type and manufacturer of 245 chip) between both. Point is, the 245 idea is only as good as how well it works in prototyping applications. I would strongly disuade you from trying to sell it as a general driver circuit. It just doesn't have the yarbles. markt. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.00658611; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:28:54 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA20412 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:19:07 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA21583 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 11:58:14 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-15.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.16]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id SAA18164; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:56:09 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 19:00:51 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: Terry Newton cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Specific PNC for uP reset In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.16.19971103093744.438faa0e@nc5.infi.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Specific PNC for uP reset PostedDate: 11/03/97 10:00:51 AM SendTo: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 10:29:02 AM-11/03/97 10:29:03 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 10:29:03 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Mon, 3 Nov 1997, Terry Newton wrote: > The patent speaks of delay mechanisms connected together in a network > for the purpose of driving motors to effect walking gates. Outside of that > application they are just circuits and I don't think the patent is to > prevent people from hooking up resistors and capacitors to make a delay, > even though it is a Nu or Nv. Any way you hook it up it'll be one or > the other (and if the circuit itself were patented, someone would have > to make up a lot of meghenry-range coils :) It is only a neural element > when the circuit is used to walk, otherwise it's just a delay. Not exactly. Quoting the patent: The present invention further provides an autonomous device having at least one mechanical limb, comprising at least one servo motor attached to the limb to actuate motion thereof, The word `limb' is pretty general, also meaning `wing', or in the context of machinery, `wheel', or any other (electro)mechanical effector. The patent is intended to cover even such a thing as a solar engine powered butterfly, glued to your window and every now and then flapping its wings. > Likewise, I'd think *any* sort of delay element connected in rings for > the purpose of walking, irregardless of the actual circuit or how common > it was, *would* be covered by the patent, since what's patented is the > ultra-cool effects that happen when delay units are connected in networks. ...and used to control `limbs'. That bit is essential. A microcore used for any other purpose is not covered by the patent, as far as I can tell - though it depends a bit on how far the term `limb' can be stretched. Anyway, the patent isn't what really counts. It's just not done to commercialize someone else's idea without paying a fee. Mark T. recently used a microcore as `life support system' for a Tamagouchi (his mail from Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:36:41 -0700). So don't sell any kits for that fascinating purpose :) Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.006997E4; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 11:13:21 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA14924 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 11:03:41 -0800 Received: from quasar.newtonlabs.com (quasar.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.97]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA21895 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 12:51:33 -0600 Received: from bogomips.newtonlabs.com (rsargent@bogomips.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.108]) by quasar.newtonlabs.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id KAA31940; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:49:17 -0800 Received: (from rsargent@localhost) by bogomips.newtonlabs.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA05147; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:49:16 -0800 Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 10:49:16 -0800 Message-Id: <199711031849.KAA05147@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> From: Randy Sargent To: "Mark W. Tilden" cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: stacked 74xx245's SMTPOriginator: rsargent@newtonlabs.com From: rsargent@newtonlabs.com Subject: stacked 74xx245's PostedDate: 11/03/97 10:49:16 AM SendTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 11:13:25 AM-11/03/97 11:13:26 AM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 11:13:26 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi Mark, I think that the spirit in which you are licensing BEAM technology is great. Putting the money you make back into promoting BEAM is a very noble thing to do. Mark wrote: > However, the idea of stacked 245s is copyrighted, so if you sell it, please > ask for permission, and give credit to the invention in your instructions. > Again, if this is only for you and your friends, don't sweat it. If it's > for Radio Shack, we talk more serious turkey. As cool as this idea sounds, I don't think you have legal ground to stand on. Ideas aren't copyrightable. Stacking two chips together isn't copyrightable. (Nor are you the only person to have discovered stacking chips to improve current for driving motors.) On the other hand, as you say, giving credit for where you learned a technique is always the right thing, and everyone should be encouraged to do it. It's just that if my understanding of intellectual property is correct, anyone who wants is legally entitled to stack 245's all day long _without permission or license fees_, regardless of whether he/she gives attribution. It is today (and has always been) essentially impossible to build something without applying ideas you've learned from someone else. The last thing we want is to make folks paranoid about learning from and making use of other people's ideas. Ideas are not copyrightable. You have to _prove_ that your idea is both new and fairly unobvious in order to get legal protection for an idea (a patent), and this protection lasts for a much shorter time than does a copyright. Again, I don't mean to say that the spirit of what you're trying to do is wrong, just that this excellent mailing list of robotics inventors should not be misled about what is and is not legally protectable. -- Randy ---------------------------------------------------------------- Randy Sargent Newton Research Labs Senior Design Engineer Robotic Systems and Software rsargent@newtonlabs.com http://www.newtonlabs.com/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256544.0080A43B; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:25:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA14337 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:15:26 -0800 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA22434 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 16:31:58 -0600 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA01031; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:30:01 -0700 (MST) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA09887; Mon, 3 Nov 97 15:28:52 MST Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199711031849.KAA05147@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 15:33:14 -0800 To: Randy Sargent From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Re: stacked 74xx245's Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Re: stacked 74xx245's PostedDate: 11/03/97 03:33:14 PM SendTo: rsargent@newtonlabs.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 03:25:12 PM-11/03/97 03:25:14 PM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 03:25:14 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >On the other hand, as you say, giving credit for where you learned a >technique is always the right thing, and everyone should be encouraged to >do it. It's just that if my understanding of intellectual property is >correct, anyone who wants is legally entitled to stack 245's all day long >_without permission or license fees_, regardless of whether he/she gives >attribution. After checking, you're perfectly correct of course. Still, I'd recommend against marketing the idea, though it is a good one to use if your design can warrent it. markt. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256545.000FFC8E; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:54:36 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA17702 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 18:44:49 -0800 Received: from dns.img.net (dns.img.net [207.34.144.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA23007 for ; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 19:49:50 -0600 Received: from port109.img.net ([207.34.144.217]) by dns.img.net (Netscape Mail Server v1.1) with SMTP id AAA447; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:54:32 -0800 Received: by port109.img.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BCE881.46316A00@port109.img.net>; Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:52:38 -0800 Message-ID: <01BCE881.46316A00@port109.img.net> From: "Mairs, T." To: "'Randy Sargent'" , "Mark W. Tilden" Cc: "beam@webconn.com" Subject: RE: stacked 74xx245's Date: Mon, 3 Nov 1997 17:51:07 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: tmairs@img.net From: tmairs@img.net Subject: RE: stacked 74xx245's PostedDate: 11/03/97 05:51:07 PM SendTo: rsargent@newtonlabs.com,mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/03/97 06:54:45 PM-11/03/97 06:54:45 PM DeliveredDate: 11/03/97 06:54:45 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I am finding this thread particularly interesting, and I feel I must add my 2 cents worth. Randy is correct, Ideas cannot be copyrighted, but It is my understanding that indeed, ideas can be patented - It is called a conceptual patent, and you will find them everywhere. Theoretically, you are supposed to pay a royalty each time you use the patent holders concept, although in some cases this is simply impossible. For instance if there were (and I think there is) a conceptual patent on the idea of using an x-y tracking system to adjust the cursor position on your computer monitor, then every mouse, joystick, and trackball made would have to allow a cost factor to pay for the royalty. HOWEVER ! - if you create a new device using the concepts in a way that is not covered in the conceptual patent, or is far enough removed from the original idea, then you may be issued a modified design patent which essentially overrides any royalties or rights due the original patent holder. Phew!.. How's that for a mouthful. Having said that, I think it is great that Mark is promoting the technology, and encouraging developers to work with the patent. Many inventors are not as open with their ideas or support. Thanks Mark. Tom Mairs - Aasland Technologies - Penticton, BC - Canada Tmairs@img.net - Aasland@img.net - TAMairs@okanagan.bc.ca - http://www.img.net/aasland Personal Web Support Okanagan University Corp. Web Site * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * -----Original Message----- From: Randy Sargent [SMTP:rsargent@newtonlabs.com] Sent: Monday, November 03, 1997 10:49 AM To: Mark W. Tilden Cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: stacked 74xx245's Hi Mark, I think that the spirit in which you are licensing BEAM technology is great. Putting the money you make back into promoting BEAM is a very noble thing to do. Mark wrote: > However, the idea of stacked 245s is copyrighted, so if you sell it, please > ask for permission, and give credit to the invention in your instructions. > Again, if this is only for you and your friends, don't sweat it. If it's > for Radio Shack, we talk more serious turkey. As cool as this idea sounds, I don't think you have legal ground to stand on. Ideas aren't copyrightable. Stacking two chips together isn't copyrightable. (Nor are you the only person to have discovered stacking chips to improve current for driving motors.) On the other hand, as you say, giving credit for where you learned a technique is always the right thing, and everyone should be encouraged to do it. It's just that if my understanding of intellectual property is correct, anyone who wants is legally entitled to stack 245's all day long _without permission or license fees_, regardless of whether he/she gives attribution. It is today (and has always been) essentially impossible to build something without applying ideas you've learned from someone else. The last thing we want is to make folks paranoid about learning from and making use of other people's ideas. Ideas are not copyrightable. You have to _prove_ that your idea is both new and fairly unobvious in order to get legal protection for an idea (a patent), and this protection lasts for a much shorter time than does a copyright. Again, I don't mean to say that the spirit of what you're trying to do is wrong, just that this excellent mailing list of robotics inventors should not be misled about what is and is not legally protectable. -- Randy ---------------------------------------------------------------- Randy Sargent Newton Research Labs Senior Design Engineer Robotic Systems and Software rsargent@newtonlabs.com http://www.newtonlabs.com/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256545.006BF9C6; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 11:39:22 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA05368 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 11:29:42 -0800 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA24080 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 12:46:31 -0600 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id NGS03580; Tue, 04 Nov 1997 13:42:16 EST To: beam@webconn.com Subject: commo thread Message-ID: <19971104.144028.8087.0.nytwulf@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,8 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Earik Wulf) Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 13:42:16 EST SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: commo thread PostedDate: 11/04/97 10:42:16 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 11:39:35 AM-11/04/97 11:39:35 AM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 11:39:35 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Subject: Re: Re[2]: the commo thread On Tue, 28 Oct 97 07:05:42 cam_bremner@vtech.com.hk writes:>A comparator looks at the voltage present on one pin, and compares it to the voltage >present on the other input pin. It's an on-off kind of device.> standard op-amp (324, 741, etc...) The output is proportional to the difference between >the input pins.both consepts will work nicely.. the comparitor will work good for compairing the bat voltage to the solar cell voltage.. where the op-amp could be used to locate the light between photo transistors... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.0017BCB7; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:19:16 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA17105 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:09:34 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA24790 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:01:26 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA04187 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:58:27 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711050358.WAA04187@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp28.buffnet.net(205.246.19.135) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma014972; Tue, 4 Nov 97 22:59:07 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: GearBox Frustration Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:07:27 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: GearBox Frustration PostedDate: 11/04/97 08:07:27 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 08:19:18 PM-11/04/97 08:19:20 PM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 08:19:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US *warning, Rant ahead.* Now, I don't know about anyone else, but I'm becoming really frustrated in looking for a good motor gearbox combination. Now befor I can be shot down as a lazy armchair type, I'll let out the facts. I've been looking, and hard. True, I don't have ton's of money at my disposal simply but still! I've ordered around looking for that elusive oven-timer unit. Uhhh, finding the OTU is even harder than building a Microcontroller. Many people may comment on how nice the MOvit, or Oirni (whatever) gearboxes are. BUt come on. They are horrible! To many people make cheap gearboxes! Not only are the motor's power gobbling low efficiency cast iron monsters, but they are so loud they almost hurt! I may seem like a trivial thing, but no robot is fun if it's three times as loud as a dishwasher. MOtors, Ok I've had some luck with motors. Not the best but decent. I have't sprung for a Pager motor yet (and I may never) because they are $10 and thats alot. Don't worry I'm not criticising pager motor pricing. Lucky i've been into surplus for long enough to understand pricing. You CANT get motors like that cheaper. That's that. The prescision that goes into the motor is basically what you pay for. I tried to get samples of the ultra tinny motors (from the web page that has a motor dwarfed by a lady bug) I was hoping for a free sample. The sample cost $50!, oh well. I wouldn't have bought it for that much. Back to gearboxes... I'm just having no luck, back in the days befor my computer crashed someone e-mailled me with info on a gearbox arangment that was like a gods gift. It had brass gears, really small, worked great with pager motors (wasen't an otu) and it was common. Unfortunatly he wanted to wait before announcing it, so that he could build a web page that had all the information about it. That way he could direct the stream of astounded beamers to his web page. That was a long time ago. I've had a few small success with wind up toys. They do have great tiny gear set's. The only problem is that there are so many types that even if you buy two of the same thing, you can still open them up only to find completly diffrent gearsets. Sigh... I"ve take apart so many spring loaded gear reduction thingys my eye's are blurry. It's like I'm riding a car thats powered by luck, and I'm running on empty. *End rant* Oh well. I'll keep looking. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.001ACEC9; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:52:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA17573 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:43:01 -0800 Received: from timbuk.cray.com (timbuk-fddi.cray.com [128.162.8.102]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA24996 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:41:03 -0600 Received: from ironwood.cray.com (root@ironwood-fddi.cray.com [128.162.21.36]) by timbuk.cray.com (8.8.7/CRI-gate-news-1.3) with ESMTP id WAA29912; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:27:36 -0600 (CST) Received: from esgi051.cray.com (esgi051 [128.162.105.161]) by ironwood.cray.com (8.8.4/CRI-ironwood-news-1.0) with ESMTP id WAA07174; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:27:34 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Dalton Received: by esgi051.cray.com (8.8.0/btd-b3) id EAA08275; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 04:27:33 GMT Message-Id: <199711050427.EAA08275@esgi051.cray.com> Subject: Re: GearBox Frustration To: dennlill@buffnet.net (Dennison) Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:27:33 -0600 (CST) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <199711050358.WAA04187@buffnet4.buffnet.net> from "Dennison" at Nov 4, 97 11:07:27 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24-CRI-d] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mwd@cray.com From: mwd@cray.com Subject: Re: GearBox Frustration PostedDate: 11/04/97 08:27:33 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 08:52:51 PM-11/04/97 08:52:52 PM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 08:52:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Let me know what you need. efficiency and gear ratio. I can usually find something.. 1. Ideal, efficient motor with a decent gear box. I know where to escaps (gearbox do have a plastic gear and can be modified). $20/each Escap with gearbox (2048:1 gear ratio, yeah to much) $10/each Just the motor $10/each Just the gearbox They are at a local surplus store. This is what they cost at the store. 2. All metal gear gearbox with a junky motor.. (I may have a extra) But you will need to look at surplus magazines and surplus stores normally. These were the ones that were in Marlin P. Jones $6.95 motors-gearbox, the motor is not great all metal gears. I can usually find some motors with gearboxes (replace the motor with a pager motor). 3. Stove timers - interface with pager motor, you will need to recycle like go to a junk yard/repair shop. I will start looking again. Let me know what you need and I will look. Mark -- Mark Dalton CH3-S-CH2 H H O H SGI/Cray Research | | | \ | Eagan, MN 55121 CH2-C-COO //\ ---C--CH2-C-COO C-CH2-C-COO mwd@cray.com | | || || | // | NH3 \\/ \ / CH NH3 O NH3 NH My home page: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/mwd.html BEAM Robotics: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html WWW Cell Bio. course: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/cell.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.00240520; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:33:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA18981 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:23:43 -0800 Received: from isis.interpac.net (isis.interpac.net [206.154.202.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA25268 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 00:06:35 -0600 Received: from [206.154.202.12] (ts1-s3.interpac.net [206.154.202.12]) by isis.interpac.net (8.8.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA00203 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:04:25 -1000 (HST) X-Sender: clayton@interpac.net (Unverified) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 20:05:57 -1000 To: beam@webconn.com (BEAM) From: clayton@interpac.net (Clayton Turnbull) Subject: Science Fair circut Q SMTPOriginator: clayton@interpac.net From: clayton@interpac.net Subject: Science Fair circut Q PostedDate: 11/04/97 10:05:57 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 10:33:31 PM-11/04/97 10:33:32 PM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 10:33:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello I am using some of the BEAM concept in my project and have a few questions about it. First off I want to have 5 solar cells and 5 motors. I need to make a circut that will take all the power from all the cells and figure out which one had the most power and then use all the power on a particular motor. I also want to know if I can run the pager moter off a sc 37x33 cell. What cap should I use. Thank you!!! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.0025683E; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:48:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA19185 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 22:38:45 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA25271 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 00:06:54 -0600 Received: from sb2 (ts53ip137.cadvision.com [207.228.73.137]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id XAA88862; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:03:23 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971104230117.00ae91d0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 04 Nov 1997 23:01:17 -0700 To: Mark Dalton , dennlill@buffnet.net (Dennison) From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: GearBox Frustration Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <199711050427.EAA08275@esgi051.cray.com> References: <199711050358.WAA04187@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="=====================_878734877==_" $FILE: SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: GearBox Frustration PostedDate: 11/04/97 10:01:17 PM SendTo: mwd@cray.com,dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 10:48:40 PM-11/04/97 10:48:41 PM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 10:48:41 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:27 PM 11/4/1997 -0600, Mark Dalton wrote: > 2. All metal gear gearbox with a junky motor.. > (I may have a extra) But you will need to look at surplus magazines > and surplus stores normally. > > These were the ones that were in Marlin P. Jones > $6.95 motors-gearbox, the motor is not great all metal gears. > I can usually find some motors with gearboxes (replace the motor with > a pager motor). Ah, the rant section about the gearmotors could be about these units. I've successfully stripped the motor off the gearmotors and replaced them with pager motors. They're very nice after you ditch the lousy motor. We're looking into getting ahold of the gearheads by themselves, but it seems that the WHOLE CRAPPY GEARMOTOR is worth $25/ea in quantities of 1250! YEEEEOUCH! Well, we'll see what happens. In the meanwhile, here's a TURBOT I *just* finished using the gearbox mounted on a pager motor. Haven't explored all the behaviours yet, but WAHOO! I haven't built anything totally new for ages. -Dave - pturbot.jpg -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.002B3239; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:51:49 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA19754 for ; Tue, 4 Nov 1997 23:42:01 -0800 Received: from invfacty.factory.com (invfacty.factory.com [199.183.47.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA25576 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 01:35:59 -0600 Received: from [199.183.47.133] by invfacty.factory.com with SMTP (5.65/1.2-eef) id AA02320; Wed, 5 Nov 97 02:34:28 -0500 Received: from factory.com by bbsnet with UUCP ; Wed, 05 Nov 97 02:40:38 EDT To: BEAM@webconn.com Subject: stacked 74xx245's From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) Message-Id: <404484.500.uupcb@factory.com> Date: Tue, 4 Nov 97 23:19:00 -0500 Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York NY - 212-274-8110 Reply-To: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) SMTPOriginator: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com Subject: stacked 74xx245's PostedDate: 11/04/97 08:19:00 PM SendTo: BEAM@webconn.com ReplyTo: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/04/97 11:52:00 PM-11/04/97 11:52:01 PM DeliveredDate: 11/04/97 11:52:01 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >> However, the idea of stacked 245s is copyrighted, so if you sell it, please >> ask for permission, and give credit to the invention in your instructions. >> Again, if this is only for you and your friends, don't sweat it. If it's >> for Radio Shack, we talk more serious turkey. >As cool as this idea sounds, I don't think you have legal ground to stand >on. Ideas aren't copyrightable. Stacking two chips together isn't >copyrightable. (Nor are you the only person to have discovered stacking >chips to improve current for driving motors.) Just to throw in my 2c, parallelled drivers have been around at least as long since the 74C00-family of chips, 'cause my ancient NatSemi databook describes this in AN-77 (app-note 77), to use parallelled outputs to increase drive current. Also, I believe it's HEXFETs (IR?), SenseFETs (Motorola), and VMOS in general (again, IR?) which massively parallels small FETs to make it look like a bigmofo FET which can handle much larger currents and have a much lower series-resistance. And the idea of parallelling discrete transistors (whole chapters in textbooks describing "current-hogging" when using BJTs and the how to prevent it) has been around for ages. I think I'd actually go so far as to state that I doubt there's any FET which can handle 1A or more which *isn't* made up of smaller parallelled FETs. Soooo, my final take on the matter is that parallelling gates for higher output currents isn't patented or even patentable, except maybe for special specific purposes, for example, the parallelling of logic gates to drive not a bus but a motor instead. That might be a novel approach no one else has taken, which might be given special consideration by the USPO. Dunno, and not having the text of any "copyright"[sic], I can't say /for sure/ one way or another whether or not it's protected. --- . SLMR 2.0 #..jw . Windows - the next best thing to sand in your hard disk. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256546.0045F2F0; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 04:44:01 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA21340 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 04:34:15 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA25900 for ; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 06:22:03 -0600 Received: from ts65-01.tor.istar.ca [204.191.147.96] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xT4RQ-0003cI-00; Wed, 5 Nov 1997 07:20:13 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 05 Nov 1997 07:25:24 -0500 To: clayton@interpac.net (Clayton Turnbull), beam@webconn.com (BEAM) From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Science Fair circut Q Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Science Fair circut Q PostedDate: 11/05/97 04:25:24 AM SendTo: clayton@interpac.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/05/97 04:44:07 AM-11/05/97 04:44:08 AM DeliveredDate: 11/05/97 04:44:08 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 08:05 PM 11/4/97 -1000, Clayton Turnbull wrote: > Hello I am using some of the BEAM concept in my project and have a >few questions about it. First off I want to have 5 solar cells and 5 >motors. I need to make a circut that will take all the power from all the >cells and figure out which one had the most power and then use all the >power on a particular motor. I also want to know if I can run the pager >moter off a sc 37x33 cell. What cap should I use. Thank you!!! > That sounds like a PhotoPopper circuit, with extra elements. Well, sort of. The PhotoPopper uses a single solar cell and capacitor and two motors that are selected by two trigger circuits. The trigger circuit that triggers first gets the capacitors energy, the other side can try again later. You'll have to consider the biasing of your five node network. Why five? Let us know how it goes. Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256547.005FE4AA; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:27:24 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA13551 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:17:37 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA27609 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 10:51:28 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts62ip209.cadvision.com [207.228.74.209]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id JAA52326 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 09:49:04 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCEAA1.951A6320@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 10:48:57 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCEAA1.951A6320@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: "Solid State Century" Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 10:48:52 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: "Solid State Century" PostedDate: 11/06/97 09:48:52 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/06/97 09:27:29 AM-11/06/97 09:27:30 AM DeliveredDate: 11/06/97 09:27:30 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US There is a special issue of Scientific american about the past present and the future of the transistor. They do talk about processors, but there are more articles on IC's ... It could help alot of newbies to electronics figure out how they work. Good reading material Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.00254837; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 22:47:13 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA03794 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 22:37:29 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA28999 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 00:07:16 -0600 Received: from 206.206.184.241 ([206.206.184.241]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA27183 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 23:08:30 -0700 Message-ID: <34625B6E.6999@springercoop.com> Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 17:06:08 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Commo References: <3.0.1.32.19971023120959.00685ad8@internet.canadorec.on.ca> <19971026.105343.8087.5.nytwulf@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Commo PostedDate: 11/06/97 04:06:08 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/06/97 10:47:16 PM-11/06/97 10:47:17 PM DeliveredDate: 11/06/97 10:47:17 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US After reading all of the "commo" e-mails, I was curious to know if anyone has started to build anything yet. About a week befour the commo letters started, I started a simaler project using IR. There will be three small bots running of of a bicore and the Tilden H-bridge motor drivers. It will be solar and charge in the day and triger at night. I have one build except for part of the circuit. My soldering station broke last week so i'm waiting for a replacement (Another delay). I'm going to get a scanner soon so I can put photos of my progress on my web page! ____________________________________________________________________ The MASTER Builder $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.002A2A4E; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 23:40:33 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA05136 for ; Thu, 6 Nov 1997 23:30:49 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA29240 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 01:15:59 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-00.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.1]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id IAA23320; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 08:13:31 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 08:17:58 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Commo In-Reply-To: <34625B6E.6999@springercoop.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Commo PostedDate: 11/06/97 11:17:58 PM SendTo: cibern@springercoop.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/06/97 11:40:36 PM-11/06/97 11:40:37 PM DeliveredDate: 11/06/97 11:40:37 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Thu, 6 Nov 1997, Ian Bernstein(Synet) wrote: > After reading all of the "commo" e-mails, I was curious to know if > anyone has started to build anything yet. Well, I'm working on an `ear' for my little Spider (http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-spider.html) There is some hardware which I hope to seriously test this weekend. > About a week befour the commo letters started, I started a > simaler project using IR. There will be three small bots running > of of a bicore and the Tilden H-bridge motor drivers. It will be > solar and charge in the day and triger at night. What does `triger at night' mean? And in what way will the `bots cooperate? > I'm going to get a scanner soon so I can put photos of my > progress on my web page! Great! > ____________________________________________________________________ > The MASTER Builder No lack of confidence here :) Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.003A38D0; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 01:56:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA07717 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 01:47:00 -0800 Received: from baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca (baldric.CIS.McMaster.CA [130.113.64.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA29472 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 03:45:58 -0600 Received: from empA-port34.net.McMaster.CA by baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca with SMTP id AA29155 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Fri, 7 Nov 1997 04:43:29 -0500 Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 04:43:29 -0500 Message-Id: <199711070943.AA29155@baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca> X-Sender: philipjb@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca (Josh Philipson) Subject: SMTPOriginator: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca Subject: PostedDate: 11/07/97 01:43:29 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 01:56:54 AM-11/07/97 01:56:56 AM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 01:56:56 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello all. Haven't built a thing yet, but I thought I'd contribute anyway. I wanted you guys to know about an amazing movie that shows the true beauty and intricacy of what the insects you guys are questing for is really about. The cinematography is the most insane thing i've ever seen. **** (four stars) Knowing that you guys are probably non-linear thinkers you may get a few ideas of what the real Master Designer's solutions were - Mechanically (not to even mention the incredible detail in the behaviours (i.e. emergent behaviour and instinct - how do you emulate an ant with Nv's ....anyone..?Bueller... ************************************** /josh $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.005D2658; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 08:57:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA17978 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 08:47:42 -0800 Received: from okaxp1.okanagan.bc.ca (okaxp1.okanagan.bc.ca [192.136.115.7]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA29860 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 10:02:36 -0600 Received: from okk090.okanagan.bc.ca by okaxp1.okanagan.bc.ca; (5.65v3.2/1.1.8.2/18Aug96-1051AM) id AA16188; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 07:59:54 -0800 Received: by okmsml.ouc.bc.ca with Microsoft Mail id <34634944@okmsml.ouc.bc.ca>; Fri, 07 Nov 97 09:00:52 PST From: Tom Mairs To: "beam@webconn.com" , "'Josh Philipson'" Subject: RE: Date: Fri, 07 Nov 97 07:57:00 PST Message-Id: <34634944@okmsml.ouc.bc.ca> Encoding: 35 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 SMTPOriginator: tamairs@KLO2.OUC.bc.ca From: tamairs@KLO2.OUC.bc.ca Subject: RE: PostedDate: 11/07/97 07:57:00 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com,phililpjb@mcmaster.ca $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 08:57:30 AM-11/07/97 08:57:31 AM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 08:57:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US So let us know already.... - you didn't mention the name, or where we might find it. This sounds like an interesting piece of info and I want to know more. TOM ---------- From: Josh Philipson[SMTP:phililpjb@mcmaster.ca] Sent: Friday, November 07, 1997 1:43 AM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Hello all. Haven't built a thing yet, but I thought I'd contribute anyway. I wanted you guys to know about an amazing movie that shows the true beauty and intricacy of what the insects you guys are questing for is really about. The cinematography is the most insane thing i've ever seen. **** (four stars) Knowing that you guys are probably non-linear thinkers you may get a few ideas of what the real Master Designer's solutions were - Mechanically (not to even mention the incredible detail in the behaviours (i.e. emergent behaviour and instinct - how do you emulate an ant with Nv's ...anyone..?Bueller... ************************************** /josh $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.00727333; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:50:05 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA25577 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 12:40:13 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA30413 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:06:09 -0600 Received: from 206.206.184.243 ([206.206.184.243]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA29844 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:07:23 -0700 Message-ID: <3463203B.7EBE@springercoop.com> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 07:05:47 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: MESSAGES????? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: MESSAGES????? PostedDate: 11/07/97 06:05:47 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 12:50:18 PM-11/07/97 12:50:19 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 12:50:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US After I send a message to the list I recive about 4 messages like the one below. HOW COME? Subject: Warning: could not send message for past 4 hours Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 06:15:41 -0500 (EST) From: Mail Delivery Subsystem To: ********************************************** ** THIS IS A WARNING MESSAGE ONLY ** ** YOU DO NOT NEED TO RESEND YOUR MESSAGE ** ********************************************** The original message was received at Fri, 7 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) from root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5] ----- The following addresses had transient non-fatal errors ----- ----- Transcript of session follows ----- ... Deferred: Operation timed out with firewall.semiconductor.com. Warning: message still undelivered after 4 hours Will keep trying until message is 5 days old Reporting-MTA: dns; web.igs.net Arrival-Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) Final-Recipient: rfc822; thomas@semiconductor.com Action: delayed Status: 4.4.1 Remote-MTA: dns; firewall.semiconductor.com Last-Attempt-Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 06:15:41 -0500 (EST) Will-Retry-Until: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: Commo Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 17:06:08 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" To: beam@webconn.com References: 1 , 2 After reading all of the "commo" e-mails, I was curious to know if anyone has started to build anything yet. About a week befour the commo letters started, I started a simaler project using IR. There will be three small bots running of of a bicore and the Tilden H-bridge motor drivers. It will be solar and charge in the day and triger at night. I have one build except for part of the circuit. My soldering station broke last week so i'm waiting for a replacement (Another delay). I'm going to get a scanner soon so I can put photos of my progress on my web page! ____________________________________________________________________ The MASTER Builder $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.00766358; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:33:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA27168 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:23:23 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA30400 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:03:23 -0600 Received: from 206.206.184.243 ([206.206.184.243]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA29813; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:04:15 -0700 Message-ID: <34631F16.5BC7@springercoop.com> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 07:01:59 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steven Bolt CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Commo References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Re: Commo PostedDate: 11/07/97 06:01:59 AM SendTo: sbolt@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 01:33:16 PM-11/07/97 01:33:17 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 01:33:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Steven Bolt wrote: > What does `triger at night' mean? It uses marks new solar engine. The bots sit all day and collect a charge in a PANISONIC 3V rechargable battery and a .47F cap. When it gets dark the voltage in the solarcell drops, when the voltage is below that of the battery a transister turns on the circuit on and it moves untill the charge runs out. >And in what way will the `bots cooperate? Not sure? When i'm done i'll have more info. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256548.00770194; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:39:51 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA27432 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 13:30:06 -0800 Received: from baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca (baldric.CIS.McMaster.CA [130.113.64.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA30407 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 14:04:40 -0600 Received: from empB-port31.net.McMaster.CA by baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca with SMTP id AA08033 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:02:07 -0500 Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:02:07 -0500 Message-Id: <199711072002.AA08033@baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca> X-Sender: philipjb@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca (Josh Philipson) Subject: RE: SMTPOriginator: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca Subject: RE: PostedDate: 11/07/97 12:02:07 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 01:39:58 PM-11/07/97 01:39:59 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 01:39:59 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Sorry - the name of the flick IS ------->> " Microcosmos" You should be able to rent it now. It was filmed in late 96 i think and should just be coming to a video store near you > >So let us know already.... - you didn't mention the name, or where we >might find it. This sounds like an interesting piece of info and I want >to know more. > >TOM > > ---------- >From: Josh Philipson[SMTP:phililpjb@mcmaster.ca] >Sent: Friday, November 07, 1997 1:43 AM >To: beam@webconn.com >Subject: > >Hello all. > >Haven't built a thing yet, but I thought I'd contribute anyway. > >I wanted you guys to know about an amazing movie that shows the true >beauty >and intricacy of what the insects you guys are questing for is really >about. > >The cinematography is the most insane thing i've ever seen. **** (four >stars) > >Knowing that you guys are probably non-linear thinkers you may get a few >ideas of what the real Master Designer's solutions were - Mechanically > (not >to even mention the incredible detail in the behaviours (i.e. emergent >behaviour and instinct - how do you emulate an ant with Nv's >...anyone..?Bueller... > >************************************** >/josh > > > ************************************** /josh $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00053A9E; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:57:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA04602 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:46:58 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA31461 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:53:48 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts62ip209.cadvision.com [207.228.74.209]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA98810 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:51:18 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCEBA5.CF34B380@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:51:43 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCEBA5.CF34B380@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'cibern@springercoop.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: MESSAGES????? Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:51:39 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: MESSAGES????? PostedDate: 11/07/97 04:51:39 PM SendTo: cibern@springercoop.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 04:57:09 PM-11/07/97 04:57:11 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 04:57:12 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----Original Message----- From: Ian Bernstein(Synet) [SMTP:cibern@springercoop.com] Sent: Friday, November 07, 1997 7:06 AM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: MESSAGES????? After I send a message to the list I recive about 4 messages like the one below. HOW COME? Okay this mailing list has about 300 people on it, sometimes one's email server goes down and you get the error messages. And people have discontinued using that ISP. We all get the letters, just delete them in future, Mail boxes being full is the main reason. Subject: Warning: could not send message for past 4 hours Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 06:15:41 -0500 (EST) From: Mail Delivery Subsystem To: ********************************************** ** THIS IS A WARNING MESSAGE ONLY ** ** YOU DO NOT NEED TO RESEND YOUR MESSAGE ** ********************************************** The original message was received at Fri, 7 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) from root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5] ----- The following addresses had transient non-fatal errors ----- ----- Transcript of session follows ----- ... Deferred: Operation timed out with firewall.semiconductor.com. Warning: message still undelivered after 4 hours Will keep trying until message is 5 days old Reporting-MTA: dns; web.igs.net Arrival-Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) Final-Recipient: rfc822; thomas@semiconductor.com Action: delayed Status: 4.4.1 Remote-MTA: dns; firewall.semiconductor.com Last-Attempt-Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 06:15:41 -0500 (EST) Will-Retry-Until: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 02:06:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: Commo Date: Thu, 06 Nov 1997 17:06:08 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" To: beam@webconn.com References: 1 , 2 After reading all of the "commo" e-mails, I was curious to know if anyone has started to build anything yet. About a week befour the commo letters started, I started a simaler project using IR. There will be three small bots running of of a bicore and the Tilden H-bridge motor drivers. It will be solar and charge in the day and triger at night. I have one build except for part of the circuit. My soldering station broke last week so i'm waiting for a replacement (Another delay). I'm going to get a scanner soon so I can put photos of my progress on my web page! ____________________________________________________________________ The MASTER Builder $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00062922; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 17:07:17 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA05020 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:57:32 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA31505 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:10:26 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA09940 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:07:20 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711080007.TAA09940@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp28.buffnet.net(205.246.19.135) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma003781; Fri, 7 Nov 97 19:07:16 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Mac Se, gearbox. Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:15:47 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Mac Se, gearbox. PostedDate: 11/07/97 04:15:47 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 05:07:22 PM-11/07/97 05:07:23 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 05:07:23 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I don't know if I mentioned this befor, I got ahold of a Mac Se that fell on it's head (died, massive brain tramua) however the diskdrive was in good shape. Not for long I pronouced it dead after I tore it open. Inside because mac's automatically eject the disks they use a motor inside to eject. THIS MOTOR AND GEARBOX IS PERFECT!!!! Listen, It is low volt and amp (Don't knew precisly but it works on batteries) Anyway, it's perfect. Really high torque, easiily lifts it's own weight. AND batteries. But anyway, it's also virtually silent. A bot made with this could actually get around without being noticed. Problem: Only one Mac Se fell on it's head. I have know idea about how to get ahold of another (the disk drive only or just motor/gearbox combo) but it really is a gift from the gear box gods. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.000F7C1E; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:49:08 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA08293 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:39:23 -0800 Received: from smtp.interlog.com (smtp.interlog.com [198.53.145.6]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA31854 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:05:19 -0600 Received: from gold.interlog.com (gold.interlog.com [198.53.145.2]) by smtp.interlog.com (8.8.3/8.7.6) with ESMTP id VAA09264 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:02:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from martins760 (209-20-2-35.dialin.interlog.com [209.20.2.35]) by gold.interlog.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA03884 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:02:44 -0500 (EST) Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:03:52 -0500 Message-ID: <01BCEBC0.A6E05860.mmladek@interlog.com> From: Martin Mladek Reply-To: "mmladek@interlog.com" To: "'beam@WEBCONN.COM'" Subject: FW: Commo Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:03:16 -0500 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mmladek@interlog.com From: mmladek@interlog.com Subject: FW: Commo PostedDate: 11/07/97 06:03:16 PM SendTo: beam@WEBCONN.COM ReplyTo: mmladek@interlog.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 06:49:12 PM-11/07/97 06:49:13 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 06:49:13 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Does anyone have a schematic for this new solar engine online? I would like to try build one. I am not electronically inclined so I depend on other peoples designs. Honesty is the key. -----Original Message----- From: Ian Bernstein(Synet) [SMTP:cibern@springercoop.com] Sent: November 7, 1997 9:02 AM To: Steven Bolt Cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Commo Steven Bolt wrote: > What does `triger at night' mean? It uses marks new solar engine. The bots sit all day and collect a charge in a PANISONIC 3V rechargable battery and a .47F cap. When it gets dark the voltage in the solarcell drops, when the voltage is below that of the battery a transister turns on the circuit on and it moves untill the charge runs out. >And in what way will the `bots cooperate? Not sure? When i'm done i'll have more info. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.0010A48A; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:01:47 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA08717 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:52:02 -0800 Received: from isis.interpac.net (isis.interpac.net [206.154.202.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA31857 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:08:47 -0600 Received: from [206.154.202.46] (ts2-s37.interpac.net [206.154.202.46]) by isis.interpac.net (8.8.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA29315 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:06:18 -1000 (HST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 16:07:52 -1000 To: BEAM@webconn.com From: clayton@interpac.net (Clayton Turnbull) Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. SMTPOriginator: clayton@interpac.net From: clayton@interpac.net Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. PostedDate: 11/07/97 06:07:52 PM SendTo: BEAM@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 07:01:49 PM-11/07/97 07:01:50 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 07:01:50 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >I don't know if I mentioned this befor, > >I got ahold of a Mac Se that fell on it's head (died, massive brain tramua) >however the diskdrive was in good shape. Not for long I pronouced it dead >after I tore it open. > >Inside because mac's automatically eject the disks they use a motor inside >to eject. THIS MOTOR AND GEARBOX IS PERFECT!!!! Listen, It is low volt and >amp (Don't knew precisly but it works on batteries) Anyway, it's perfect. >Really high torque, easiily lifts it's own weight. AND batteries. But >anyway, it's also virtually silent. A bot made with this could actually get >around without being noticed. >Problem: Only one Mac Se fell on it's head. I have know idea about how to >get ahold of another (the disk drive only or just motor/gearbox combo) but >it really is a gift from the gear box gods. > >Dennison I'm trying to sell parts to a macII and a macII cx. I took apart the 800k drive from the II and found two motors. A stepper motor and a small motor. The stuff on the stepper motor says: SONY 1-541-326-11 Lot no. 2157n 08BJ-HO31 MINEBEA CO.,LTD Made in Japan $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00115328; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:09:14 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA09014 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 18:59:30 -0800 Received: from isis.interpac.net (isis.interpac.net [206.154.202.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA31836 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:57:33 -0600 Received: from [206.154.202.46] (ts2-s37.interpac.net [206.154.202.46]) by isis.interpac.net (8.8.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA28851 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:54:58 -1000 (HST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 7 Nov 1997 15:56:33 -1000 To: BEAM@webconn.com From: clayton@interpac.net (Clayton Turnbull) Subject: science fair SMTPOriginator: clayton@interpac.net From: clayton@interpac.net Subject: science fair PostedDate: 11/07/97 05:56:33 PM SendTo: BEAM@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 07:09:20 PM-11/07/97 07:09:21 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 07:09:21 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I think I wont do the 5 celled one but I'll do a three celled one. There is a pict of its plans and a description if you want it E-mail me. The science fair is in Hawaii. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00197717; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:38:08 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA12146 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:28:23 -0800 Received: from planet.eon.net (eeyore.eon.net [199.185.220.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA32248 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:41:13 -0600 Received: from roger ([198.80.53.168]) by planet.eon.net with SMTP id <149238-11228>; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 20:43:24 -0700 Message-ID: <3463DE56.688F@planet.eon.net> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 20:36:55 -0700 From: Roger Korus Organization: http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/5360/ X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Beam@webconn.com Subject: Linving Machines Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: korus@planet.eon.net From: korus@planet.eon.net Subject: Linving Machines PostedDate: 11/07/97 07:36:55 PM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 08:38:18 PM-11/07/97 08:38:18 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 08:38:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I was just wondering if anyone has a version of the Living Machines paper that is not in PDF format, because My PDF Viewer is rather messed up. Roger $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.001F29A6; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:40:22 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com (root@[206.206.184.226]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA14204 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 21:30:38 -0800 Received: from 206.206.184.246 ([206.206.184.246]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA31923; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:42:58 -0700 Message-ID: <3463A724.553C@springercoop.com> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 16:41:25 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Laurence Mayer CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Commo References: <88256548.0079C0D5.00@Athena.dl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Commo PostedDate: 11/07/97 03:41:25 PM SendTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 09:40:31 PM-11/07/97 09:40:31 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 09:40:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: Laurence Mayer wrote: >How do you guarantee the 'bot gets sunlight all day? >How does it know where to stop moving after night ends? It will not be able to. Maby when i'm done I can make some kind of a home base where they can go to when the charge gets low. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00251E91; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:45:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA16306 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:35:39 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA32523 for ; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 23:42:00 -0600 Received: from 206.206.184.246 ([206.206.184.246]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA31923; Fri, 7 Nov 1997 22:42:58 -0700 Message-ID: <3463A724.553C@springercoop.com> Date: Fri, 07 Nov 1997 16:41:25 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Laurence Mayer CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Commo References: <88256548.0079C0D5.00@Athena.dl.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Commo PostedDate: 11/07/97 03:41:25 PM SendTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/07/97 10:45:31 PM-11/07/97 10:45:32 PM DeliveredDate: 11/07/97 10:45:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: Laurence Mayer wrote: >How do you guarantee the 'bot gets sunlight all day? >How does it know where to stop moving after night ends? It will not be able to. Maby when i'm done I can make some kind of a home base where they can go to when the charge gets low. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.00614672; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 09:42:30 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA03004 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 09:32:34 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA00214 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 11:00:07 -0600 Received: from ts13-09.tor.istar.ca [204.191.149.181] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xUECd-0004YT-00; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 11:57:43 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 08 Nov 1997 12:02:38 -0500 To: Tom Mairs , "beam@webconn.com" , "'Josh Philipson'" From: Richard Weait Subject: RE: Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: RE: PostedDate: 11/08/97 09:02:38 AM SendTo: tamairs@KLO2.OUC.bc.ca,beam@webconn.com,phililpjb@mcmaster.ca $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/08/97 09:42:34 AM-11/08/97 09:42:35 AM DeliveredDate: 11/08/97 09:42:35 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:57 AM 11/7/97 PST, Tom Mairs wrote: > >So let us know already.... - you didn't mention the name, or where we >might find it. This sounds like an interesting piece of info and I want >to know more. > >TOM I had the same question, Tom, but I believe that the Subject: line is the title. "Microcosmos" Cheers, Richard $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256549.007E50F9; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 14:59:42 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA11582 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 14:49:57 -0800 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA00576 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 16:04:49 -0600 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.8/(cic-5, 10/28/97)) with SMTP id PAA24055 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 15:02:12 -0700 (MST) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA24066; Sat, 8 Nov 97 15:01:02 MST Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199711080007.TAA09940@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 15:05:27 -0800 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. PostedDate: 11/08/97 03:05:27 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/08/97 02:59:48 PM-11/08/97 02:59:49 PM DeliveredDate: 11/08/97 02:59:49 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >Inside because mac's automatically eject the disks they use a motor inside >to eject. THIS MOTOR AND GEARBOX IS PERFECT!!!! Listen, It is low volt and >amp (Don't knew precisly but it works on batteries) Anyway, it's perfect. >Really high torque, easiily lifts it's own weight. AND batteries. But >anyway, it's also virtually silent. A bot made with this could actually get >around without being noticed. It also has other features, not including: - A built in limit switch that can be adjusted by twisting the cog shaft on top of the main drive gear. - Some have a steel plate on top of the main drive gear that can be soldered to if it is burnished first. Very strong leg hold. Others just have the plastic gear alone. To mount wire legs on this, drilled mount holes and epoxy are recommended. - With the extraneous mounting plastic cropped off, it is a nice 1/2 inch high. - Can be driven from single chip 245 or 240 drive electronics. - Plastic case responds well to superglue. And as Dennison pointed out, it is very quiet and quite powerful enough for two-motor "scout" walker variants. If I were to built another 5 motor walkman, this is the motor I would recommend using. Check Mac repair houses and other sources for old mac floppy drives from the last decade. If someone finds a surplus source, please let the group know. markt. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.00129576; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:22:59 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA18519 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:13:13 -0800 From: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu Received: from pegasus.montclair.edu (pegasus.montclair.edu [130.68.20.55]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA01229 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 20:40:46 -0600 Received: from localhost (mccullou@localhost) by pegasus.montclair.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA07006 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:36:10 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:36:10 -0500 (EST) To: beam@webconn.com Subject: RE: In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu From: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu Subject: RE: PostedDate: 11/08/97 06:36:10 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/08/97 07:23:04 PM-11/08/97 07:23:06 PM DeliveredDate: 11/08/97 07:23:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US There is also a movie called "Alien Empire". I don't have any more info than that, but you might be able to track it down. -Dave McCullough $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.0014F48A; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:48:53 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA19111 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:39:04 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01285 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:08:52 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA04012; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 20:06:13 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCEC8A.45048F60@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:07:06 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCEC8A.45048F60@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:07:04 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: PostedDate: 11/08/97 08:07:04 PM SendTo: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/08/97 07:48:58 PM-11/08/97 07:48:59 PM DeliveredDate: 11/08/97 07:48:59 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Buy "Microcosmos" by Lynn Margulis, and Dorion Sagan. Published by University of California press. 273 pages. What's strange is I bought the book just before reading an email about it, I have two "library /study" because the books took up too much space. Need any help finding a book, I will prolly have it. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin -----Original Message----- From: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu [SMTP:mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu] Sent: Saturday, November 08, 1997 7:36 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: RE: There is also a movie called "Alien Empire". I don't have any more info than that, but you might be able to track it down. -Dave McCullough $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.00156BAD; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:53:58 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA19249 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 19:44:13 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA01297 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:17:08 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA09298 for ; Sat, 8 Nov 1997 22:13:55 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711090313.WAA09298@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp63.buffnet.net(205.246.19.242) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma008606; Sat, 8 Nov 97 22:14:27 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Re:MacSe Gearbox Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 22:23:00 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Re:MacSe Gearbox PostedDate: 11/08/97 07:23:00 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/08/97 07:54:05 PM-11/08/97 07:54:06 PM DeliveredDate: 11/08/97 07:54:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I put together a Two motor walker using one MacSe gearbox and one bad gearbox. I used point to point which surpsrisingly worked. Although I haven't had time to work out the gait I've found that my Bad gearbox is worse than I though. Oh well, Back on the hunt. To mount legs to My MacSe box I cut out a circle of PCB, drilled a small hole in it, (The output plate is notched) hotglued it to the output then soldered the legs directly to the PCB, really good strong hold. I checked a Mac parts house and unfortunatly you can only buy the whole drive, for twenty dollars. A bit high, but it IS a really nice motor. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.0053ED1F; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 07:16:41 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA00745 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 07:06:56 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA02090 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 08:10:27 -0600 Received: from ts10-03.tor.istar.ca [204.191.151.82] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xUY1u-00077G-00; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 09:07:59 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 09 Nov 1997 09:12:39 -0500 To: Roger Korus , Beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Living Machines Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Living Machines PostedDate: 11/09/97 06:12:39 AM SendTo: korus@planet.eon.net,Beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 07:16:47 AM-11/09/97 07:16:47 AM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 07:16:47 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 08:36 PM 11/7/97 -0700, Roger Korus wrote: >I was just wondering if anyone has a version of the Living Machines >paper that is not in PDF format, because My PDF Viewer is rather messed >up. > >Roger I have it in Postscript, if you prefer that. Ask and I shall send, or it might be on the lanl site. Cheers, Richard $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.0071E5A8; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 12:44:03 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA04902 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 12:34:18 -0800 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA02607 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 14:12:02 -0600 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id MAA08200 for beam@webconn.com; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 12:09:22 -0800 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199711092009.MAA08200@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? To: beam@webconn.com Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 12:09:22 -0800 (PST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? PostedDate: 11/09/97 12:09:22 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 12:44:06 PM-11/09/97 12:44:07 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 12:44:07 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm using a servo driven by a PIC (digressing.. "It works! It works! It's ALIVE!") -- does anyone know the input current to the Signal line on a servo? The servo works O.K., but should I buffer the output from the PIC? (The PIC16F84 can supply 25mA. And it isn't melting, yet.) I've looked everywhere for this info, even the hobby shops don't know. It is an Airtronics 94638 servo (same make as Airtronics 94102). Question #2. The Photopopper (just built one, everyone should get one of these) uses springs for sensors. Where can I get springs like this, or wire like this, so I can make my own antennae (sp)? I heard on comp.robotics that some have tried piano wire - is this a good solution? Memory wire? Minor plug: the Unofficial Beam Meta-URL List now has 237 Beam-type links (would everyone just stop making web pages? Just STOP!! :-). Browse over to www.ee.calpoly.edu/~jcline/beam-links.htm.. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.0073CC84; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 13:04:49 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA05182 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 12:55:04 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA02703 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 14:49:01 -0600 Received: from ts10-03.tor.istar.ca [204.191.146.103] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xUeFS-0005Iy-00; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:46:23 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 09 Nov 1997 15:51:06 -0500 To: Jonathan , beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? PostedDate: 11/09/97 12:51:06 PM SendTo: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 01:04:53 PM-11/09/97 01:04:53 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 01:04:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 12:09 PM 11/9/97 -0800, Jonathan wrote: > > I'm using a servo driven by a PIC (digressing.. "It >works! It works! It's ALIVE!") -- does anyone know the input Congratulations, Dr. Frankenstein! :-) >current to the Signal line on a servo? The servo works O.K., >but should I buffer the output from the PIC? (The PIC16F84 can >supply 25mA. And it isn't melting, yet.) I've looked everywhere >for this info, even the hobby shops don't know. It is an >Airtronics 94638 servo (same make as Airtronics 94102). > You say it works? And you want to change it? The 25 mA should be fine, but watch for the Total output current limit. Could you measure the signal current? Maybe with a scope and a 0.1 Ohm resistor in series with the signal. Get the trace from voltage across the resistor, and the voltage out of the PIC w.r.t ground. That should give you an idea. > Question #2. The Photopopper (just built one, everyone >should get one of these) uses springs for sensors. Where can I >get springs like this, or wire like this, so I can make my own >antennae (sp)? I heard on comp.robotics that some have tried >piano wire - is this a good solution? Memory wire? > Nice stuff, eh? That pretty gold coloured stuff is hard to find. I use guitar strings sometimes. "Memory wire?" ?!?!?!? Neat idea; whenever the 'bot is in the sunlight (and warms up) the sensor whiskers change shape! Hmmmm. . . Try it and let us know. That Nitenol _is_ fairly pricey though, and don't even ask about current requirements. :-) Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.00787698; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 13:55:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA05807 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 13:45:47 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02807 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:23:19 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA96720; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 14:20:01 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCED23.1E6F9A40@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:21:14 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCED23.1E6F9A40@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Jonathan'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:21:12 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? PostedDate: 11/09/97 02:21:12 PM SendTo: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 01:55:57 PM-11/09/97 01:55:57 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 01:55:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----Original Message----- From: Jonathan [SMTP:jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu] Sent: Sunday, November 09, 1997 1:09 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? I'm using a servo driven by a PIC (digressing.. "It works! It works! It's ALIVE!") -- does anyone know the input current to the Signal line on a servo? The servo works O.K., but should I buffer the output from the PIC? (The PIC16F84 can supply 25mA. And it isn't melting, yet.) I've looked everywhere for this info, even the hobby shops don't know. It is an Airtronics 94638 servo (same make as Airtronics 94102). The 1st wire is - next + next -. Very simple h-bridge Question #2. The Photopopper (just built one, everyone should get one of these) uses springs for sensors. Where can I get springs like this, or wire like this, so I can make my own antennae (sp)? I heard on comp.robotics that some have tried piano wire - is this a good solution? Memory wire? Okay , I've learned from the small-god that made that kit for you. Get Very fine about 30 maybe 32 Gauge, with a low ammount of copper. Try for a medium malibility metal wire. Find a screw driver with a round smooth shaft.. Tape one end of the wire to the handle. Put the screw driver into a chuck of a drill. Put it on a low speed setting, and just slowly let it wrap around. Minor plug: the Unofficial Beam Meta-URL List now has 237 Beam-type links (would everyone just stop making web pages? Just STOP!! :-). Browse over to www.ee.calpoly.edu/~jcline/beam-links.htm.. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654A.00838A61; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:56:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA07115 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 15:46:54 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA03106 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:05:29 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts60ip135.cadvision.com [207.228.74.135]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA08002; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 16:02:45 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCED31.79C89460@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:04:01 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCED31.79C89460@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Richard Weait'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:03:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? PostedDate: 11/09/97 04:03:59 PM SendTo: crs0274@inforamp.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 03:56:53 PM-11/09/97 03:56:53 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 03:56:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----Original Message----- From: Richard Weait [SMTP:crs0274@inforamp.net] Sent: Sunday, November 09, 1997 3:36 PM To: Hyndman; 'Jonathan' Cc: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? At 03:21 PM 11/9/97 -0700, Hyndman wrote: > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Jonathan [SMTP:jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu] >Sent: Sunday, November 09, 1997 1:09 PM >To: beam@webconn.com >Subject: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? > > > I'm using a servo driven by a PIC (digressing.. "It >works! It works! It's ALIVE!") -- does anyone know the input >current to the Signal line on a servo? The servo works O.K., >but should I buffer the output from the PIC? (The PIC16F84 can >supply 25mA. And it isn't melting, yet.) I've looked everywhere >for this info, even the hobby shops don't know. It is an >Airtronics 94638 servo (same make as Airtronics 94102). > >The 1st wire is - next + next -. Very simple h-bridge When you have un modifyed servos there are 3 wires The first line is + out The next wire is - In The last wire is + out There is a POT in the circuit, the pot gives resistance to either of the line out. The unmodifyed servo which gets turned back and forth by the motor. That creates a h-bridge like effect. Ex1) | \ - *Pot resistance causes the other current line to reverce the polarity of the motor... Make sense? What you do when you modify them is you take out the POT and PCB. And leave the gearbox and motor for our use. All the servo motors I use are futuba, so the set up may be different Sorry, Devin, I don't 'get' your response. What does '-,+,-' and 'h-bridge' have to do with the current required to drive the signal line on a standard servo? Are we both responding to the same question? It sounds to me like you are answering a question about driving a modified servo (DC gearmotor) with an h-bridge, but even so that is not terribly clear. [snip] > "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654B.000793E3; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:22:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA07926 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:12:54 -0800 Received: from mail.istar.ca (mail1.toronto.istar.net [209.89.75.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA03224 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 18:27:16 -0600 Received: from ts10-03.tor.istar.ca [204.191.150.155] by mail.istar.ca with smtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xUhei-0007Hn-00; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 19:24:41 -0500 X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 09 Nov 1997 19:29:28 -0500 To: Hyndman From: Richard Weait Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? Cc: beam@webconn.com Message-Id: SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: RE: Servo specs & antennae, anyone? PostedDate: 11/09/97 04:29:28 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 05:22:56 PM-11/09/97 05:22:57 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 05:22:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:03 PM 11/9/97 -0700, Hyndman wrote: [snip] >When you have un modifyed servos there are 3 wires >The first line is + out >The next wire is - In >The last wire is + out >There is a POT in the circuit, the pot gives resistance to either of the line out. The unmodifyed servo which gets turned back and forth by the motor. That creates a h-bridge like effect. >Ex1) | \ - *Pot resistance causes the other current line to reverce the polarity of the motor... > >Make sense? > >What you do when you modify them is you take out the POT and PCB. And leave the gearbox and motor for our use. > >All the servo motors I use are futuba, so the set up may be different [snip] >"Paper Clips are our friends" >Devin > Devin; Have a look at ftp://ftp.armory.com:/pub/user/rstevew in the "SRVO" directory. You will find some information on servos there. Lots of other good basic electronics stuff too. Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654B.000CAE96; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 18:18:31 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA08345 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 18:08:45 -0800 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA03450 for ; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 19:44:08 -0600 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id RAA08661; Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:41:01 -0800 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199711100141.RAA08661@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: Servos & smoking h-bridges (was Re: Servo specs & antennae, anyone?) To: crs0274@inforamp.net (Richard Weait) Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:41:01 -0800 (PST) Cc: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu, beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: from "Richard Weait" at Nov 9, 97 03:51:06 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: Servos & smoking h-bridges (was Re: Servo specs & antennae, anyone?) PostedDate: 11/09/97 05:41:01 PM SendTo: crs0274@inforamp.net CopyTo: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/09/97 06:18:38 PM-11/09/97 06:18:39 PM DeliveredDate: 11/09/97 06:18:39 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I measure 26microamps going into the signal line of the servo (this is an unmodified servo). I don't know much about servos, but if the input feeds directly into the comparator (high impedance input) then this makes sense. Although I only get a few kohms input Z when measuring with an ohmmeter. Second problem: Looks like I just smoked one side of my L293 h-bridge -- the R/C car sure was jamming for several seconds there, till the poof of smoke. And I was using stacked L293's too! How can I limit this current? (Randy Sargent, you out there? Guess I won't be using those L293's for my 6.270 kit..) Looks like I'll need a bigger heat sink. > > At 12:09 PM 11/9/97 -0800, Jonathan wrote: > > > > I'm using a servo driven by a PIC (digressing.. "It > >works! It works! It's ALIVE!") -- does anyone know the input > > Congratulations, Dr. Frankenstein! :-) > > >current to the Signal line on a servo? The servo works O.K., > >but should I buffer the output from the PIC? (The PIC16F84 can > >supply 25mA. And it isn't melting, yet.) I've looked everywhere > >for this info, even the hobby shops don't know. It is an > >Airtronics 94638 servo (same make as Airtronics 94102). > > > > You say it works? And you want to change it? > The 25 mA should be fine, but watch for the > Total output current limit. > Could you measure the signal current? Maybe > with a scope and a 0.1 Ohm resistor in series > with the signal. Get the trace from voltage > across the resistor, and the voltage out of the > PIC w.r.t ground. That should give you an idea. > > > > Question #2. The Photopopper (just built one, everyone > >should get one of these) uses springs for sensors. Where can I > >get springs like this, or wire like this, so I can make my own > >antennae (sp)? I heard on comp.robotics that some have tried > >piano wire - is this a good solution? Memory wire? > > > > Nice stuff, eh? That pretty gold coloured stuff > is hard to find. I use guitar strings sometimes. > "Memory wire?" ?!?!?!? Neat idea; whenever the 'bot > is in the sunlight (and warms up) the sensor whiskers > change shape! Hmmmm. . . Try it and let us know. > That Nitenol _is_ fairly pricey though, and don't > even ask about current requirements. :-) > > Cheers, > > Richard. > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654B.00589E8E; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:07:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA11016 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 07:58:06 -0800 Received: from slc-mail.utah-inter.net ([206.107.178.6]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA04208 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:23:28 -0600 Received: from ntsrvr2.utah-inter.net ([206.107.179.151]) by slc-mail.utah-inter.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-11875) with ESMTP id AAA462 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:20:39 -0700 Received: by NTSRVR2 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:20:21 -0700 Message-ID: <324F446B91E1D0118EC000400538508003EA77@NTSRVR2> From: Chris Nichols To: beam Subject: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 08:20:19 -0700 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain SMTPOriginator: cnichols@usinfo.com From: cnichols@usinfo.com Subject: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... PostedDate: 11/10/97 07:20:19 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/10/97 08:08:09 AM-11/10/97 08:08:10 AM DeliveredDate: 11/10/97 08:08:10 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US So I have made a bicore using the 74HC14, .22uF, and 1 meg Ohm resisters. All seems to be working well. When I try to make the bicore suspended, I run into some confusion: (Assuming that I am using the first 4 pins on the chip) After reading the notes on Brian O. Bush's web pages and email to the list from John de Vries II it seems that all I need to do is replace the resisters-to-ground from pins 1 and 3 with one resister between pins 1 and 3. However, I can't get this to work. The circuit stops oscillating and the process get stuck in one of the Nv. I have found that If I place the resister between pin 1and 2, or 3 and 4, or both, it seems to work and the timing doesn't seem to change, but this does not seem to match up with how I understand it should work. Thanks for the help. Chris Nichols cnichols@usinfo.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654B.006119B8; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:40:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA11860 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 09:30:48 -0800 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA04317 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:19:00 -0600 Received: from darwin (dialup23.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.242]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA05732; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:37:24 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19971110111337.009144e0@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:13:37 -0500 To: Chris Nichols , beam From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... In-Reply-To: <324F446B91E1D0118EC000400538508003EA77@NTSRVR2> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: Re: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... PostedDate: 11/10/97 08:13:37 AM SendTo: cnichols@usinfo.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/10/97 09:40:45 AM-11/10/97 09:40:45 AM DeliveredDate: 11/10/97 09:40:46 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Chris et al., First off, does your bicore work with resistors to ground (i.e., not a suspended configuration)? If it does not, get the regular configuration working as described in Tilden's patent. If you have problems there still, look at my web pages for common errors and fixes. As I have said before, the BiCore is simpler than the microcore, but the best way to start (IMHO) nv tek is to understand the microcore, then move to the BiCore. (enough ranting... ) Now, Chris it seems that you have a working BiCore in the standard configuration-resistors before each inverter to ground, right? It is only when you go to suspended config that you encounter probs, right? ok. Just as on my pages and John's notes posted to the list, the BiCore is suspended by simply taking the resistors (in essence being tied to each other via ground) and replace them with a single resistor (not tied to ground, but to the input of both inverters). Now assuming you have this, which is on the 74x14 placing a resistor between pins 1 and 3. * Do you have a decoupling capacitor on the supply pins, like 1 muF or higher? * Do you have the second Nv neuron connected back to the first neuron input, and the first connected to the input of the second? Let me know how it comes out. Cheers, Brian --- brian o bush, gearhead "follow the black valley trail of death, into the beautiful sunshine." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Tek pages: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/main.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654B.006450B6; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:15:42 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA12338 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:05:56 -0800 Received: from out2.ibm.net (out2.ibm.net [165.87.194.229]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA04408 for ; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 10:52:37 -0600 Received: from default (slip129-37-158-98.on.ca.ibm.net [129.37.158.98]) by out2.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA37088; Mon, 10 Nov 1997 16:49:40 GMT Message-ID: <34673BDC.44D43674@golden.net> Date: Mon, 10 Nov 1997 11:52:44 -0500 From: Andrew Miller X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Brian O. Bush" CC: Chris Nichols , beam Subject: Re: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.1.32.19971110111337.009144e0@wingate> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: amiller@golden.net From: amiller@golden.net Subject: Re: Not sure if my bicore is floating or not... PostedDate: 11/10/97 08:52:44 AM SendTo: bbush@xtdl.com CopyTo: cnichols@usinfo.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/10/97 10:15:55 AM-11/10/97 10:15:56 AM DeliveredDate: 11/10/97 10:15:56 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Now assuming you have this, which is on the 74x14 placing a resistor > between pins 1 and 3. > * Do you have a decoupling capacitor on the supply pins, like 1 muF or > higher? > > * Do you have the second Nv neuron connected back to the first neuron > input, and the first connected to the input of the second? the solution is much simpler than all that...... The 74x14 _dosn't_ suspend........ Well that's not entirely true.... _Some_ brands at _some_ Voltages with _some_ R Values will... if anybody out there has had success its a fluke... The original Bicore Configuration uses a 74c240........ Inverter drivers... This means Amplification..... 7414 doesn't do that... Its just a signal level device.... Now this is Mega useful in a microcore arrangement but when you try to suspend 2 Schmitts you run into problems... You can turn two inverters into a 50/50 oscillator by removing one of the caps and adding a solid wire... This will give you a great little stable oscillator but it looses some of it's MicroCorish function... all4nw $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654C.004DC820; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 06:09:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA10778 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 05:59:36 -0800 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA05794 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 07:38:53 -0600 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id IfU16035; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 08:35:33 EST To: beam@webconn.com Subject: commo thread.. Message-ID: <19971111.093328.8047.0.nytwulf@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,45 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Earik Wulf) Date: Tue, 11 Nov 1997 08:35:33 EST SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: commo thread.. PostedDate: 11/11/97 05:35:33 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/11/97 06:09:39 AM-11/11/97 06:09:39 AM DeliveredDate: 11/11/97 06:09:39 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Subject: Re: combined thread :: commo On Fri, 31 Oct 1997 12:10:59 +0100 (MET) Steven Bolt writes:[sound plans]>>> I've been designing and building mechatronical devices for 18 years now...>> ok.. experianced in the art of "why wont it work damnit!!" =]>Ah, but quite a few things work very nicely :)wish i could say the same for my projects.. :P[ Spider performance ]>IMHO it is best to do prototyping without wheels or legs, and put sensors and brains on a >body *after* they've been optimised.ok.. one step at a time.. this i might be able to do.. =][ Comparator ]>Seems simple enough. Put the divided-by-x battery voltage on one of the comparator >inputs, and connect the other to a stabilized voltage. When divide-by-x drops below the >stabilized voltage, your comparator triggers. The division is done by a potmeter, >allowing adjustment; the stabilized voltage is created by a resistor and a zener or a >couple of diodes, depending on the battery voltage.wow.. im impressed.. i didnt get lost by that one.. there's hope for me yet.. =] but yeah i see how this goes now.. it would be using a fraction of the bat power as an input?>I once designed a little tester for 12V lead/acid batteries, giving green/yellow/red >indication; I might be able to find the diagram if anyone wants it.if you come across it.. thats ok.. but i should see if i can do some design work on my own[ clock cycles vs. analog]>And sound isn't moving very far in the time it takes the 1200 at 4MHz to do its work. im thinking i should stick to something simpler then the 1200 for the time being since i have little background in uC>You would typically have a counter running, and stop it using an interrupt. The response >to interrupt takes 4 cycles (one microsecond), during which sound travels rather less >than 1mm - and you could even take that into account when computing the range number. so in effect i dont even require something that fast.. being that it doesnt have to be that incredibly accurate.. just close enough to let them touch together basicaly..>Inaccuracies and range minima are more likely to result from the time it takes the >receiver to recognize the sound, and that depends to a large extend on wavelength. negligable for the aplication.. yes?>Analog range indication might be attractive if you just need to know whether something is >closer than some fixed distance.fixed being a preset distance or a stationary local?[ simulated sonar ]>Well, if the `bot merely has to listen (and watch) for the signal, I would expect ranging to be easier and more accurate than when it first transmits and then listens for reflections, as that `tape measure' does. The minimum distance should also be less. especialy if it wont be confusing 'echoes' from itself with 'calls' from other bots..>But why not warm up the soldering iron, instead of debating the matter? Results of >experiments are a more interesting read :)appoligize for being so bothersome.. but i would like to make sure my ideas are grounded in reality rather then pipe dreams like they usualy are.. i also want to be sure i understand what im getting into before i buy some tools (some of which i could not locate at my house when i was there) $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654D.007C278E; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:36:05 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA26918 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 14:26:03 -0800 From: MattJasper@aol.com Received: from mrin40.mail.aol.com (mrin40.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.150]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA08301 for ; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 15:31:50 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin40.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA06936 for beam@webconn.com; Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:28:48 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:28:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971112162848_-1710199304@mrin40.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: BEAM in the UK? SMTPOriginator: MattJasper@aol.com From: MattJasper@aol.com Subject: BEAM in the UK? PostedDate: 11/12/97 01:28:48 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/12/97 02:36:21 PM-11/12/97 02:36:22 PM DeliveredDate: 11/12/97 02:36:22 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US How many BEAM nuts out there live in the UK? How much interest would there be in a mini version of the BEAM games in Britain? Send mail to mattjasper@aol.com if you're interested. Y'all's Matt $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654E.0049872D; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:23:07 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA04892 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:13:10 -0800 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09206 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 07:02:35 -0600 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id HbD21218; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 07:59:07 EST To: beam@webconn.com Subject: combine replies.. Message-ID: <19971113.075544.8071.8.nytwulf@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 15-16,25-26,34-35,39-40,45 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Earik Wulf) Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 07:59:07 EST SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: combine replies.. PostedDate: 11/13/97 04:59:07 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/13/97 05:23:16 AM-11/13/97 05:23:17 AM DeliveredDate: 11/13/97 05:23:17 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Thu, 06 Nov 1997 17:06:08 -0700 "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" writes:>After reading all of the "commo" e-mails, I was curious to know if anyone has started to >build anything yet. About a week befour the commo letters started, I started a simaler >project using IR. There will be three small bots running of of a bicore and the Tilden >H-bridge motor drivers. It will be solar and charge in the day and triger at night. I>have one build except for part of the circuit. My soldering station broke last week so >i'm waiting for a replacement (Another delay). I'm going to get a scanner soon so I can >put photos of my progress on my web page! well i havent been able to build anything.. since my iron is A. 300 miles away and B. lost somewhere in the cosmic tape hiss (the void between the last song on a tape and the actual physical end of the tape) but i will prolly just get a new one when i find some spare time.. altho something else has caught my attention for the time being..question? how will the bots look for light (if thats what they do) at night? On Fri, 07 Nov 1997 07:01:59 -0700 "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" writes:>It uses marks new solar engine. The bots sit all day and collect a charge in a PANISONIC >3V rechargable battery and a .47F cap. When it gets dark the voltage in the solarcell >drops, when the voltage is below that of the battery a transister turns on the circuit on >and it moves untill the charge runs out.it would also move if the light source moved away.. then alowing the bot to go look for it again.. yes no? its a good idea but if it waits for it to be too dark.. where will it know where to stop? On Fri, 7 Nov 1997 19:15:47 -0500 Dennison writes:>Problem: Only one Mac Se fell on it's head. I have know idea about how to get ahold of >another (the disk drive only or just motor/gearbox combo) but it really is a gift from >the gear box gods.would a local computer repair shop carry such drives? (im sure that even some dead drives could be salvaged for the motor) im thinking this because most broken computer components arnt worth very much since they work more in a replace it and fix it later kinda way.. On Fri, 07 Nov 1997 16:41:25 -0700 "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" writes:>Maby when i'm done I can make some kind of a home base where they can go to when the >charge gets low.sounds like other ideas using a "sun flower".. which im still interested in.. On Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:36:10 -0500 (EST) mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu writes:>There is also a movie called "Alien Empire". I don't have any more info than that, but >you might be able to track it down.i saw something by that name on PBS a few months back.. but it was only about a half hour.. so i wouldnt call it a movie. =] $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654E.004DA495; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 06:08:04 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA07224 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 05:58:16 -0800 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09345 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 07:54:22 -0600 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id IuD21218; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:50:12 EST To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: BEAM in the UK? Message-ID: <19971113.084805.7999.3.nytwulf@juno.com> References: <971112162848_-1710199304@mrin40.mail.aol.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,3-6,8 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Earik Wulf) Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 08:50:12 EST SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: Re: BEAM in the UK? PostedDate: 11/13/97 05:50:12 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/13/97 06:08:08 AM-11/13/97 06:08:09 AM DeliveredDate: 11/13/97 06:08:09 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:28:48 -0500 (EST) MattJasper@aol.com writes: >How many BEAM nuts out there live in the UK? How much interest would there be in a mini >version of the BEAM games in Britain? Send mail to mattjasper@aol.com if you're >interested. >Y'all's >Matt good point.. would it be possible to have multiple locations for these games? i dont know how many can afford a trip to india.. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654F.00111874; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 19:06:43 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA15609 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 18:56:55 -0800 From: JNNREaton@aol.com Received: from mrin38.mail.aol.com (mrin38.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.148]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA10691 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 20:47:35 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin38.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id VAA21032 for beam@webconn.com; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:44:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:44:21 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971113214420_1792643282@mrin38> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: BEAM: Free Atmel Kit SMTPOriginator: JNNREaton@aol.com From: JNNREaton@aol.com Subject: BEAM: Free Atmel Kit PostedDate: 11/13/97 06:44:21 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/13/97 07:06:53 PM-11/13/97 07:06:54 PM DeliveredDate: 11/13/97 07:06:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Steve Bolt has mentioned the Atmel AT90S series of chips on this list before. Specifically the AT90S1200. Steve has given it much praise. Cheap and easy to program. I saw an add today in a magazine called Portable Design, Nov 1997 issue, page 11, I thought you might be interested in. Atmel is offering (and this is their description) a "FREE AT90S AVR MCU sample kit packed with all the information you'll need to get your designs to market faster!" I do not know what is included. I sent for my free kit today. If you are interested, you can contact Atmel at the following addresses. email: literature@atmel.com fax on demand: 800-292-8635 (North America) 408-441-0732 (International) web site: www.atmel.com corporate headquarters: 2325 Orchard Parkway San Jose, California 95131 USA telephone: 408-441-0311 fax: 408-487-2600 Just thought you might be interested in this free kit. I hope it is worth something. I am not associated with Atmel. I am only one of their customers. Jim Eaton LaCrescent Minnesota USA $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654F.0015DA13; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 19:58:40 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA18505 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 19:48:23 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA10808 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:38:24 -0600 Received: from 206.206.184.241 ([206.206.184.241]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA27227; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 20:38:14 -0700 Message-ID: <346B72D6.561D@springercoop.com> Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 14:36:24 -0700 From: "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" Reply-To: cibern@springercoop.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Earik Wulf CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: combine replies.. References: <19971113.075544.8071.8.nytwulf@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Re: combine replies.. PostedDate: 11/13/97 01:36:24 PM SendTo: nytwulf@juno.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: cibern@springercoop.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/13/97 07:58:41 PM-11/13/97 07:58:42 PM DeliveredDate: 11/13/97 07:58:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US How will the bots look for light (if thats what they do) at night? They don't move toward light. The IR is for communicated between the bots. Each bot will have 2 IR emitters( two because they only have a 35 degree range ) and 2 recivers simaler to a photovore. ( This is what they use to communicate between each other ) _____________________________________________________________________ It would also move if the light source moved away.. then alowing the bot to go look for it again.. yes no? It needs two be really dark to turn it on( On a full moon it might not turn on ) _____________________________________________________________________ Its a good idea but if it waits for it to be too dark.. where will it know where to stop? Back to the first question -----> $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654F.0016DD6A; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 20:09:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA19240 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 19:59:33 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA10884 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:59:47 -0600 Received: from ts62ip209.cadvision.com (ts67ip132.cadvision.com [207.228.75.132]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA155622 for ; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 20:56:32 -0700 Received: by ts62ip209.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF07F.6D3DA2C0@ts62ip209.cadvision.com>; Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:59:34 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF07F.6D3DA2C0@ts62ip209.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'cibern@springercoop.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: combine replies.. Date: Thu, 13 Nov 1997 21:59:31 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: combine replies.. PostedDate: 11/13/97 08:59:31 PM SendTo: cibern@springercoop.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/13/97 08:09:54 PM-11/13/97 08:09:55 PM DeliveredDate: 11/13/97 08:09:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----Original Message----- From: Ian Bernstein(Synet) [SMTP:cibern@springercoop.com] Sent: Thursday, November 13, 1997 2:36 PM To: Earik Wulf Cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: combine replies.. How will the bots look for light (if thats what they do) at night? Put photo resisitors on the leads from the motor, the less light, the more resistance. This causes a behavior of searching for light, They don't move toward light. The IR is for communicated between the bots. Each bot will have 2 IR emitters( two because they only have a 35 degree range ) and 2 recivers simaler to a photovore. ( This is what they use to communicate between each other ) But what about 290 other degree's, how will one "know" which way to point. I personaly would go for a beep that has a "marco Polo" type communication. If one finds a good light source, have it beep say 3 times. When others "hear" the beep, they could tell distance by how faint or strong the sound was. _____________________________________________________________________ It would also move if the light source moved away.. then alowing the bot to go look for it again.. yes no? It needs two be really dark to turn it on( On a full moon it might not turn on ) "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825654F.00815BEB; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:32:56 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA19156 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 15:23:07 -0800 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA12218 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 16:58:15 -0600 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id RkV05092; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 17:54:03 EST To: cibern@springercoop.com, beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: combine replies.. Message-ID: <19971114.175225.7919.3.nytwulf@juno.com> References: <19971113.075544.8071.8.nytwulf@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1,5-6,8-10 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Earik Wulf) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 17:54:03 EST SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: Re: combine replies.. PostedDate: 11/14/97 02:54:03 PM SendTo: cibern@springercoop.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/14/97 03:32:59 PM-11/14/97 03:33:00 PM DeliveredDate: 11/14/97 03:33:00 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Thu, 13 Nov 1997 14:36:24 -0700 "Ian Bernstein(Synet)" writes: >They don't move toward light. The IR is for communicated between the bots. Each bot will >have 2 IR emitters( two because they only have a 35 degree range ) and 2 recivers simaler >to a photovore. ( This is what they use to communicate between each other ) how will they find a light source? or are they just going to be in a light saturated area? also.. what will they communicate if not a food source? $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256550.0016FD98; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:11:07 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA04670 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 20:01:17 -0800 Received: from hometown.hto.net (hto.net [205.146.103.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA12536 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:39:47 -0600 Received: from drifterm [205.146.103.143] by hometown.hto.net (SMTPD32-4.02) id A9ABBE60148; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:40:27 EST Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971114223906.00698fc8@hto.net> X-Sender: myarian@hto.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 22:39:06 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Yarian Subject: Motors/Gears Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: myarian@hto.net From: myarian@hto.net Subject: Motors/Gears PostedDate: 11/14/97 07:39:06 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/14/97 08:11:17 PM-11/14/97 08:11:19 PM DeliveredDate: 11/14/97 08:11:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello all... Got a question you all might be able to help me with. I am building my first Microcore. I have all the circuits done and working, but I am having trouble finding a good gear/motor combo for a good price. I have a found some at Mondo-Tronics, but they want like 20 bucks a piece for a Selectable kit. I don't need that, I am just looking for a basic 30RPM@5v (I found this info on a web-page). I am wondering if there are better places I could order or get this cheaper. After handling and junk it would be like $50, I am not willing to shell this out until I see if there are better ways to get this stuff. Digi-key has some good stuff, but no motors... If anyone is interested in swapping, I have a few motors from a c64 and just some I have collected. Thanks, and any info on getting parts anywhere would be helpfull... [[MARK]] myarian@hto.net $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256550.0020CCA8; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:58:15 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA11342 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 21:48:25 -0800 Received: from lcra.org ([198.214.48.6]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA12734 for ; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 23:36:52 -0600 Received: from PRIMARY-Message_Server by lcra.org with Novell_GroupWise; Fri, 14 Nov 1997 23:33:41 -0600 Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise 4.1 Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 23:32:50 -0600 From: "Richard R. Diaz" To: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov, beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. -Reply Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline $FILE: SMTPOriginator: richard.diaz@lcra.org From: richard.diaz@lcra.org Subject: Re: Mac Se, gearbox. -Reply PostedDate: 11/14/97 09:32:50 PM SendTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/14/97 09:58:18 PM-11/14/97 09:58:20 PM DeliveredDate: 11/14/97 09:58:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US - att1.unk $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256550.0072D05E; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:54:04 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA00643 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 12:44:13 -0800 Received: from contract.kent.edu ([131.123.210.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA13304 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 14:34:16 -0600 Received: (qmail 2034 invoked by uid 100); 15 Nov 1997 20:30:37 -0000 Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:30:37 -0500 (EST) From: Ted Fullerton To: Mark Yarian cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Motors/Gears In-Reply-To: <3.0.3.32.19971114223906.00698fc8@hto.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: ted@contract.kent.edu From: ted@contract.kent.edu Subject: Re: Motors/Gears PostedDate: 11/15/97 12:30:37 PM SendTo: myarian@hto.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/15/97 12:54:07 PM-11/15/97 12:54:08 PM DeliveredDate: 11/15/97 12:54:08 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Mark, I found myself in a similar spot and found an easy solution in cheapo servos found at any good hobby store. Look for cheap Futaba brand servos as, unlike Cirrus brand, you can completely rip out the PCB parts inside and still have a solid motor mounting. In one of the FAQs there is a good description of the modifications you need to make to the servo, but in a nutshell: take off the bottom remove the PCB and related junk (i.e. tiny capacitors soldered to the motor) solder your new wires directly to the motor An optional step that I found helped is to remove the plastic stop from the head gear itself. made debugging easier. I did find, also, that my cat did *not* enjoy my attempt to feed the PCB to him... I found 'em for $9.00/each. -Ted On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Mark Yarian wrote: > > Hello all... > Got a question you all might be able to help me with. I am building my > first Microcore. I have all the circuits done and working, but I am having > trouble finding a good gear/motor combo for a good price. I have a found > some at Mondo-Tronics, but they want like 20 bucks a piece for a Selectable > kit. I don't need that, I am just looking for a basic 30RPM@5v (I found > this info on a web-page). I am wondering if there are better places I > could order or get this cheaper. After handling and junk it would be like > $50, I am not willing to shell this out until I see if there are better > ways to get this stuff. Digi-key has some good stuff, but no motors... If > anyone is interested in swapping, I have a few motors from a c64 and just > some I have collected. > Thanks, and any info on getting parts anywhere would be helpfull... > [[MARK]] > myarian@hto.net > > > > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256550.007A9407; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 14:18:52 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA03268 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 14:09:02 -0800 From: MattJasper@aol.com Received: from mrin54.mail.aol.com (mrin54.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.164]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA13526 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:02:37 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin54.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA29372 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:59:12 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:59:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971115165911_1404827069@mrin54.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Random Motion SMTPOriginator: MattJasper@aol.com From: MattJasper@aol.com Subject: Random Motion PostedDate: 11/15/97 01:59:12 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/15/97 02:19:02 PM-11/15/97 02:19:02 PM DeliveredDate: 11/15/97 02:19:02 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Has any1 tried this method of producing random motion for a type-2 SE: fix a flat faced gear or pulley onto a motor, then mount the motor vertically, pulley down, in a chassis. When the motor is energised it wobbles about and could point the robot in a random direction? Maybe the main forward-going power could be generated by a type-2 with the above controlled by a type-1. This was discovered accidentally five minutes ago when a SE fell off my bench! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.00001C90; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:01:13 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA05499 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 15:51:21 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA13739 for ; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 17:44:17 -0600 Received: from sb2 (x2ts6ip84.cadvision.com [207.228.65.84]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA67598; Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:40:43 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971115163922.00b27d20@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 16:39:22 -0700 To: MattJasper@aol.com, beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Random Motion In-Reply-To: <971115165911_1404827069@mrin54.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Random Motion PostedDate: 11/15/97 03:39:22 PM SendTo: MattJasper@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/15/97 04:01:17 PM-11/15/97 04:01:18 PM DeliveredDate: 11/15/97 04:01:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 04:59 PM 11/15/1997 -0500, MattJasper@aol.com wrote: >Has any1 tried this method of producing random motion for a type-2 SE: fix a >flat faced gear or pulley onto a motor, then mount the motor vertically, >pulley down, in a chassis. Yup, you're describing a balanced SYMET. Works well, don't it... Dave PS: No email from us for a few weeks - BEAM '97 in India! Will have full posts & graphics upon our return. -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.006663CD; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 10:38:22 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA16773 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 10:28:22 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA14364 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:36:05 -0600 Received: from ts33ip165.cadvision.com (ts33ip165.cadvision.com [207.228.70.165]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id KAA45008; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 10:32:16 -0700 Received: by ts33ip165.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF283.39F004C0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com>; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:31:48 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF283.39F004C0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Ted Fullerton'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Motors/Gears Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:31:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Motors/Gears PostedDate: 11/16/97 10:31:46 AM SendTo: ted@contract.kent.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 10:38:25 AM-11/16/97 10:38:26 AM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 10:38:26 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I may be able to scan part of the scoutwalker instructions for modifying servos. But It all depends on if dave says it's ok. Devin -----Original Message----- From: Ted Fullerton [SMTP:ted@contract.kent.edu] Sent: Saturday, November 15, 1997 1:31 PM To: Mark Yarian Cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Motors/Gears Mark, I found myself in a similar spot and found an easy solution in cheapo servos found at any good hobby store. Look for cheap Futaba brand servos as, unlike Cirrus brand, you can completely rip out the PCB parts inside and still have a solid motor mounting. In one of the FAQs there is a good description of the modifications you need to make to the servo, but in a nutshell: take off the bottom remove the PCB and related junk (i.e. tiny capacitors soldered to the motor) solder your new wires directly to the motor An optional step that I found helped is to remove the plastic stop from the head gear itself. made debugging easier. I did find, also, that my cat did *not* enjoy my attempt to feed the PCB to him... I found 'em for $9.00/each. -Ted On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Mark Yarian wrote: > > Hello all... > Got a question you all might be able to help me with. I am building my > first Microcore. I have all the circuits done and working, but I am having > trouble finding a good gear/motor combo for a good price. I have a found > some at Mondo-Tronics, but they want like 20 bucks a piece for a Selectable > kit. I don't need that, I am just looking for a basic 30RPM@5v (I found > this info on a web-page). I am wondering if there are better places I > could order or get this cheaper. After handling and junk it would be like > $50, I am not willing to shell this out until I see if there are better > ways to get this stuff. Digi-key has some good stuff, but no motors... If > anyone is interested in swapping, I have a few motors from a c64 and just > some I have collected. > Thanks, and any info on getting parts anywhere would be helpfull... > [[MARK]] > myarian@hto.net > > > > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.006AE35B; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:27:30 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA18125 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 11:17:33 -0800 Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.154]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA14524 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:20:05 -0600 Received: from fuzzgun.demon.co.uk ([194.222.137.155]) by post.mail.demon.net id ab1021544; 16 Nov 97 19:05 GMT Message-ID: <+e+pwDAmA0b0Ew33@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk> Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 18:49:10 +0000 To: Beam@webconn.com From: Bob Mottram Subject: Re: Random Motion In-Reply-To: <971115165911_1404827069@mrin54.mail.aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Trial Version 3.04 SMTPOriginator: Bob@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk From: Bob@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk Subject: Re: Random Motion PostedDate: 11/16/97 10:49:10 AM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 11:27:36 AM-11/16/97 11:27:37 AM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 11:27:37 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In article <971115165911_1404827069@mrin54.mail.aol.com>, MattJasper@aol.com writes >Has any1 tried this method of producing random motion for a type-2 SE: fix a >flat faced gear or pulley onto a motor, then mount the motor vertically, >pulley down, in a chassis. When the motor is energised it wobbles about and >could point the robot in a random direction? Maybe the main forward-going >power could be generated by a type-2 with the above controlled by a type-1. >This was discovered accidentally five minutes ago when a SE fell off my >bench! I've built a few like this. They wobble about randomly. The only problem is that they're most active in illuminated areas, so that they tend to spend most of their time in darker regions. -- |~~~~~~~|__ "The horizon leans forward (~~~~~~~)_ \ offering you space to place | | \ \ new steps of change" ( ) ) ) | |_/ / Bob Mottram ( )__/ Bob@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk \_____/ http://www.fuzzgun.demon.co.uk $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.0071F4C3; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 12:44:42 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA19961 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 12:34:50 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14846 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 14:29:13 -0600 Received: from ts33ip165.cadvision.com (ts33ip165.cadvision.com [207.228.70.165]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id NAA62064 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:25:40 -0700 Received: by ts33ip165.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF29B.757CD820@ts33ip165.cadvision.com>; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 14:25:16 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF29B.757CD820@ts33ip165.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Those darn nice HE walkman motors Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 14:25:13 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Those darn nice HE walkman motors PostedDate: 11/16/97 01:25:13 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 12:44:50 PM-11/16/97 12:44:51 PM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 12:44:51 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I just got back from my usual search the stores for things which might have great salvage. The rumble pak, a "feel" system for the N64, is $20 . I found that they have the 40% or less effiency is them. With a huge "pager motor weight", with a rubber surrounding. Along with a small PCB that may have very nice scrap. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.00761F9F; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:30:13 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA20729 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 13:20:20 -0800 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from mrin39.mail.aol.com (mrin39.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.149]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA14977 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 15:18:17 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin39.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA16481 for beam@webconn.com; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 16:14:47 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 16:14:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971116161445_1771522356@mrin39> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Photovore sensor gaits SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Photovore sensor gaits PostedDate: 11/16/97 01:14:47 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 01:30:16 PM-11/16/97 01:30:16 PM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 01:30:16 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I was wondering how you would get a photovore to do something (turn around, backup, etc.) when it hits an object. Can someone tell me how the microcore works. Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256551.00809D1E; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 15:24:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA22359 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 15:14:56 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA15216 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 17:07:17 -0600 Received: from ts33ip165.cadvision.com (ts33ip165.cadvision.com [207.228.70.165]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA68194; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 16:03:41 -0700 Received: by ts33ip165.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF2B1.8A5216A0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com>; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 17:03:20 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF2B1.8A5216A0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'NeTKiLL78@aol.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Photovore sensor gaits Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 17:03:18 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Photovore sensor gaits PostedDate: 11/16/97 04:03:18 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 03:24:55 PM-11/16/97 03:24:55 PM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 03:24:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Have a tactile sensor, then wire it as an open circuit to a 1 MOhm resistor, and then put it to the middle pin. -----Original Message----- From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com [SMTP:NeTKiLL78@aol.com] Sent: Sunday, November 16, 1997 2:15 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Photovore sensor gaits I was wondering how you would get a photovore to do something (turn around, backup, etc.) when it hits an object. Can someone tell me how the microcore works. A microcore has 6 Nv, a bicore 12 Nv, a solar engine = 1 Nv. Asking how a microcore works is depending on the answer you want easy to understand, or all the details. It's 6 resistors, one 74xx14 or similar IC, 6 .22 capacitors, and 6 HE LED. Any one else want to try to put it in easier words for him. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256552.0011F1FA; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 19:16:00 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA25625 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 19:06:08 -0800 From: BHAVSAR@hws.edu Received: from HWS3.hws.edu (www3.hws.edu [205.232.67.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA15520 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:01:13 -0600 Received: from hws.edu by hws.edu (PMDF V5.0-6 #22556) id <01IQ3CIJTRU8005BDA@hws.edu> for beam@webconn.com; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:52:53 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:52:53 -0500 (EST) Subject: other mailing lists?? To: beam@webconn.com Message-id: <01IQ3CIJU1HE005BDA@hws.edu> X-VMS-To: IN%"beam@webconn.com" MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT SMTPOriginator: BHAVSAR@hws.edu From: BHAVSAR@hws.edu Subject: other mailing lists?? PostedDate: 11/16/97 06:52:53 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 07:16:05 PM-11/16/97 07:16:06 PM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 07:16:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi..this is my first E-mail....i have been following this mailing list for a while and I think what you guys are going is very very cool....I was curious if anyone knew any other ROBOTICS(or anything similar) mailing lists... I want to get more info related to non-beam robots too... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256552.001B97E6; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 21:01:23 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA27126 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 20:51:26 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA15704 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 22:40:46 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id XAA18836 for ; Sun, 16 Nov 1997 23:36:41 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711170436.XAA18836@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp43.buffnet.net(205.246.19.150) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma007382; Sun, 16 Nov 97 23:35:44 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Wiskers! Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 23:44:47 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Wiskers! PostedDate: 11/05/97 08:44:47 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/16/97 09:01:34 PM-11/16/97 09:01:35 PM DeliveredDate: 11/16/97 09:01:35 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US The traditional Walker has wiskers to sense objects infront or to the side. Using Tildens omnidirectional sensor. Brilliant, but couldn't we make it better? For example, reall animals like dogs and cats have Many wiskers. And for a good reason. If only one wisker triggers then it's most likely of no importance, but if five wiskers trigger, then perhaps it's something of value. Two wiskers on a robot would look like this/ | | | | | | | | +---+ Each of diffrent length. So that, \ < (Object1) | | | | | | | +---+ Here only the Long wisker triggers, wich means that the robot should turn slightly, but not too much becuase Object one isn't to important. But. \ < (Object2) | (Object2) | \<(Object2) | | | | +---+ Object2 is obviously closer and of greater importance. The robot, should defninatly turn out of the way. The trick is here, although the simple way would be to give the shorting resistor for Wisker 1 a higher value than wisker 2 so that wisker two (the closer to the robot wisker) reduced the pulse with more than wisker one. But that realy only works in this arrengement. What is needed is a collective sensor type thingy take for instance three wiskers, stratigicaly placed. | Side | /------------------+ + +-------------------\ Rear / | | | \ Front W1 W2 W3 Three wiskers, sensing the back, front and side. Much better sensor placement. From this various behaviors could develop. Subsumption architecture comes into play. Which sensor is more important? Which COMBINATION of sensors is most important? Front, and side? Rear front? Rear side? Individually each sensor would have it's own variation value for adjusting the pulse with. But In combinations the resistance would add up. food for thought. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256552.0052F8D5; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 07:06:16 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA05461 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 06:56:18 -0800 Received: from aries.EE.McGill.CA (Aries.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.1.14]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA16257 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 08:37:14 -0600 Received: from xenon.EE.McGill.CA (root@Xenon.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.31.100]) by aries.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id JAA16525; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:33:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (hdjamb@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xenon.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id JAA02131; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:33:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 09:33:31 -0500 (EST) From: Haig Hugo Vrej Djambazian X-Sender: hdjamb@xenon To: Ted Fullerton cc: Mark Yarian , beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Motors/Gears In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: hdjamb@ee.mcgill.ca From: hdjamb@ee.mcgill.ca Subject: Re: Motors/Gears PostedDate: 11/17/97 06:33:31 AM SendTo: ted@contract.kent.edu CopyTo: myarian@hto.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/17/97 07:06:29 AM-11/17/97 07:06:30 AM DeliveredDate: 11/17/97 07:06:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 15 Nov 1997, Ted Fullerton wrote: > > Mark, > > I found myself in a similar spot and found an easy solution in > cheapo servos found at any good hobby store. Look for cheap Futaba brand > servos as, unlike Cirrus brand, you can completely rip out the PCB parts > inside and still have a solid motor mounting. > > In one of the FAQs there is a good description of the > modifications you need to make to the servo, but in a nutshell: > > take off the bottom > remove the PCB and related junk (i.e. tiny capacitors soldered to > the motor) > solder your new wires directly to the motor > > An optional step that I found helped is to remove the plastic stop > from the head gear itself. made debugging easier. > > I did find, also, that my cat did *not* enjoy my attempt to feed > the PCB to him... > > I found 'em for $9.00/each. > > -Ted > > On Fri, 14 Nov 1997, Mark Yarian wrote: > > > > > Hello all... > > Got a question you all might be able to help me with. I am building my > > first Microcore. I have all the circuits done and working, but I am having > > trouble finding a good gear/motor combo for a good price. I have a found > > some at Mondo-Tronics, but they want like 20 bucks a piece for a Selectable > > kit. I don't need that, I am just looking for a basic 30RPM@5v (I found > > this info on a web-page). I am wondering if there are better places I > > could order or get this cheaper. After handling and junk it would be like > > $50, I am not willing to shell this out until I see if there are better > > ways to get this stuff. Digi-key has some good stuff, but no motors... If > > anyone is interested in swapping, I have a few motors from a c64 and just > > some I have collected. > > Thanks, and any info on getting parts anywhere would be helpfull... > > [[MARK]] > > myarian@hto.net > > > > > > > > > > Hi Ted, I agree that servos are probably the best source for gears and motors already mounted together. But I also find the PCB part very useful, instead of wasting time building a circuit to control the motor, I simply feed in a pulse width modulated square wave from the white wire... Anyways, my question for you would be where did you find, even "cheap" Futaba servos for only 9$. I live in Montreal and the cheapest I have found went for 25$ (canadian). I would appreciate it if you could forward me the address. -Haig Djambazian $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256552.007188E3; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:40:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA12549 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 12:30:09 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA17062 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 13:53:39 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm06-24.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.185]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id UAA27634 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 20:49:43 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199711171949.UAA27634@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "Mea Culpa" To: Subject: Help needed with MicroCore Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 20:43:07 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl From: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Help needed with MicroCore PostedDate: 11/17/97 11:43:07 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/17/97 12:40:11 PM-11/17/97 12:40:12 PM DeliveredDate: 11/17/97 12:40:12 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello I am trying to build a small machine with a MicroCore [Mark Tilden's patent] The design use 4 neuron and two DC motors, controlled by a H-bridge each. I am running into several problems by now. The DC motors are turning a different number of degrees to the left and the right. This due the difference in the resistor and cap. value. I've tried to level these differences out by using a variable resistor but the effects are none or very minor. Now i am thinking of placing an end switch to stop the DC motor at a fixed point. Does anyone have tried this before or does anyone have some experience with MicroCore? Any suggestions? Bram Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256553.00158791; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:55:09 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA22649 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:45:17 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA17720 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 21:34:47 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA07969 for ; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 22:30:33 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711180330.WAA07969@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp19.buffnet.net(205.246.19.126) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma001632; Mon, 17 Nov 97 22:30:06 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Solar Engin Gyro. Date: Thu, 6 Nov 1997 22:39:08 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Solar Engin Gyro. PostedDate: 11/06/97 07:39:08 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/17/97 07:55:13 PM-11/17/97 07:55:14 PM DeliveredDate: 11/17/97 07:55:14 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US My friend gave me an old walkman of his today which I disemboweled when I got home. Instead of the regular thick (but small) motor for tha casset drive there was a flat wide motor. It is surprisingly strong and works with a 4700uf cap. Amazing GYRO! Because it is so flat and the roto must be flat with a large circumfrence it act like a powerfull gyro when it's powered up. I think there could be potential for SolarEngin based gyro's but I don't think much. Maily becuase a gyro has to be going CONSTANTLY to be of any worth. (Although it could be Pulsed from an osscialing solar engin!) But just wanted to share. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256553.0065531C; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 10:26:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA11064 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 10:16:49 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA19295 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 11:43:01 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm01-08.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.9]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id SAA28332 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:39:01 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711181739.SAA28332@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "Mea Culpa" To: Subject: FruitBot and Photo-transistor Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 18:37:39 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl From: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: FruitBot and Photo-transistor PostedDate: 11/18/97 09:37:39 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/18/97 10:26:49 AM-11/18/97 10:26:50 AM DeliveredDate: 11/18/97 10:26:50 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Just some strange experiments I have a solarpowered roller and just for fun wanted to power it with some other energy source. To keep this in the spirit of BEAM i used a lemon as battery. Worked fine and fun to see.. Sunday and all the shops closed. I got this great idea invoking the use of a photo-transistor. But the problem was that i didn't had one. I could not wait till the next day so i took a transistor in a metal casing [2n222] and took the topside of the cap off. It made a transistor that reacted on light. Well enough to give it a try. A.A. van Zoelen. Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256553.0073FA74; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 13:06:47 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA14842 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 12:56:52 -0800 Received: from driene.student.utwente.nl (driene.student.utwente.nl [130.89.220.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA19966 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 14:15:07 -0600 Received: from cal052302.student.utwente.nl by driene.student.utwente.nl with SMTP id AA24275 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:11:13 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971118201531.0066528c@mail.student.utwente.nl> X-Sender: s9301798@mail.student.utwente.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:15:31 +0100 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark van dijk Subject: microcore basic circuit with leds and PNC question SMTPOriginator: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl From: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl Subject: microcore basic circuit with leds and PNC question PostedDate: 11/18/97 12:15:31 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/18/97 01:06:55 PM-11/18/97 01:06:56 PM DeliveredDate: 11/18/97 01:06:56 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi, After building a fotovoor ("sbolt") I started building the microcore basic circuit at "amiller's" side (with the leds as in figure 1), then I got into trouble. I had just finished adding the PNC(pin 7, led 1) to the basic circuit with leds when I noticed there was something not right. The three process state seems to work fast but well. The two process state looks wrong, because the circuit seems to skip the step with led 3 and led 6 burning and led 2 seems to burn 50% of the time. At the one process state one led (led 2) burns all the time. So the only way to get the null state is to disconnect the batteries. I can't find anything wrong with the circuit. Does anybody have a hint to correct this. figure 1. discription of leds ====== led 1 | | led 4 | | led 2 | | led 5 | | led 3 | | led 6 ====== Another question: Why do led 4 and led 6 never burn at the same time in the two process state while led 1 and led 3 can burn at the same time in that state. Thanks, M. van Dijk ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256554.00183FAC; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:24:51 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA27328 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:14:57 -0800 Received: from mail.pris.bc.ca (mail.pris.bc.ca [199.60.237.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA20797 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:59:51 -0600 Received: from ccc_chetwynd (ch17.pris.bc.ca [204.244.220.17]) by mail.pris.bc.ca (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA26518 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:54:23 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3472719B.93A@pris.bc.ca> Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 20:56:59 -0800 From: "Mark E. Embree" Reply-To: membree@pris.bc.ca Organization: Chetwynd Computer Centre X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Beam List server Subject: Hello Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: membree@pris.bc.ca From: membree@pris.bc.ca Subject: Hello PostedDate: 11/18/97 08:56:59 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: membree@pris.bc.ca $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/18/97 08:25:06 PM-11/18/97 08:25:07 PM DeliveredDate: 11/18/97 08:25:07 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hiya all. Since I am new to this field, I will more than likely be asking many questions about building these little gems. Don't worry, I will only ask when all other resources are exhausted. My background is limited to basic electronics, however, I own a computer store and want to be adding robotics kits for reselling. Currently, I do my own repairs as I have ten years in the computer field and build my own systems. This is a bonus for finding many small parts as we don't throw out anything. Hard drives and floppy drives in an abundance for parts as well as old XT parts (Lots of XT parts). This should make for many hours of sorting parts and stripping systems. Anybody looking for old computer parts for robotics are welcome to ask. As well, my brother collects and repairs old stereo equipment and could probably build a full lifesize robot with what he has in spare parts. Mainly, I want to work with lego (technics) for prototyping and then eventually get a milling machine and build the final product. What I am desperate for right now is any information leading to parts suppliers for lego incorporated pieces. I know MIT has a wonderful chip, but they won't let it out of the company. (Shame on them for withholding technology). I have the current catalog from Mondo-Tronics in California and they have some wonderful products for starting with but they don't have any Lego incorporated pieces. Thanks all and have a great time. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256554.001E5801; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:31:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA29518 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 21:21:30 -0800 Received: from timbuk.cray.com (timbuk-anet.cray.com [128.162.19.7]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA21144 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 23:06:57 -0600 Received: from ironwood.cray.com (root@ironwood-fddi.cray.com [128.162.21.36]) by timbuk.cray.com (8.8.7/CRI-gate-news-1.3) with ESMTP id XAA08615 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 23:03:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from esgi051.cray.com (esgi051 [128.162.105.161]) by ironwood.cray.com (8.8.4/CRI-ironwood-news-1.0) with ESMTP id XAA24502 for ; Tue, 18 Nov 1997 23:03:07 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Dalton Received: by esgi051.cray.com (8.8.0/btd-b3) id FAA05900; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 05:03:01 GMT Message-Id: <199711190503.FAA05900@esgi051.cray.com> Subject: Reminder on BEAM e-mail list usage. To: beam@webconn.com Date: Tue, 18 Nov 1997 23:03:01 -0600 (CST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24-CRI-d] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mwd@cray.com From: mwd@cray.com Subject: Reminder on BEAM e-mail list usage. PostedDate: 11/18/97 09:03:01 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/18/97 09:31:37 PM-11/18/97 09:31:38 PM DeliveredDate: 11/18/97 09:31:38 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US 1. NOTE: All mailing list requests subscribe/unsubscribe should ONLY be sent to: beam-request@webconn.com ^^^^^^^ This is fairly common across non-majordomo e-mail list. This is also sent to _every_ person as they sign up, and is on the WWW pages. Also any administrative questions should _only_ be sent to that address. 2. The idea/concept of this e-mail list is to provide a place to discuss and share information about BEAM Robotics. To encourage sharing of ideas, resources, and minds to make understanding and building easier. Also this is a method of letting people know of new ideas, resources, meetings, and competitions. Below is my generic list of sites I send out periodically. Mark ===================== Here is a note on the general information available and a list of some of the WWW sites organized by categories. I do have this list setup to be archived now you can get more BEAM information and access to the archives at: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html The FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) is at: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html BEAM Tek.. page - more info, schematics, etc. http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/technical.html http://sst.lanl.gov/robot/ <-- Home of BEAM. http://www.solarbotics.com/ http://www.golden.net/~amiller/beam.htm http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-index.html India Games: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam-india.html e-mail list: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html For a beginner site.. The FAQ (actually for all levels): http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html#q2 http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/9879/homepage.htm I wrote some stuff on soldering/getting started: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam/solder.html BEAM Web ring: (You can start from various sites) http://www.ix.net.au/~tink/beam/ Parts listings: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam/parts.html http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/robot/resource.html Course of study in BEAM robotics (part of the FAQ/BEAM Tek): http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/technical.html#CourseOfStudy Building a simple solar engine: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/oscillate.html http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/beam.gif http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/9879/solaroll.htm Bibliography: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam/beam_bib.html Photovores: http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/9879/photovor.htm http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-index.html Walkers/Microcores: http://www.golden.net/~amiller/ http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html#q4 http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/technical.html http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/9879/microcor.htm Also see the Bibliography and patent: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam/beam_bib.html http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam/mwt/patent.html Pictures: http://www.solarbotics.com/ http://www.iupui.edu/~khaupt/robots.html BEAM Kits: http://www.solarbotics.com/ Events: http://sst.lanl.gov/robot/html/events.html http://sst.lanl.gov/robot/html/upcoming.html http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam-india.html - India game and rules This should give people a good start. Thanks! Mark -- Mark Dalton CH3-S-CH2 H H O H SGI/Cray Research | | | \ | Eagan, MN 55121 CH2-C-COO //\ ---C--CH2-C-COO C-CH2-C-COO mwd@cray.com | | || || | // | NH3 \\/ \ / CH NH3 O NH3 NH My home page: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/mwd.html BEAM Robotics: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html WWW Cell Bio. course: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/cell.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256554.007D6E76; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 14:50:02 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09071 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 14:40:01 -0800 From: RandyTaylo@aol.com Received: from mrin44.mail.aol.com (mrin44.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.154]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23913 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:00:05 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin44.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA03680 for beam@webconn.com; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:56:11 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:56:11 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971119165610_1839003599@mrin44.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: servos SMTPOriginator: RandyTaylo@aol.com From: RandyTaylo@aol.com Subject: servos PostedDate: 11/19/97 01:56:11 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 02:50:10 PM-11/19/97 02:50:12 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 02:50:12 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US To add to the item where someone suggested pwm for servos..... There was construction article in pop elec (I think) within last year or so which used two modified servos and a basic stamp to drive a small wheeled vehicle with bumpers so it could turn away from an object....and back away if that failed. It works fine....stamp sends one pulse width to go forward...another to go backward...and another to hold still. You have to arrive at the proper pulse widths for your particular servos by experimentation....but the values in the article are close enough to require only a little experimenting. It only takes two bits of the stamp's output to do this...one per servo. and of course, one per bumper switch. (two) Servos had two mods....remove the link to the feedback pot....and cut off the tab that limits the rotation of the output shaft....both very easy...and both documented in the article....I lost the article but still have the result. Randy $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256554.007E26FA; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 14:57:55 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA09124 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 14:48:00 -0800 From: RandyTaylo@aol.com Received: from mrin42.mail.aol.com (mrin42.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.152]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23951 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:04:25 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin42.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA07972 for beam@webconn.com; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:00:32 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:00:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971119170030_-155151791@mrin42.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Basic stamps anyone? SMTPOriginator: RandyTaylo@aol.com From: RandyTaylo@aol.com Subject: Basic stamps anyone? PostedDate: 11/19/97 02:00:32 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 02:58:00 PM-11/19/97 02:58:02 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 02:58:02 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US y'all have been talking about microcontrollers. I like the basic stamps...easy to use..rich in features...and you dont have to buy a programming kit. The documentation is on PARALLAX's web site in acrobat format..rich in examples and explanations nowadays. The pc-resident part of the programming kit is also available for download free on the site. The programming cable can be made up for the stamp one and any old serial cable will work fine for stamp two. Y'all might have tried and eliminated stamp as viable...don't know...but thought I'd throw it out...great machine for duffers like me. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.00024C3D; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:25:05 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA09415 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 16:15:05 -0800 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA24429 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:18:25 -0600 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id PAA19718; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 15:14:29 -0800 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199711192314.PAA19718@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: Re: servos To: RandyTaylo@aol.com Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 15:14:29 -0800 (PST) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <971119165610_1839003599@mrin44.mail.aol.com> from "RandyTaylo@aol.com" at Nov 19, 97 04:56:11 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: Re: servos PostedDate: 11/19/97 03:14:29 PM SendTo: RandyTaylo@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 04:25:16 PM-11/19/97 04:25:18 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 04:25:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Nuts & Volts magazine vol 18 number 10 (Oct 1997) has a 555 schematic for testing a servo via a potentiometer. I could imagine using a 556 to drive two of these with a photocell inserted in each 555 and biased for proper operation. Then you'd have a servo photovore. Once this is working, the photocell can be interfaced th a to some spring sensors.. then you've got pseudo-intelligent behavior. > > To add to the item where someone suggested pwm for servos..... > > There was construction article in pop elec (I think) within last year or so > which used two modified servos and a basic stamp to drive a small wheeled > vehicle with bumpers so it could turn away from an object....and back away if > that failed. > > It works fine....stamp sends one pulse width to go forward...another to go > backward...and another to hold still. > > You have to arrive at the proper pulse widths for your particular servos by > experimentation....but the values in the article are close enough to require > only a little experimenting. > > It only takes two bits of the stamp's output to do this...one per servo. > and of course, one per bumper switch. (two) > > Servos had two mods....remove the link to the feedback pot....and cut off the > tab that limits the rotation of the output shaft....both very easy...and both > documented in the article....I lost the article but still have the result. > > Randy > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0006A0AA; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:12:23 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA09624 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:02:23 -0800 Received: from smtp03.primenet.com (smtp03.primenet.com [206.165.5.84]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA25110 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 19:01:11 -0600 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp03.primenet.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26193 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:57:15 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199711200057.RAA26193@smtp03.primenet.com> Received: from ip-22-227.phx.primenet.com(206.165.22.227), claiming to be "default" via SMTP by smtp03.primenet.com, id smtpd026190; Wed Nov 19 17:57:10 1997 Reply-To: <@primenet.com> From: "Greg Simon" To: Subject: 80c32 Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:55:47 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mtman@primenet.com From: mtman@primenet.com Subject: 80c32 PostedDate: 11/19/97 04:55:47 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 05:12:33 PM-11/19/97 05:12:33 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 05:12:33 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I have a few 80c32 processors that I would like to implement, does anyone know where I can find the Instruction set listing and a good assembler for this chip?? Thanks, Greg $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0007643F; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:20:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA09680 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:10:43 -0800 Received: from usr01.primenet.com (usr01.primenet.com [206.165.6.201]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA25064 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:58:32 -0600 Received: from default (ip-22-227.phx.primenet.com [206.165.22.227]) by usr01.primenet.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA18800 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:54:33 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199711200054.RAA18800@usr01.primenet.com> Reply-To: <@primenet.com> From: "Greg Simon" To: Subject: Cheap chassis Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:53:13 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mtman@primenet.com From: mtman@primenet.com Subject: Cheap chassis PostedDate: 11/19/97 04:53:13 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 05:20:53 PM-11/19/97 05:20:54 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 05:20:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm always looking for a few quick starts on my projects, saves time and headaches. Radio Shack has or had a bunch of stuff they were letting go for cheap, so I picked-up a few bodies to use. Garage sales are another good source for goodies, I picked up a complete Honeywell house alarm for 5 bucks and it works after 20 minutes of work!!!! So remember not to pass up some of the most unlikely looking places, you just might find something useful. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.00097286; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:43:11 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA09787 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 17:33:15 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA25345 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 19:22:35 -0600 Received: from ts33ip165.cadvision.com (ts70ip233.cadvision.com [207.228.75.233]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id SAA10006 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:18:37 -0700 Received: by ts33ip165.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF520.11FA34A0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com>; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 19:19:34 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF520.11FA34A0@ts33ip165.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: My RW '98 bot Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 19:19:32 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: My RW '98 bot PostedDate: 11/19/97 06:19:32 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 05:43:21 PM-11/19/97 05:43:22 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 05:43:22 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm working out materials to build it. I've decided on getting 2 micromo motors, which are a tad bit high current flow, around 1A to 3 A, I will go for lower draining motors, I just chose some high lbs pr sq in. motors first, with robot wars you never know what the competition is using. Finding a power source for it is very difficult, I can get around 300 mA from a Nic-Cad D battery. Lead-acid batterys might work, or car batterys, but those cost a lot, and I ain't spending $50 everytime a battery dies. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.000E6946; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:37:24 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA09967 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 18:27:23 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25743 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 20:13:42 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA16592 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:09:14 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711200209.VAA16592@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp32.buffnet.net(205.246.19.211) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma022326; Wed, 19 Nov 97 21:08:30 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: BEam volume. Date: Sat, 8 Nov 1997 21:17:33 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: BEam volume. PostedDate: 11/08/97 06:17:33 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 06:37:27 PM-11/19/97 06:37:27 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 06:37:27 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Either I'm not getting all my mesages or you might notice that the volume of BEAM mail has decreased signifigantly. I uesd to check my e-mail with the pleasent load of 15, now it's like 2 or three. There must be more building than talk now a days!!! Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.001CBCC4; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:13:53 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA10157 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:03:57 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA26567 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 22:17:53 -0600 Received: from ts33ip165.cadvision.com (ts70ip233.cadvision.com [207.228.75.233]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id VAA55620; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:13:44 -0700 Received: by ts33ip165.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF538.8A390E60@ts33ip165.cadvision.com>; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 22:14:44 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF538.8A390E60@ts33ip165.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Dennison'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: BEam volume. Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 22:14:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: BEam volume. PostedDate: 11/19/97 09:14:43 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 09:13:56 PM-11/19/97 09:13:56 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 09:13:56 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Actually Alot of people on the list are in India, for the games... -----Original Message----- From: Dennison [SMTP:dennlill@buffnet.net] Sent: Saturday, November 08, 1997 7:18 PM To: BEAM Subject: BEam volume. Either I'm not getting all my mesages or you might notice that the volume of BEAM mail has decreased signifigantly. I uesd to check my e-mail with the pleasent load of 15, now it's like 2 or three. There must be more building than talk now a days!!! Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.001EA32D; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:34:38 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA10193 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:24:43 -0800 Received: from speco.springercoop.com ([206.206.184.226]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA26738 for ; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 22:45:57 -0600 Received: from [206.206.184.245] ([206.206.184.245]) by speco.springercoop.com (8.7.6/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA23705; Wed, 19 Nov 1997 21:45:05 -0700 Message-Id: <199711200445.VAA23705@speco.springercoop.com> Subject: Re: BEam volume. Date: Mon, 4 Aug 97 21:43:41 -0700 x-mailer: Claris Emailer 1.1 From: synet To: "Dennison" , "BEAM" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" SMTPOriginator: cibern@springercoop.com From: cibern@springercoop.com Subject: Re: BEam volume. PostedDate: 08/04/97 09:43:41 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/19/97 09:34:41 PM-11/19/97 09:34:41 PM DeliveredDate: 11/19/97 09:34:41 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Yep i've noticed! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0041B272; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:10:52 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA10428 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 00:54:34 -0800 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu [129.130.99.129]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA29209 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:34:37 -0600 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id CAA07503 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:35:37 -0600 Sender: dwhall@fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu Message-ID: <3473F658.5EB8C72@ksu.edu> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:35:36 -0600 From: Dean Hall Organization: EGM Design X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Cheap chassis References: <199711200054.RAA18800@usr01.primenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dwhall@ksu.edu From: dwhall@ksu.edu Subject: Re: Cheap chassis PostedDate: 11/20/97 12:35:36 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 02:11:02 AM-11/20/97 02:11:04 AM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 02:11:04 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Greg Simon wrote: > > I'm always looking for a few quick starts on my projects, saves time and > headaches. > > Radio Shack has or had a bunch of stuff they were letting go for cheap, so > I picked-up a few bodies to use. > Garage sales are another good source for goodies, I picked up a complete > Honeywell house alarm for 5 bucks and it works after 20 minutes of work!!!! > > So remember not to pass up some of the most unlikely looking places, > you just might find something useful. my recent kick is aluminum cans. cut 'em into a planar sheet, and corrugate to add rigidity. careful not to crease, the thin Al tears like paper. easy to drill. !!Dean $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0041C722; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:25:21 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA10477 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 02:15:07 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA29758 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 04:01:08 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-00.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.1]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id KAA02511; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:56:50 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:04:58 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: RandyTaylo@aol.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Basic stamps anyone? In-Reply-To: <971119170030_-155151791@mrin42.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Basic stamps anyone? PostedDate: 11/20/97 02:04:58 AM SendTo: RandyTaylo@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 02:25:31 AM-11/20/97 02:25:32 AM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 02:25:32 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Wed, 19 Nov 1997 RandyTaylo@aol.com wrote: > I like the basic stamps...easy to use..rich in features...and you dont have > to buy a programming kit. While they have nice features, they are also slow, they lack interrupts, the `instruction set' is limited, and they are fairly expensive. The AT90S1200 can do anything a stamp does, is very fast, has several interrupts (analog comparator, timer, i/o pin), and costs about $5. Also, you don't have to buy a programming kit - al the software is available on the Net for $0, and the hardware for programming is just a cable. Like the stamp, it can be programmed in-circuit. > The documentation is on PARALLAX's web site in acrobat format..rich in > examples and explanations nowadays. Documentation (especially the examples!) is a stamp strong point. > The pc-resident part of the programming kit is also available for download > free on the site. Just as true for the 1200. > The programming cable can be made up for the stamp one and any old serial > cable will work fine for stamp two. The cable for the 1200 you'd have to build. > Y'all might have tried and eliminated stamp as viable...don't know...but > thought I'd throw it out...great machine for duffers like me. The stamp will certainly do some work, but it is limited and relatively expensive, and there still is a learning curve. Programming a micro-controller in assembly really isn't that hard! None of the stuff I'm working on (my Spider's `eye' and sound direction finding, both doing well) would be possible without interrupts. Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0053CB1F; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 07:15:14 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA10744 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 07:05:19 -0800 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA31141 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 08:50:24 -0600 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id GAA20318; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 06:46:26 -0800 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199711201446.GAA20318@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: Re: 80c32 To: @primenet.com Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 06:46:25 -0800 (PST) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <199711200057.RAA26193@smtp03.primenet.com> from "Greg Simon" at Nov 19, 97 05:55:47 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: Re: 80c32 PostedDate: 11/20/97 06:46:25 AM CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 07:15:20 AM-11/20/97 07:15:20 AM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 07:15:20 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US You can call Intel literature center at 800-548-4725 and ask for the manual for this chip. But it isn't a good idea. It doesn't contain any ROM so your code would have to be stored on external EPROM. That requires much more current and in this case would also require a latch because the bus is multiplexed. (And you'd need an EPROM burner). This would only leave port 3 open (8 pins). Quite a waste. (Btw: The 80c32 is the ROMless version of the 87c52.) A much better way to go would be to use Atmel's 89c52 which is a Flash ROM equivalent. But both chips are overkill for BEAM. With the Atmel part, you'd have 4 ports with 8 pins each. Are you really going to be adding that many sensors? Probably not. And even if you were, it would be a much better solution to multiplex the sensors outside the chip (ie: parallel to serial chip) instead of requiring the CPU itself to have that many pins. But to answer your original question, check on the Chip Directory for a big page on 8051's (that's the generic family of the chip you've got). www.hitex.com/chipdir > > I have a few 80c32 processors that I would like to implement, does anyone > know where I can find the Instruction set listing and a good assembler for > this chip?? > Thanks, > Greg $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.00560E70; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 07:39:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA10788 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 07:29:42 -0800 Received: from baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca (baldric.CIS.McMaster.CA [130.113.64.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA31291 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:11:52 -0600 Received: from empA-port9.net.McMaster.CA by baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca with SMTP id AA21975 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:07:26 -0500 Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 10:07:26 -0500 Message-Id: <199711201507.AA21975@baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca> X-Sender: philipjb@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 1.4.4 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: Martin Mladek , Steven Bolt , "'beam@webconn.com'" From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca (Josh) Subject: AT90S1200 - enabling the clock timer SMTPOriginator: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca From: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca Subject: AT90S1200 - enabling the clock timer PostedDate: 11/20/97 07:07:26 AM SendTo: mmladek@interlog.com,sbolt@xs4all.nl,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 07:40:10 AM-11/20/97 07:40:11 AM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 07:40:11 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US hi there steve. I'm taking advantage of the fact you said i can ask you questions. So.... I've got the AT90s1200. A couple of issues. I just wanted to double check with someone with experience as to how to enable the internal oscillator (i.e. the RCEN fuse has disabled the clock as we failed to order the clock enabled). I don't want to fry a chip (mike trecieski (my partner) already did by printing to the parallel port where the programmer was plugged in ....HA ) and I wanted to clarify the instructions. How exactly would i do this using a solderless breadboard? Do i simply set the logic levels according to the commands i'd like to load, and then pulse the xtal port by hand? This is what i was gonna do---is this how you'd do it? That's all for now....(i.e. more to come- if you still don't mind) thanks. Steve- I'm sorry that this is such a shittily (sp?) tedious email to reply to - but this is my first xperience.... ************************************** /josh $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.0062DB2D; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:59:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA11202 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 09:49:50 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA32339 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 11:31:53 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-15.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.16]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id SAA25260; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 18:27:38 +0100 (CET) Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 18:35:45 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: Josh cc: Martin Mladek , "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Re: AT90S1200 - enabling the clock timer In-Reply-To: <199711201507.AA21975@baldric.cis.mcmaster.ca> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: AT90S1200 - enabling the clock timer PostedDate: 11/20/97 09:35:45 AM SendTo: phililpjb@mcmaster.ca CopyTo: mmladek@interlog.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 09:59:51 AM-11/20/97 09:59:52 AM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 09:59:52 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Thu, 20 Nov 1997, Josh wrote: > I've got the AT90s1200. A couple of issues. > > I just wanted to double check with someone with experience as to > how to enable the internal oscillator (i.e. the RCEN fuse has > disabled the clock as we failed to order the clock enabled). ----8<----- > How exactly would i do this using a solderless breadboard? Do i > simply set the logic levels according to the commands i'd like to > load, and then pulse the xtal port by hand? This is what i was > gonna do---is this how you'd do it? The AT90S1200 has two `fuse bits': SPI enables/disables serial programming, RCEN enables/disables the on-chip RC clock generator, which provides about 1MHz. Both fuse bits can only be set and cleared by a parallel programmer. As serial programming is much more convenient (not requiring special hardware, allows programming the chip while it's part of the target circuitry) Atmel sells two versions: the AT90S1200 with on-chip clock disabled, and the AT90S1200A with the clock enabled. In some minimalist applications the on-chip clock is nice to have, but you usually want a higher clock speed, and accurate (crystal based) timing is often nice to have. So in most cases, you will order the 1200 with clock disabled. These are the usual ways to clock the chip: 1) If your project is certain to not require accurate timing, you look for a spare Schmitt-trigger or a couple of gates somewhere in your design, and use it or them to create an RC oscillator. That's cheap, and you can select the speed you want (the on-chip oscillator is fixed at about 1 MHz). 2) If you feel you might require accurate timing, use a 4MHz crystal and two 27pF capacitors as shown in my `eye' example: http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/Images/eye_diagram.gif To which I might add that a 4MHz crystal is cheap (about one dollar), that accurate timing often proves to be useful, and that the 1200 gives excellent performance at 4MHz - power requirements still very low, and processing speed close to 4 MIPS. If I really wanted to change a 1200 into a 1200A, I would not resort to improvised parallel programming. The best solution is perhaps to write a program for a second 1200, turning it into a parallel programmer, able only to set/clear the fuse bits. That could be a stand-alone device consisting of little more than a 1200, a Zip socket for the 1200 to program, a couple of switches and a 5/12V supply (at clock speeds upto 4MHz, the 1200 works fine with Vcc as low as 2.7V, but parallel programming requires 12V on reset). Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256555.008251CA; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 15:43:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA12161 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 15:33:25 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA01308 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:46:47 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA00824 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 17:42:09 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711202242.RAA00824@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp13.buffnet.net(205.246.19.120) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma017590; Thu, 20 Nov 97 17:41:02 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Hard Core Amtel1200 Date: Sun, 9 Nov 1997 17:50:07 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Hard Core Amtel1200 PostedDate: 11/09/97 02:50:07 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 03:43:32 PM-11/20/97 03:43:34 PM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 03:43:34 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I've heard too much good stuff about this amtell part. I also heard about some free offer. And now, my interest is peaked and I'm looking for some reall hardcore info on this amtell. Help anyone? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.00007EFE; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:05:25 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA12225 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 15:55:23 -0800 From: korus@planet.eon.net Received: from planet.eon.net (eeyore.eon.net [199.185.220.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01678 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 17:56:35 -0600 Received: from roger ([199.185.224.102]) by planet.eon.net with SMTP id <148597-4971>; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:58:27 -0700 Message-ID: <3474CCF8.1BA5@planet.eon.net> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:51:20 -0700 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: BEam volume. References: <199711200209.VAA16592@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: korus@planet.eon.net From: korus@planet.eon.net Subject: Re: BEam volume. PostedDate: 11/20/97 03:51:20 PM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 04:05:28 PM-11/20/97 04:05:29 PM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 04:05:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US My theory is that because some of the most participant members of the e-mail list are at the Beam Games at India Roger $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.00011DA9; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:12:11 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA12235 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:02:09 -0800 Received: from swiss.direct.ca (swiss.direct.ca [199.60.229.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA01639 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 17:52:34 -0600 Received: from nan-as-01c05.direct.ca [204.174.246.133] by swiss.direct.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.70 #1) id 0xYgKd-0003Kn-00; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 15:48:24 -0800 Message-ID: <3474CB69.E82C433A@direct.ca> Date: Thu, 20 Nov 1997 15:44:41 -0800 From: Matt Currie X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: fussy microcore Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit $FILE: SMTPOriginator: mjcurrie@direct.ca From: mjcurrie@direct.ca Subject: fussy microcore PostedDate: 11/20/97 03:44:41 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 04:12:17 PM-11/20/97 04:12:19 PM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 04:12:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US - att1.htm $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.000358F3; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:36:33 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA12360 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 16:26:31 -0800 Received: from socrates.uss.net (mail.uss.net [209.100.88.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA01913 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 18:21:11 -0600 Received: from mess ([209.100.89.68]) by socrates.uss.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-34205U5000L100S0) with ESMTP id AAC17698 for ; Thu, 20 Nov 1997 18:08:31 -0600 Reply-To: From: "Matt" To: "Beam Robotics List!" Subject: aqua bot. Date: Fri, 26 Sep 1997 18:00:00 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19971121000825.AAC17698@mess> SMTPOriginator: lande@uss.net From: lande@uss.net Subject: aqua bot. PostedDate: 09/26/97 04:00:00 PM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: lande@uss.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/20/97 04:36:36 PM-11/20/97 04:36:37 PM DeliveredDate: 11/20/97 04:36:37 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey, would it be practical to build a water robot? I you could get the casing and all waterproofed, would the power requied to run it under water be under the requirements for a beambot? Thanx a bunch! Matt Good. Yes, That's my real name. Email - lande@uss.net http://www.geocities.com/siliconvalley/peaks/9754 $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.004165F2; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 01:30:39 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA13123 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 01:20:43 -0800 Received: from HWS3.hws.edu (www3.hws.edu [205.232.67.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA04627 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 03:05:27 -0600 Received: from hws.edu by hws.edu (PMDF V5.0-6 #22556) id <01IQ9ANQCV5C000QON@hws.edu> for beam@webconn.com; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 04:01:56 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 04:01:56 -0500 (EST) From: Amit Bhavsar Subject: games in India! To: beam list Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT SMTPOriginator: BHAVSAR@hws.edu From: bhavsar@hws.edu Subject: games in India! PostedDate: 11/21/97 01:01:56 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 01:30:53 AM-11/21/97 01:30:54 AM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 01:30:54 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Does anyone have any pictures of the games in India...or does anyone plan to put some up soon? -Amit $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.005ADA75; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 08:32:21 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA13533 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 08:22:19 -0800 Received: from driene.student.utwente.nl (driene.student.utwente.nl [130.89.220.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA06499 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:48:00 -0600 Received: from cal052302.student.utwente.nl by driene.student.utwente.nl with SMTP id AA09525 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Fri, 21 Nov 1997 16:43:49 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971121152130.00679590@mail.student.utwente.nl> X-Sender: s9301798@mail.student.utwente.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 16:21:30 +0100 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark van dijk Subject: Re: aqua bot. SMTPOriginator: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl From: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl Subject: Re: aqua bot. PostedDate: 11/21/97 07:21:30 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 08:32:24 AM-11/21/97 08:32:25 AM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 08:32:25 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 18:00 26/09/97 -0500, you wrote: >Hey, would it be practical to build a water robot? I you could get the >casing and all waterproofed, would the power requied to run it under water >be under the requirements for a beambot? Thanx a bunch! I think it would be practical when you also have solved these problems: 1) Using the Solarcel under water is still very difficult. So what would you use to provide the power to keep your aqua bot functioning (or is it alife). 2) Due to extra friction/resistance in water a larger motor should be used, which would require more power. I think you wanted to decrease the mass of the robot, if thats treu, perhaps one should make the bot with SMD components and other light stuff, like plastic legs in stead of metal legs. Or just use more efficient motors with less mass. Greetings, Mark van Dijk ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.00604011; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:31:18 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA13704 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:21:20 -0800 Received: from ns2.unisource.be (ns2.unisource.be [194.119.225.57]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA07002 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:01:32 -0600 Received: from mailgate.unisource.be (MAILGATE.unisource.be [194.119.228.11]) by ns2.unisource.be (8.8.2/8.8.2) with SMTP id RAA05923; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 17:53:22 +0100 (MET) Received: by mailgate.unisource.be with Microsoft Mail id <34763AB1@mailgate.unisource.be>; Fri, 21 Nov 97 17:51:45 PST From: "De Groote, Patrick" To: beam , Mark van dijk Subject: RE: aqua bot. Date: Fri, 21 Nov 97 17:49:00 PST Message-ID: <34763AB1@mailgate.unisource.be> Encoding: 57 TEXT X-Mailer: Microsoft Mail V3.0 SMTPOriginator: PDG@unisource.be From: PDG@unisource.be Subject: RE: aqua bot. PostedDate: 11/21/97 05:49:00 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com,m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 09:31:28 AM-11/21/97 09:31:29 AM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 09:31:29 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US just this little remark: If you want it to walk under water, you don't want it to be too light as it might start floating... rgds Patrick ---------- From: Mark van dijk[SMTP:m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl] Sent: 21 November 1997 16:21 To: beam Subject: Re: aqua bot. At 18:00 26/09/97 -0500, you wrote: >Hey, would it be practical to build a water robot? I you could get the >casing and all waterproofed, would the power requied to run it under water >be under the requirements for a beambot? Thanx a bunch! I think it would be practical when you also have solved these problems: 1) Using the Solarcel under water is still very difficult. So what would you use to provide the power to keep your aqua bot functioning (or is it alife). 2) Due to extra friction/resistance in water a larger motor should be used, which would require more power. I think you wanted to decrease the mass of the robot, if thats treu, perhaps one should make the bot with SMD components and other light stuff, like plastic legs in stead of metal legs. Or just use more efficient motors with less mass. Greetings, Mark van Dijk ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.00608452; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:34:13 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA13721 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:24:16 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA07006 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:01:44 -0600 Received: from ts70ip247.cadvision.com (ts70ip247.cadvision.com [207.228.75.247]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id JAA40976; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 09:57:28 -0700 Received: by ts70ip247.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF66C.2D987BC0@ts70ip247.cadvision.com>; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 10:56:54 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF66C.2D987BC0@ts70ip247.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Amit Bhavsar'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: games in India! Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 10:56:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: games in India! PostedDate: 11/21/97 09:56:49 AM SendTo: bhavsar@hws.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 09:34:21 AM-11/21/97 09:34:24 AM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 09:34:24 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Okay now, the people who went to india aren't going to be back for around a week, Dave hrykniw may have tooken his video cam with him, he said he would take pictures....But the games aren't even finished yet, plus anyone who was invitied to the beam games could stay another few days while another event happens, some sort of a educational competition. The 12 hour flights are going to be killer jetlag for them, they will put them up asap. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin -----Original Message----- From: Amit Bhavsar [SMTP:bhavsar@hws.edu] Sent: Friday, November 21, 1997 2:02 AM To: beam list Subject: games in India! Does anyone have any pictures of the games in India...or does anyone plan to put some up soon? -Amit $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.006B8CDB; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:34:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA14146 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:24:47 -0800 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA07922 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 13:03:31 -0600 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.8/(cic-5, 10/28/97)) with SMTP id LAA29174 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 11:59:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA03903; Fri, 21 Nov 97 11:58:10 MST Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19971121152130.00679590@mail.student.utwente.nl> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:02:42 -0800 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Re: aqua bot. SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Re: aqua bot. PostedDate: 11/21/97 12:02:42 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 11:34:47 AM-11/21/97 11:34:48 AM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 11:34:48 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >>Hey, would it be practical to build a water robot? >I think it would be practical when you also have solved these problems: >1) Using the Solarcel under water is still very difficult. So what would you >use to provide the power to keep your aqua bot functioning (or is it alife). Amorphous solar cells under water are not a problem so long as the lead contacts are covered with superglue to insure insulation, and the wire insulation is clean and uncrimped so that no water can get to the copper. As a note, Panasonic suncerams still produce adequate power down to 3meters of swimming pool. It is possible to make a "ground hopper" sub. >2) Due to extra friction/resistance in water a larger motor should be used, >which would require more power. No, just a longer drive pulse. Typical running values for a small pager-engine beam torpedo are 8 seconds. It can accelerate over a meter during that time. >I think you wanted to decrease the mass of the robot, if thats treu, perhaps >one should make the bot with SMD components and other light stuff, like >plastic legs in stead of metal legs. Or just use more efficient motors with >less mass. The first BEAM torpedos found that the weight of the motor is difficult to get around. Fortunately, using closed heat shrink tubing as adjustable ballast tanks can compensate for most weight problems. This was necessary as we made the solarengine in a plastic missle case which we then filled with epoxy for insulation. Made it heavy though. markt. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256556.00735542; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:59:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA14657 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 12:49:40 -0800 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from mrin38.mail.aol.com (mrin38.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.148]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA08445 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 14:16:51 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin38.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id PAA23123 for beam@webconn.com; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 15:12:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 21 Nov 1997 15:12:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971121151243_881411822@mrin38> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Microcore SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Microcore PostedDate: 11/21/97 12:12:44 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 12:59:52 PM-11/21/97 12:59:52 PM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 12:59:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I am totally lost on this microcore stuff. Can someone just give me the basics on it? It does't have to be detailed I just want a basic understanding. Does anyone know how much it would cost to make the basic microcore circuit? $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.000C836D; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 18:16:40 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA23413 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 18:06:37 -0800 Received: from socrates.uss.net (mail.uss.net [209.100.88.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA10362 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 19:51:19 -0600 Received: from mess ([209.100.89.184]) by socrates.uss.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-34205U5000L100S0) with ESMTP id AAA9824 for ; Fri, 21 Nov 1997 19:38:37 -0600 Reply-To: From: "Matt" To: "Beam Robotics List!" Subject: Fw: aqua bot. Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 19:21:16 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19971122013835.AAA9824@mess> SMTPOriginator: lande@uss.net From: lande@uss.net Subject: Fw: aqua bot. PostedDate: 09/24/97 05:21:16 PM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: lande@uss.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/21/97 06:16:41 PM-11/21/97 06:16:43 PM DeliveredDate: 11/21/97 06:16:43 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > At 18:00 26/09/97 -0500, you wrote: > >Hey, would it be practical to build a water robot? I you could get the > >casing and all waterproofed, would the power requied to run it under water > >be under the requirements for a beambot? Thanx a bunch! > > I think it would be practical when you also have solved these problems: > 1) Using the Solarcel under water is still very difficult. So what would you > use to provide the power to keep your aqua bot functioning (or is it alife). > 2) Due to extra friction/resistance in water a larger motor should be used, > which would require more power. Um, i'm new, and I don't know. That's why I was asking, to get info on this kind of stuff. What do you all sudgest? > > I think you wanted to decrease the mass of the robot, if thats treu, perhaps > one should make the bot with SMD components and other light stuff, like What's an SMD component? > plastic legs in stead of metal legs. Or just use more efficient motors with > less mass. Who said anything about legs? I was thinking more along the lines of a propeller... > > Greetings, > > Mark van Dijk > > > > ------------- Think ----- > 1) What was there before there was anything? > 2) Does anything equal nothing? > > ------------- Act ----- > Think > > ------------- React ----- > email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl > aka : MuFFeD > > ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.004EB25C; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 06:19:34 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA24824 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 06:09:31 -0800 Received: from driene.student.utwente.nl (driene.student.utwente.nl [130.89.220.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA13620 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 07:51:33 -0600 Received: from cal052302.student.utwente.nl by driene.student.utwente.nl with SMTP id AA23127 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:47:17 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971122135151.00672c74@mail.student.utwente.nl> X-Sender: s9301798@mail.student.utwente.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:51:51 +0100 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark van dijk Subject: Re: Fw: aqua bot. SMTPOriginator: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl From: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl Subject: Re: Fw: aqua bot. PostedDate: 11/22/97 05:51:51 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:29:27 AM-11/24/97 08:29:31 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:29:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 19:21 24/09/97 -0500, Matt wrote: >What's an SMD component? I don't no for sure but this is what I think it is. An SMD (Surface Mounted Device) component is a very small electronic device one can put on a print without drilling holes. They are mostly used in places where size is important, like CCD cameras. They come as resistors, ic's, diodes, transistors and most other components. It's more difficult to attach the SMD components, their size makes them difficult to handle and often they need a special solder station. >Who said anything about legs? I was thinking more along the lines of a >propeller... Sorry, my mistake, I thought of legs, because I wanna make and prefer legged robots. Mark ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.0063DDF3; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 10:10:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA25464 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 10:00:51 -0800 Received: from hometown.hto.net (hto.net [205.146.103.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA14647 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:38:09 -0600 Received: from drifterm [205.146.103.140] by hometown.hto.net (SMTPD32-4.02) id A8683E20106; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:37:44 EST5EDT Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971122123640.0069d810@hto.net> X-Sender: myarian@hto.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:36:40 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Yarian Subject: 74C14 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: myarian@hto.net From: myarian@hto.net Subject: 74C14 PostedDate: 11/22/97 09:36:40 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:31:46 AM-11/24/97 08:31:49 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:31:49 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Anyone know where I can pick up a 74C14 for a microcore? I found them in Digi-Key, but they charge $5 shipping and handling charges and the chip only cost $0.88. I would rather not pay $5.88 for a 88 cent chip. Just as a note, Radio Shack had the 74ALS245 chip for like $1.24 and they will ship it to your house for a dollar. Not a bad deal... Also in Digi-key they offer two versions of the 74C14, a 14-dip and a SO-14. What is the difference? ___________________________ Mark Yarian YSC - Yarian Computer Services 1(412) 962-1435 myarian@hto.net www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/2639 ___________________________ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.006CEE11; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:49:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA25694 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:39:50 -0800 From: MattJasper@aol.com Received: from mrin38.mail.aol.com (mrin38.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.148]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15109 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:51:16 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin38.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id NAA07722 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 13:46:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 13:46:59 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971122134658_584158590@mrin38> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: What's wrong with this damn SE SMTPOriginator: MattJasper@aol.com From: MattJasper@aol.com Subject: What's wrong with this damn SE PostedDate: 11/22/97 10:46:59 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:32:35 AM-11/24/97 08:32:38 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:32:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I have an SE, which refuses to reliably trigger itself. I've tried Zeners, (3.0 to 3.6v) diodes (1N914 and 1N4001) and even resistors, to no avail. I'm using 2N3904 and 2N3906 trannies, a 0.22F memory retention cap, and a 2.2k bias resistor. My motor is a gyro type out of an Aiwa walkman. The solarcells are two Sunceram 24x22mm 3.5v 6mA ones. It's been driving me nuts for the last week, please can you help?! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.006D1204; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:51:20 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA25697 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:41:17 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15047 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:41:32 -0600 Received: from ts75ip70.cadvision.com (ts75ip70.cadvision.com [207.228.113.70]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id LAA134180; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:37:03 -0700 Received: by ts75ip70.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF743.3EE81D40@ts75ip70.cadvision.com>; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:36:24 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF743.3EE81D40@ts75ip70.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Mark Yarian'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: 74C14 Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:36:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: 74C14 PostedDate: 11/22/97 11:36:21 AM SendTo: myarian@hto.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:32:36 AM-11/24/97 08:32:38 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:32:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US You should use the 74hc14, the 74ls14 doesn't work so well, instead of buying components from digikey , look in your local yellow or white pages for electronic component stores in your city. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin -----Original Message----- From: Mark Yarian [SMTP:myarian@hto.net] Sent: Saturday, November 22, 1997 10:37 AM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: 74C14 Anyone know where I can pick up a 74C14 for a microcore? I found them in Digi-Key, but they charge $5 shipping and handling charges and the chip only cost $0.88. I would rather not pay $5.88 for a 88 cent chip. Just as a note, Radio Shack had the 74ALS245 chip for like $1.24 and they will ship it to your house for a dollar. Not a bad deal... Also in Digi-key they offer two versions of the 74C14, a 14-dip and a SO-14. What is the difference? ___________________________ Mark Yarian YSC - Yarian Computer Services 1(412) 962-1435 myarian@hto.net www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/2639 ___________________________ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.006DE373; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:00:16 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA25718 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 11:50:19 -0800 From: MattJasper@aol.com Received: from mrin51.mail.aol.com (mrin51.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.161]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA15023 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 12:34:03 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin51.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id NAA15910; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 13:29:44 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 13:29:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971122132943_361155573@mrin51.mail.aol.com> To: dennlill@buffnet.net, beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solar Engin Gyro. SMTPOriginator: MattJasper@aol.com From: MattJasper@aol.com Subject: Re: Solar Engin Gyro. PostedDate: 11/22/97 10:29:44 AM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:32:42 AM-11/24/97 08:32:44 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:32:44 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I also have a flat mtor out of a Walkman. MIne ain't that good actually, it has gyro properties as you mentioned but these have little or no effect on the finished roller. Also, mine has developed a sticky spot which makes it more than a tad ineffiecient! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256557.007DE3CC; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:55:03 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA25890 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:45:05 -0800 From: IMIvar@aol.com Received: from mrin51.mail.aol.com (mrin51.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.161]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA15806 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 14:32:13 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin51.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id PAA03842; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 15:27:41 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 15:27:41 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971122152739_1153909423@mrin51.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com cc: myarian@hto.net Subject: Re: 74C14 SMTPOriginator: IMIvar@aol.com From: IMIvar@aol.com Subject: Re: 74C14 PostedDate: 11/22/97 12:27:41 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com CopyTo: myarian@hto.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:34:43 AM-11/24/97 08:34:44 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:34:45 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In a message dated 97-11-22 15:20:52 EST, you write: > Anyone know where I can pick up a 74C14 for a microcore? I found them in > Digi-Key, but they charge $5 shipping and handling charges and the chip > only cost $0.88. I would rather not pay $5.88 for a 88 cent chip. Usually, I just order $25 or more worth of stuff. If you have an order greater than $25, they pay shipping. So, I order a bunch of .22uF capactors, maybe some odd resistors, solarengine parts, 74ALS245's, etc, until I have $25 worth. (It goes a lot faster than you think....) You have to anticipate what you might need. > Just as > a note, Radio Shack had the 74ALS245 chip for like $1.24 and they will ship > it to your house for a dollar. Not a bad deal... Also in Digi-key they > offer two versions of the 74C14, a 14-dip and a SO-14. What is the > difference? You probably want the 14-DIP. The SO-14 is a surface mount chip, I believe. It's possible to use surface mount stuff for Beam circuits, but it's usually not worth it unless you need it really small. Just my 2 cents. Ivar Thorson -- http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/9879/homepage.htm -- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256558.00031221; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 16:33:32 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA25967 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 16:23:35 -0800 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from mrin53.mail.aol.com (mrin53.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.163]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA16928 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 17:16:17 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin53.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id SAA09071 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 18:11:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 18:11:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971122181157_139625336@mrin53.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: BEAM in Florida SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: BEAM in Florida PostedDate: 11/22/97 03:11:58 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:35:13 AM-11/24/97 08:35:13 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:35:13 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Are there any beamers in Florida? Mainly South Florida Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256558.00137CF3; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 19:32:51 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA26116 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 19:22:48 -0800 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from mrin39.mail.aol.com (mrin39.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.149]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA17907 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 20:00:31 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin39.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id UAA14613 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 20:55:54 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 20:55:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971122205554_528912310@mrin39> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Microcore SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Microcore PostedDate: 11/22/97 05:55:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:36:05 AM-11/24/97 08:36:06 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:36:06 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I have asked you to tell me what a microcore really is. I have tried to read up on the info on the microcore, but it is just too hard to understand. So far it looks like the microcore is just a bunch of timers put in series. But how is a Nu or a Nv formed? What are the PNC's, PIC's, etc.? Can someone just break it down a bit, so that someone like me could understand it? Thanks, Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256558.001CA34F; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:12:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA26198 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:02:32 -0800 Received: from timbuk.cray.com (timbuk-anet.cray.com [128.162.19.7]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18974 for ; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:06:03 -0600 Received: from ironwood.cray.com (root@ironwood-fddi.cray.com [128.162.21.36]) by timbuk.cray.com (8.8.7/CRI-gate-news-1.3) with ESMTP id VAA05946; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:01:32 -0600 (CST) Received: from esgi051.cray.com (esgi051 [128.162.105.161]) by ironwood.cray.com (8.8.4/CRI-ironwood-news-1.0) with ESMTP id VAA00392; Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:01:31 -0600 (CST) From: Mark Dalton Received: by esgi051.cray.com (8.8.0/btd-b3) id DAA11381; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 03:01:30 GMT Message-Id: <199711230301.DAA11381@esgi051.cray.com> Subject: Re: Microcore To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Date: Sat, 22 Nov 1997 21:01:30 -0600 (CST) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <971122205554_528912310@mrin39> from "NeTKiLL78@aol.com" at Nov 22, 97 08:55:54 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24-CRI-d] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mwd@cray.com From: mwd@cray.com Subject: Re: Microcore PostedDate: 11/22/97 07:01:30 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:36:38 AM-11/24/97 08:36:39 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:36:39 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US This is well documented on the WWW.. http://www.golden.net/~amiller/beam.htm http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/main.html Specifically: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/nvnet.html The definitions list: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/defs.html - This describes many of the abbreviations you mentioned. These do break it down and even explain how to build one step by step. Perhaps telling where you are seeing the terms you don't understand like the exact URL address will help in explaining where you question comes from and getting it cleared up for others. A PIC - is normally a type of CPU that is rarely used in BEAM currently It is normally used as a human interface/control of a machine or robot. The idea for BEAM is to place the CPU over the robot, so rather than having a autonomous robot you have a human controlled robot through programming high level 'goals'. The 'Stamp' is one type of PIC processor. Mark -- Mark Dalton CH3-S-CH2 H H O H SGI/Cray Research | | | \ | Eagan, MN 55121 CH2-C-COO //\ ---C--CH2-C-COO C-CH2-C-COO mwd@cray.com | | || || | // | NH3 \\/ \ / CH NH3 O NH3 NH My home page: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/mwd.html BEAM Robotics: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html WWW Cell Bio. course: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/cell.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256558.007D1E48; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 14:46:37 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@[206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA26794 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 14:36:25 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA24054 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 14:30:03 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm05-09.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.138]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA25891 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:25:34 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711232025.VAA25891@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "Mea Culpa" To: Subject: My walkers and his problems Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:24:56 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl From: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: My walkers and his problems PostedDate: 11/23/97 12:24:56 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:41:33 AM-11/24/97 08:41:36 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:41:36 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello I like to share my experiences with building a four-legged walker with a MicroCore. And yes, i am enthousiastic about it. I made several experimental microcore's and H-bridges before i found a design [read pcb] that i liked. I noticed also that building a walker isn't that easy. I was trying to do it from electronic to mechanic but that approach didn't work well. I changed my plans and started to build from te bottom up. I made a small frame and attached te motors to it. The frame was made of to massive electric copper wires [2.5 mm2] and at each end i solder a piece of pcb strip to keep these wires parallel. I drilled a hole in the pcb strips and attached the motors to them. Just with a battery i tried the motors and a step by step walking gait. After that i new how much space i had between the motor for a PCB. That room wasn't enough for the MicroCore and two H-bridges so i made the second h-bridge on a seperate print and stack it ontop of the other print. The main pbc was soldered to the two frame wires to give them more structual strenght. The two motor i use where two small 1.5-3V motor with gearbox from Conrad. They turn 27 rpm and could give a torque of about 2 kg according the salesman. [this would kill them eventually..] They are real nice motors with draw 20-25 mA when active. They have only one drawback and that is that they have a few gears that are made of plastic.. After problems with pulse lenghts, pulse distrubution to the motors and balance i managed to get the beast walking. I use a 4 nv microcore which drive directly the h-bridge. The motors turned turn more to one side then the other. This problem in solved because of a hint from the old-archive. Balance the two 1 meg R with one adjustable R. I also made some restriction to the legs so they won't turn to far. I made the MicroCore self stabilizing but there is still one major problem. When i turn on the power the motors turn to one direction and they keep pushing the legs agains the tabs. This and because i made the R feeding the h-bridge to small damaged the plastic gears. One gearwheel is now toothless... I disassembled the gearboxes and i am able to make one of them good working again. The other motor is still oke and can be use for a photovore or something. The problem with turning the motors when starting up still has to be solved. I also think that using real end-switched instead of tabs are better when restricting the DOF of the leg. This will turn of the power to the motor and prevent then from damaging the gears. Overal i am pleased with the experience i had with this walker. I planning to build one again, and now with new ideas.... A.A. van Zoelen. Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.0002E107; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 16:31:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA26842 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 16:21:18 -0800 Received: from hometown.hto.net (hto.net [205.146.103.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA24876 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 17:19:28 -0600 Received: from drifterm [205.146.103.110] by hometown.hto.net (SMTPD32-4.02) id A9E4274013A; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 18:19:00 EST5EDT Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971123181746.0069ed6c@hto.net> X-Sender: myarian@hto.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 18:17:46 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Yarian Subject: Re: 74C14 In-Reply-To: <971122152739_1153909423@mrin51.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: myarian@hto.net From: myarian@hto.net Subject: Re: 74C14 PostedDate: 11/23/97 03:17:46 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:41:50 AM-11/24/97 08:41:52 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:41:52 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 03:27 PM 11/22/97 -0500, you wrote: >Usually, I just order $25 or more worth of stuff. If you have an order >greater than $25, they pay shipping. So, I order a bunch of .22uF capactors, >maybe some odd resistors, solarengine parts, 74ALS245's, etc, until I have >$25 worth. (It goes a lot faster than you think....) You have to anticipate >what you might need. Yeah, I know... The thing is, I am only going to be building a few of these things. I am just building it for the learning exp. I am currently building a bigger robot that is programmable, but I would like to learn as much as I can to make it next near to perfect. I hate having a million ideas on what I would like to see in the finished prototype, but not having the know how to do it... :( >You probably want the 14-DIP. The SO-14 is a surface mount chip, I believe. >It's possible to use surface mount stuff for Beam circuits, but it's usually >not worth it unless you need it really small. Well, I am tossing the idea around of making like 10 or 20 microcores about an inch big running off of a watch-type battery. Each one would have something different about them (weight, power, motors, etc...) and put them in like a small area, roughly a 10' x 10' enclosed area and see which ones survive the best. (My own BEAM war).... That way I can figure out which characteristics are most important in the type of modifications I am going to make to my current project... ___________________________ Mark Yarian YSC - Yarian Computer Services 1(412) 962-1435 myarian@hto.net www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/2639 ___________________________ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.00127DDD; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:21:58 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA27053 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:11:53 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25867 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:13:28 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA26678 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 21:08:12 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711240208.VAA26678@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp36.buffnet.net(205.246.19.143) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma020074; Sun, 23 Nov 97 16:22:55 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Hot Glue and Battery covers Date: Wed, 12 Nov 1997 16:32:04 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Hot Glue and Battery covers PostedDate: 11/12/97 01:32:04 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:43:50 AM-11/24/97 08:43:53 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:43:53 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I know many people talk about Epoxy and superglue as prefered structural adhesives I would like to put in a good word for Hot glue guns. If used in small amounts it is weak unless the surface is scored, it will not bind very well. BUT if used in larger proportions it becomse a formidably strong adhesive. This is because when a large amount salidifys it becomes as hard as the glue sticks are, and thats pretty tough, Also it has merits because it isn't permanent. It is very easy for you to (once it's cool) to westle with it for a while and then peal it off. It really is usefull. Battery Covers. I have what I feel is almost the perfect substance for Walker bodies, Battery covers. What is so nice is that they are nice long rectangles of stiff plastic. Even if the plastic case for a device itself is injection molded into smooth shapes, it's batter cover will often be flat and square, perfect for mounting motors on either end. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.001462C2; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:42:40 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA27067 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:32:40 -0800 Received: from smtp02.primenet.com (smtp02.primenet.com [206.165.6.132]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA26013 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 20:45:03 -0600 Received: (from daemon@localhost) by smtp02.primenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) id TAA03477 for ; Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:43:44 -0700 (MST) Message-Id: <199711240243.TAA03477@smtp02.primenet.com> Received: from ip-22-220.phx.primenet.com(206.165.22.220), claiming to be "default" via SMTP by smtp02.primenet.com, id smtpd003475; Sun Nov 23 19:43:38 1997 Reply-To: <@primenet.com> From: "Greg Simon" To: Subject: Mark Yarian Date: Sun, 23 Nov 1997 19:38:50 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mtman@primenet.com From: mtman@primenet.com Subject: Mark Yarian PostedDate: 11/23/97 06:38:50 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 08:44:05 AM-11/24/97 08:44:08 AM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 08:44:08 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Have you looked for local dealers other then rat shack?? Here in Phoenix I have several dealers available to myself and was able to pick up several chips (10) for 75 cents each. I do like your idea of natural selection. Hope it works out for you. As for the SO package, good idea. The board size is ideally smaller, which can be nice for some instances. But be prepared, if you have not soldered that kind of package you will probably destroy a few. They tend to be more susceptible to heat. You could try a conductive adhesive, or such. Greg Simon mtman@primenet.com At 03:27 PM 11/22/97 -0500, you wrote: >Usually, I just order $25 or more worth of stuff. If you have an order >greater than $25, they pay shipping. So, I order a bunch of .22uF capactors, >maybe some odd resistors, solarengine parts, 74ALS245's, etc, until I have >$25 worth. (It goes a lot faster than you think....) You have to anticipate >what you might need. Yeah, I know... The thing is, I am only going to be building a few of these things. I am just building it for the learning exp. I am currently building a bigger robot that is programmable, but I would like to learn as much as I can to make it next near to perfect. I hate having a million ideas on what I would like to see in the finished prototype, but not having the know how to do it... :( >You probably want the 14-DIP. The SO-14 is a surface mount chip, I believe. >It's possible to use surface mount stuff for Beam circuits, but it's usually >not worth it unless you need it really small. Well, I am tossing the idea around of making like 10 or 20 microcores about an inch big running off of a watch-type battery. Each one would have something different about them (weight, power, motors, etc...) and put them in like a small area, roughly a 10' x 10' enclosed area and see which ones survive the best. (My own BEAM war).... That way I can figure out which characteristics are most important in the type of modifications I am going to make to my current project... ___________________________ Mark Yarian YSC - Yarian Computer Services 1(412) 962-1435 myarian@hto.net www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/2639 ___________________________ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.007A66F0; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:16:57 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA00293 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:06:57 -0800 Received: from hometown.hto.net (hto.net [205.146.103.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA31946 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 13:24:15 -0600 Received: from drifterm [205.146.103.111] by hometown.hto.net (SMTPD32-4.02) id A44613800F6; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:23:50 EST5EDT Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19971124142223.006a2598@hto.net> X-Sender: myarian@hto.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:22:23 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Yarian Subject: Kydex Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: myarian@hto.net From: myarian@hto.net Subject: Kydex PostedDate: 11/24/97 11:22:23 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 02:17:07 PM-11/24/97 02:17:08 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 02:17:08 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 00:16:30 -0500 >To: beam@webcomm.com >From: Mark Yarian >Subject: Kydex > > >>Battery covers. What is so nice is that they are nice long rectangles of >>stiff plastic. Even if the plastic case for a device itself is injection >>molded into smooth shapes, it's batter cover will often be flat and square, >>perfect for mounting motors on either end. > > I'll tell you what I use... It is a plastic called Kydex, the spelling might be different ('It is pronounced KI-DEX'). Very hard plastic, but it is easy to cut and you can mold it with a heat gun or even use the soldering gun to make all kinds of angles. Very light weight!! A 4'x10' 1/8 inch sheet of it cost around 150 dollars, but you can just buy a small peice and it will last you awhile... Got to meet this cool stuff while building a set of armour for the SCQ, worked great because of it's light weight and molding abilities... > > ___________________________ Mark Yarian YSC - Yarian Computer Services 1(412) 962-1435 myarian@hto.net www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/lab/2639 ___________________________ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.007D68E9; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:49:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA00566 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:39:15 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02275 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:01:47 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm06-08.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.169]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA19480 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:56:59 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711242056.VAA19480@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "Mea Culpa" To: Subject: Speeding up a four legged walker. Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:43:00 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl From: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Speeding up a four legged walker. PostedDate: 11/24/97 12:43:00 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 02:49:58 PM-11/24/97 02:49:59 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 02:49:59 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi I had some thoughts about the walking gait of insect like walkers. A 6 legged walker can have a leg-cycle rate of 2. Which means that he can use the same leg every two steps. A four legged walker most of the time have a cycle rate of 4!. I thought about this and i think that its possible to speed up this cycle. But before i start experimenting i like to discuse it here to here your opinion. If the front leg moves forward and it has finished over 50% of its movement the the oposite rear leg can start moving. This will speed up the cycle. I think of doing this with a delay function to the leg driver. The microcore signals the leg and charge a C. When the triggering signal drops then the C will keep the leg moving for some time. But in the mean time the next leg has started its movement. How about this idea? Is it already done? [Excuse for my English because it isn't my native language.] A.A. van Zoelen. Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.007EEF09; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:06:27 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA00722 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 14:56:27 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02276 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:01:51 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm06-08.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.169]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA19468 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:56:56 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711242056.VAA19468@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "Mea Culpa" To: Subject: Is there interrest for a Dutch BEAM group? Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:33:41 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl From: NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Is there interrest for a Dutch BEAM group? PostedDate: 11/24/97 12:33:41 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 03:06:38 PM-11/24/97 03:06:39 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 03:06:39 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I like to inform about interrest in forming a Dutch Beam group, games ect. Could you mail your ideas to me or to this mailing list. Thanks A.A. van Zoelen. Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.00802C04; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:19:58 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00853 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:09:59 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02295 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:02:52 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm06-08.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.169]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA19495; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:57:02 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711242057.VAA19495@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "A.A. van Zoelen" To: "Dennison" , Subject: Re: Hot Glue and Battery covers Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:56:01 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Hot Glue and Battery covers PostedDate: 11/24/97 12:56:01 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 03:20:05 PM-11/24/97 03:20:06 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 03:20:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Van: Dennison > Aan: BEAM > Onderwerp: Hot Glue and Battery covers > Datum: woensdag 12 november 1997 22:32 > [snip] > Battery Covers. > > I have what I feel is almost the perfect substance for Walker bodies, > Battery covers. What is so nice is that they are nice long rectangles of > stiff plastic. Even if the plastic case for a device itself is injection > molded into smooth shapes, it's batter cover will often be flat and square, > perfect for mounting motors on either end. I have worked in the car industry and i pick up some views from it. One of it is that the chassis can carry itself. I like to make my PCB also the chassis of my walker. I often make the sides also from the same material. You can shape it well and just solder or glue it together. Just my two cents.. Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256559.0080E691; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:27:56 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA00915 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:17:56 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA02293 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 15:02:38 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm06-08.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.169]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA19486; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:57:00 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711242057.VAA19486@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "A.A. van Zoelen" To: "Dennison" , Subject: Re: Walker DOF Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 21:51:47 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Walker DOF PostedDate: 11/24/97 12:51:47 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 03:28:05 PM-11/24/97 03:28:06 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 03:28:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > I have come up with a creative solution to limiting the degrees of fredom > for a leg. Using limit switches instead of turning off the power, I > connected it up like a reular sensor thay shortened the length of the > pulse. So when a leg tirggered the switch it shortened the appropriat pulse > and the leg swung back the other way. That part is oke, but it real killer for of my gearbox was that turning on the power also turns the legs to one side. Pushing it full power against the end-stop. I like to get rid if this behavior. > > Also just to let you know, that NOSPAM thing is really annoying. I'm using > Microsoft internet mail and since it feels all automated it can get to be a > small hassel to reply, if you notice no one else on the list is worried > about spamers. And have yet to be bothered. I've removed the NOSPAM thing. Thanks for letting me know. Yours Bram. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.0004B5C0; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 16:51:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA01414 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 16:41:22 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA03809 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 17:26:39 -0600 Received: from ts48ip207.cadvision.com (ts79ip203.cadvision.com [207.228.113.203]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA128862 for ; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 16:21:59 -0700 Received: by ts48ip207.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCF8FD.2F299580@ts48ip207.cadvision.com>; Mon, 24 Nov 1997 17:19:56 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCF8FD.2F299580@ts48ip207.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Hex inverter SE Date: Mon, 24 Nov 1997 17:19:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Hex inverter SE PostedDate: 11/24/97 04:19:53 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/24/97 04:51:27 PM-11/24/97 04:51:29 PM DeliveredDate: 11/24/97 04:51:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US A while ago I was told that you could make up to 4 SE from an Hex inverter IC. Anyone have a clue how it would be set up. I just wanted to keep my 3Nv photovore's circuitry small. "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.005B2B83; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 08:35:49 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA02995 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 08:25:48 -0800 Received: from contract.kent.edu ([131.123.210.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA09048 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 08:43:04 -0600 Received: (qmail 6626 invoked by uid 100); 25 Nov 1997 14:37:48 -0000 Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 09:37:48 -0500 (EST) From: Ted Fullerton To: beam@webconn.com Subject: BEAM: single cap photovore. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: ted@contract.kent.edu From: ted@contract.kent.edu Subject: BEAM: single cap photovore. PostedDate: 11/25/97 06:37:48 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 08:35:52 AM-11/25/97 08:35:53 AM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 08:35:53 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I've seen reference to dual type-1 solarengines being driven from a single cap, but haven't been able to figure out how exactly this works. I've tried to get this going by building a circuit with a single cell going to a single cap, then placing photoresistors from the negative side of the 2 flashing leds and motors to the neg feed from the cap. It seems that with such low-current applications, the photoresistors do not make an appreciable difference. Is this why IR sensors are used? Any help or pointers are appreciated. On another note, I've been calling around about the panasonic AL Gold series caps (.22 and .33) that Dave has on the Solarbotics site. Dave, I'd love to buy them from you, but I need to use a Visa card (any word on using visa for Solarbotics purchases???). The offshoot of my calls is that if there is an order of 200 pieces or more (and a lead time of 12-14 weeks) Sterling electronics can come up with either the .22's or the .33's even though Panasonic has stopped mass producing. Cost was $1.21/each. Just an fyi for Dave or the group. -Ted ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Ted Fullerton Project Manager v: 330.672.2285 Contract Services f: 330.672.5420 Kent State University ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.0068AC88; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 11:03:19 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA04261 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:53:18 -0800 Received: from isis.interpac.net (isis.interpac.net [206.154.202.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA09905 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 10:47:33 -0600 Received: from [206.154.202.14] (ts1-s5.interpac.net [206.154.202.14]) by isis.interpac.net (8.8.4/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA13468 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 06:42:50 -1000 (HST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 06:44:37 -1000 To: BEAM@webconn.com From: clayton@interpac.net (Clayton Turnbull) Subject: Seattle SMTPOriginator: clayton@interpac.net From: clayton@interpac.net Subject: Seattle PostedDate: 11/25/97 08:44:37 AM SendTo: BEAM@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 11:03:23 AM-11/25/97 11:03:25 AM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 11:03:25 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello I live in Hawaii but I am going to visit Seattle this weekend and was wondering if there was any BEAM stuff or people there? Thank you. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.0078436B; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 13:53:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA05170 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 13:43:34 -0800 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA11188 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:00:17 -0600 Received: from darwin (dialup05.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.224]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA01473 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 15:17:10 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19971125145300.009a7100@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:53:00 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: BEAM Robotics Tek and FAQ Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: BEAM Robotics Tek and FAQ PostedDate: 11/25/97 11:53:00 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 01:53:42 PM-11/25/97 01:53:42 PM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 01:53:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US November - monthly post of BEAM Robotics information sources ------------------------------------------------------------ I would like to inform the BEAM Robotics list that : (1) The BEAM Robotics Tek is available at: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/main.html which links to the FAQ*, definitions*, solar engine info*, nervous networks, motors and motor drivers, miscellaneous info and other external links. (* good place to start for those new to the list) (2) The BEAM Robotics FAQ is available at: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html The FAQ contains details of what BEAM Robotics is, as well as where to find info, such as basic solar engine details, Tilden's patent, the Living Machines paper, vendor links, upcoming events and other info... great place to start probing for answers for those new to the list. This month only minor changes and additions were made throughout the site. Added a literature page (originally from Mark Dalton, under links) that contains some links to some places on the net, like Ars Electronica 93, that contains info on BEAM or Tilden. Let me know of any errors, ommisions, additions etc and goodluck with all your projects. Thanks for all your comments and suggestions thus far. Enjoy! Brian --- brian o bush, gearhead "follow the black valley trail of death, into the beautiful sunshine." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Tek pages: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/main.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.0079C41E; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:10:00 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA05297 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 13:59:59 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11433 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:34:53 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm03-12.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.77]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA27721 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 21:30:05 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199711252030.VAA27721@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "A.A. van Zoelen" To: Subject: RE: Hot Glue and Battery covers Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 21:24:20 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: RE: Hot Glue and Battery covers PostedDate: 11/25/97 12:24:20 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 02:10:07 PM-11/25/97 02:10:07 PM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 02:10:07 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Van: Dennison > Aan: BEAM > Onderwerp: Hot Glue and Battery covers > Datum: woensdag 12 november 1997 22:32 > [snip] > Battery Covers. > > I have what I feel is almost the perfect substance for Walker bodies, > Battery covers. What is so nice is that they are nice long rectangles of > stiff plastic. Even if the plastic case for a device itself is injection > molded into smooth shapes, it's batter cover will often be flat and square, > perfect for mounting motors on either end. I have worked in the car industry and i pick up some views from it. One of it is that the chassis can carry itself. I like to make my PCB also the chassis of my walker. I often make the sides also from the same material. You can shape it well and just solder or glue it together. Just my two cents.. Bram Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655A.007AA68E; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:19:42 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA05362 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:09:39 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA11434 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 14:34:58 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm03-12.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.77]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA27798 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 21:30:18 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199711252030.VAA27798@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "A.A. van Zoelen" To: Subject: RE:Walker DOF Date: Tue, 25 Nov 1997 21:28:33 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: RE:Walker DOF PostedDate: 11/25/97 12:28:33 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 02:19:48 PM-11/25/97 02:19:49 PM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 02:19:49 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > I have come up with a creative solution to limiting the degrees of fredom > for a leg. Using limit switches instead of turning off the power, I > connected it up like a reular sensor thay shortened the length of the > pulse. So when a leg tirggered the switch it shortened the appropriat pulse > and the leg swung back the other way. That part is oke, but it real killer for of my gearbox was that turning on the power also turns the legs to one side. Pushing it full power against the end-stop. I like to get rid if this behavior. > > Also just to let you know, that NOSPAM thing is really annoying. I'm using > Microsoft internet mail and since it feels all automated it can get to be a > small hassel to reply, if you notice no one else on the list is worried > about spamers. And have yet to be bothered. I've removed the NOSPAM thing. Thanks for letting me know. Yours Bram. Mea Culpa NOSPAM.vsim@xs4all.nl Remove NOSPAM. when replying $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655B.0007D472; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:25:31 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA06455 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:15:30 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA13269 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:35:10 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA08380 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 18:29:49 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711252329.SAA08380@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from fppp20.buffnet.net(205.247.124.199) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma022180; Tue, 25 Nov 97 18:29:44 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Problem on BEAM list? Date: Fri, 14 Nov 1997 18:38:54 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Problem on BEAM list? PostedDate: 11/14/97 03:38:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 05:25:32 PM-11/25/97 05:25:33 PM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 05:25:33 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Is it just me, or is everyone getting a copy of A.A van Zoelen's response over and over again? I've gotten it about three times! just checking, also is there an address to specifically address stuff like Returned mail people? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655B.00082FE7; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:29:25 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA06479 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:19:18 -0800 Received: from socrates.uss.net (mail.uss.net [209.100.88.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA13343 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:49:18 -0600 Received: from mess ([209.100.89.102]) by socrates.uss.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-34205U5000L100S0) with ESMTP id AAA7574 for ; Tue, 25 Nov 1997 17:36:02 -0600 Reply-To: From: "Matt" To: "Beam Robotics List!" Subject: Fw: aqua bot. Date: Wed, 24 Sep 1997 11:37:02 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19971125233558.AAA7574@mess> SMTPOriginator: lande@uss.net From: lande@uss.net Subject: Fw: aqua bot. PostedDate: 09/24/97 09:37:02 AM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: lande@uss.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/25/97 05:29:32 PM-11/25/97 05:29:32 PM DeliveredDate: 11/25/97 05:29:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > SMD Stands for surface mount device. > Several questions: > 1)what is your backround in electronics? Not much. I could build the circuit, but don't understand to much of the jibber-jabber. I'm 14. > 2)have you checked out the Beam website? I think so. You mean the beam tek page? I tried to get into the site with "lanl" in the address, but IE gave me an "invalid syntax" message. I think I got into it later though. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655C.001C3BFA; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 21:08:23 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA11776 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 20:58:21 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA00471 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 19:48:17 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA15809 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 20:47:31 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711270147.UAA15809@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp21.buffnet.net(205.246.19.128) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma003249; Wed, 26 Nov 97 20:47:12 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: PCB Microcore; Just built Date: Sat, 15 Nov 1997 20:56:20 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: PCB Microcore; Just built PostedDate: 11/15/97 05:56:20 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/26/97 09:08:38 PM-11/26/97 09:08:40 PM DeliveredDate: 11/26/97 09:08:40 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Today I came home from school with the intention of makeing another Microcore, but a nice one. In four hours I designed a PCB, put down the resist, etched soldered, debuged and now it works. I would advicate to ANYONE that if you can make a PCB Make one! Its ton's funner to work with than free-form, Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655C.00314934; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 00:58:20 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA12022 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 00:48:13 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA19920 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:18:50 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm10-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.48.34]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA14002 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 21:13:57 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711262013.VAA14002@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "A.A. van Zoelen" To: Subject: Apologises Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 14:40:15 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Apologises PostedDate: 11/26/97 05:40:15 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 12:58:27 AM-11/27/97 12:58:28 AM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 12:58:28 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi After a suggestion to romove the NOSPAM thinggy from my e-mail address things seems to go wierd!!! If you recieve multiple copy then i am sorry about it. I got now more then 20 messages about undelivered mail and bounced mail. The mail server tells me that he will keep trying to send the mail for the next 5 days. Again, sorry for the trouble. I hope that WinDose now understand what i want... :0( Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655C.0042C803; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 02:12:55 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA12036 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 01:10:40 -0800 Received: from proxy.webconn.com (proxy.webconn.com [206.42.142.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20505 for ; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 16:13:32 -0600 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by proxy.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA30892 for ; Tue, 11 Nov 1997 01:19:42 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm10-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.48.34]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id VAA19581; Wed, 26 Nov 1997 21:35:12 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711262035.VAA19581@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: "Daniel Roganti" Cc: Subject: Re: Is there interrest for a Dutch BEAM group? Date: Wed, 26 Nov 1997 21:35:19 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Is there interrest for a Dutch BEAM group? PostedDate: 11/26/97 12:35:19 PM SendTo: ragman@euronet.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 02:13:07 AM-11/27/97 02:13:08 AM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 02:13:08 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > I'm a member of the HCC Robotica gg, are you aware of this ? Yes and no. I know about HCC but i didn't know that they where bussy in robotics too. > There aren't so many members yet, it recently started this year. > There's no specfic agenda yet, as long as it's about robotics, BEAM, Sumo, > etc. > You're welcome to visit our booth on HCC Dagen this weekend, look for the > name. I will [snip] > Visit my website. Oke i've done that. Looks nice. You asked also for comments soo prepare yourself for them. robot1.html - Text layout is scrambled in the introduction. Your bipeds are looking nice ;0) $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655C.0043AABC; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 03:55:46 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA12181 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 03:45:43 -0800 Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA04825 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 04:23:43 -0600 Received: from palmer ([12.67.16.157]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA28325 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 10:23:33 +0000 Message-ID: <347D4A0C.40A@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 04:23:08 -0600 From: Al and Palmer Robinson Reply-To: robinson727@worldnet.att.net Organization: K&R Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: BEAM Subject: nnet/autoflight References: <199711270631.WBA01175@gromit.webconn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: robinson727@worldnet.att.net From: robinson727@worldnet.att.net Subject: nnet/autoflight PostedDate: 11/27/97 02:23:08 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: robinson727@worldnet.att.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 03:55:51 AM-11/27/97 03:55:52 AM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 03:55:52 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Remote-MTA: DNS; ccgate.dp.beckman.com > Last-Attempt-Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 00:31:10 -0600 > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > Subject: Nurflugel Re: More prop questions, birdstrikes and canards > Date: Wed, 29 Oct 1997 16:06:58 -0600 > From: Al and Palmer Robinson > Organization: K&R Products > To: beam@webconn.com > References: <199710292005.MAA18648@orville.dfrc.nasa.gov> > > >From the Nurflugel Mailing list....... > > ..the control page showed the flap failure with the words "FLAP OFF")... > > > > Losing control surfaces is usually catastrophic, sometimes something > > as simple as an airspeed sensor can crash an airplane (the X-31). But > > there is a whole world out there in digital flight controls called > > reconfigurable flight controls where aircraft can sense the damage and > > adjust (usually with some degradation of flying qualities). It > > involves black magic (neural networks) and voodoo (fuzzy logic), but > > it exists and might save some lives someday. > > > > Al Bowers NASA Dryden > > Mark T..(anybody) > I picked up on this and was curious about nnet re: aircraft stability > and control. As a pilot I am particularly interested. > > My wife Palmer and I are involved in a long range UAV ("Longshot") > and wondered what words of wisdom you could impart to those of us > involved in > autoflight/flight dynamics concerning nnet.. > Thank you.. > Al-n-Palmer $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655C.00831100; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 15:51:35 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA12626 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 15:41:32 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA08071 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 15:35:58 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm04-20.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.117]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id WAA12280 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:35:31 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199711272135.WAA12280@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: Subject: BiCore controller and stepper Date: Thu, 27 Nov 1997 22:35:51 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/27/97 01:35:51 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 03:51:44 PM-11/27/97 03:51:45 PM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 03:51:45 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi, i've tried to hook a stepper from a clock to a bicore. The magnet of the clock is just wobbling. I use a circuit out of two Nv's. Just standard with R and C's. I thought the bicore was producing a square wave but am i wrong? Also i saw a messages about a specialized bicore, just to drive a stepper. Where could i find a schematic of this or could someone explain how it done. Thanks, Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655D.002B2756; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:51:21 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA12945 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:41:10 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA10592 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:45:45 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-02.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.3]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id GAA05213; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 06:45:24 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 06:53:01 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: AA van Zoelen cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper In-Reply-To: <199711272135.WAA12280@smtp1.xs4all.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/27/97 09:53:01 PM SendTo: vsim@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 11:51:31 PM-11/27/97 11:51:31 PM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 11:51:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Thu, 27 Nov 1997, AA van Zoelen wrote: > i've tried to hook a stepper from a clock to a bicore. The magnet of the > clock is just wobbling. I use a circuit out of two Nv's. Just standard with > R and C's. I thought the bicore was producing a square wave but am i wrong? It sounds like you may trying to drive the stepper with a dc square wave. The stepper needs AC pulses; one wire to gnd, the other alternating between plus and minus. That's the reason for the 47uF capacitor between driver and clock in my photovore. From my webpage: Their value depends on the steppers, so 47uF is correct only for the type of clock mentioned in the parts list. Other stepper-driven clocks (not those equipped with a synchronous motor) can be used if you match the capacitor to the load. Ohmic resistance of the stepper coil is a useful guide: At 300 ohms, 47uF was perfect, while a lady's watch having a resistance of 2K6 needed 4.7uF (Yes, a Photovore using lady's watches is possible :) Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655D.002B297A; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:51:26 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA12947 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:41:15 -0800 From: Cybermurf@aol.com Received: from mrin38.mail.aol.com (mrin38.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.148]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA10490 for ; Thu, 27 Nov 1997 23:24:55 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin38.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id AAA07399 for beam@webconn.com; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 00:24:40 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 00:24:40 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971128002440_1705892499@mrin38> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: St. Louis Area BEAMers SMTPOriginator: Cybermurf@aol.com From: Cybermurf@aol.com Subject: St. Louis Area BEAMers PostedDate: 11/27/97 09:24:40 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/27/97 11:51:31 PM-11/27/97 11:51:33 PM DeliveredDate: 11/27/97 11:51:33 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US is there an intrest or current group of BEAMers in the St. Louis area? if not, is there any intrest to have a group of BEAMers in the St. Louis area so as to meet and share idas and info? Mike $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655D.006BEE60; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 11:38:53 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA13262 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 11:28:50 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA14130 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 11:07:46 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm03-13.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.78]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id SAA18979 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 18:07:25 +0100 (CET) Message-Id: <199711281707.SAA18979@smtp2.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: Subject: BiCore and stepper answer Date: Fri, 28 Nov 1997 18:06:55 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: BiCore and stepper answer PostedDate: 11/28/97 09:06:55 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/28/97 11:38:58 AM-11/28/97 11:38:59 AM DeliveredDate: 11/28/97 11:38:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US The nicest thing has happened. I found the answer at my own question. :0) > Hi, > i've tried to hook a stepper from a clock to a bicore. The magnet of the > clock is just wobbling. I use a circuit out of two Nv's. Just standard with > R and C's. I thought the bicore was producing a square wave but am i wrong? Since i saw the spindle move for a small part i guessed that the pulse wasn't good enough. There had to be more. I investigate this page about steppers. Great page! http://www.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/step I then got the idea that the stepper needed to recieve a second pulse but the to the oposite to rotate. I hooked the BiCore to a H-Bridge. One NV to each input and i the stepper was going.. Great. I hope this helps others too. Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.000A08F6; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 17:49:36 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA13606 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 17:39:32 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA16253 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 17:35:59 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA01106 for ; Fri, 28 Nov 1997 18:35:14 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711282335.SAA01106@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp44.buffnet.net(205.246.19.151) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma028509; Fri, 28 Nov 97 18:34:54 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: My NEw WEB PAGe, With PCB Date: Tue, 4 Nov 1997 18:43:54 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: My NEw WEB PAGe, With PCB PostedDate: 11/04/97 03:43:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/28/97 05:49:45 PM-11/28/97 05:49:45 PM DeliveredDate: 11/28/97 05:49:45 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I've put up my new robotics web page. Keep in mind it isnt completly done, for example the walker section isn't done. But I do Have my wiskers page, and a page where I have the schematic for a microcore PCB that works. Please check it out and let me know whats good or bad about it, so I can fix it. Page http://www.buffnet.net/~dennlill/robot.htm Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.004204C0; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 02:13:29 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA13868 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 01:18:09 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA18892 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 01:16:19 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.2]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id IAA25344; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 08:15:58 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 08:23:31 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: zimba cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Rbot's place In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Rbot's place PostedDate: 11/28/97 11:23:31 PM SendTo: zimba@hol.fr CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 02:13:46 AM-11/29/97 02:13:48 AM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 02:13:48 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Fri, 28 Nov 1997, zimba wrote: > Hi everyone... i've got a problem... i'd like to know if someone has an > idea of a manner to locate a robot very precisely on table 3m*2m. It's for > a french competition where the robots have to play football, and we are > allowed to have 3 buoy on the goal and the two sides of the goal, which can > transmit all the information you want by IR ultrasounds, HF waves.... > We would like to determinate precisely the position of the robotion the > table at very moment by using the information of the buoys. > So if someone has got a idea, has already thought about it or know > somewhere i can find some tips thanks for anwsering... Give the robots a specific color and look down on the table using a color video camera. Compute and transmit guidance to your robots, which can be dumb, giving them best power to weight in a small package. There is a `Cognachrome' video board which should achieve 1 or 2cm accuracy, at 60Hz speed. Sold by Mondotronics. And if that isn't allowed, what is? Best, ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.0061292F; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 09:41:15 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA14036 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 09:31:06 -0800 Received: from pgh.nauticom.net (pgh.nauticom.net [198.190.226.3]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA21333 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 09:57:52 -0600 Received: from [204.171.126.38] (38.net7.nauticom.net [204.171.126.38]) by pgh.nauticom.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA15948 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 10:59:00 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 10:56:37 -0500 To: beam@webconn.com From: bnansel@nauticom.net (Robert Nansel) Subject: Re: Rbot's place SMTPOriginator: bnansel@nauticom.net From: bnansel@nauticom.net Subject: Re: Rbot's place PostedDate: 11/29/97 07:56:37 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 09:41:25 AM-11/29/97 09:41:26 AM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 09:41:26 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >Give the robots a specific color and look down on the table using a >color video camera. Compute and transmit guidance to your robots, >which can be dumb, giving them best power to weight in a small >package. >There is a `Cognachrome' video board which should achieve 1 or 2cm >accuracy, at 60Hz speed. Sold by Mondotronics. > >And if that isn't allowed, what is? > >Best, > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- "Cognachrome" is the tradename for Newton Labs vision system. For more information than you can get from Mondotronics, take a look at: http://www.newtonlabs.com/ It's an expensive system (~$2000 US), but it _works_. I've seen this thing up close in operation at a Seattle Robotics Society meeting (http://www.seattlerobotics.org/). It was mounted on a toy car & programmed to track & follow the color orange. They mounted an orange baseball cap on another (identical) toy RC car and folks were invited to try to keep away from the Cognachrome-equipped vehicle. This thing was so fast that human reflexes are entirely too slow to keep up. it was like the Terminator. If the Cognachrome system saw you it unerringly homed in on--and generally ran right over the top of--the manually controlled vehicle. I've also see a video of the Cognachrome system interfaced to a robot arm. The robot arm played catch with (orange) tennis balls--and it could toss the ball accurately back to the person who threw the ball. As far as positional accuracy goes, I'd say it can achieve much better than "1 or 2cm accuracy" because this is limited only by camera resolution, geometry, and optics. Fundamentally it is limited by the pixel resolution, so whatever the projected dimension of a pixel is on the field would be what your positional accuracy would be. --BN ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Country Robot "Modular robot components 69 S. Fremont Ave. # 2 for education and industry" Pittsburgh, PA 15202 ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.00755049; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 13:21:22 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA14205 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 13:11:17 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA22513 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 13:41:10 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm08-19.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.244]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id UAA19167 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 20:40:50 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199711291940.UAA19167@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 20:30:01 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/29/97 11:30:01 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 01:21:30 PM-11/29/97 01:21:31 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 01:21:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >Steven Bolt wrote > Datum: vrijdag 28 november 1997 6:53 > > On Thu, 27 Nov 1997, AA van Zoelen wrote: > > > i've tried to hook a stepper from a clock to a bicore. The magnet of the > > clock is just wobbling. I use a circuit out of two Nv's. Just standard with > > R and C's. I thought the bicore was producing a square wave but am i wrong? > > It sounds like you may trying to drive the stepper with a dc square > wave. The stepper needs AC pulses; one wire to gnd, the other > alternating between plus and minus. That's the reason for the > 47uF capacitor between driver and clock in my photovore. From > my webpage: > > Their value depends on the steppers, so 47uF is correct only for > the type of clock mentioned in the parts list. Other > stepper-driven clocks (not those equipped with a synchronous > motor) can be used if you match the capacitor to the load. Ohmic > resistance of the stepper coil is a useful guide: At 300 ohms, 47uF > was perfect, while a lady's watch having a resistance of 2K6 needed > 4.7uF (Yes, a Photovore using lady's watches is possible :) Didn't work. I tried 1, 4.7, 10, 47 and 100uF but none worked. Now i use a H-bridge and its turning now. The seconds pointer turns at 16 RPM and i guess it has enough torque to drive a wheel. The wheel is attached direcly to the seconds arm. I still need to 'fix' the second clock to try it. I will let you know the result. The BiCore, H-Bridge and clock drains 10mA when active. BTW is there a way to reverse the turn direction of the clock? I guess not../ Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.007D4A9E; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 14:48:31 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA14253 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 14:38:16 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA22963 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:10:33 -0600 Received: from ts57ip38.cadvision.com (ts57ip38.cadvision.com [207.228.74.38]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA96664; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 14:09:53 -0700 Received: by ts57ip38.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCFCD8.5CCCEA80@ts57ip38.cadvision.com>; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:06:25 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCFCD8.5CCCEA80@ts57ip38.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Steven Bolt'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Rbot's place Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:06:21 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Rbot's place PostedDate: 11/29/97 02:06:21 PM SendTo: sbolt@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 02:48:35 PM-11/29/97 02:48:36 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 02:48:36 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US -----Original Message----- From: Steven Bolt [SMTP:sbolt@xs4all.nl] Sent: Saturday, November 29, 1997 12:24 AM To: zimba Cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Rbot's place On Fri, 28 Nov 1997, zimba wrote: > Hi everyone... i've got a problem... i'd like to know if someone has an > idea of a manner to locate a robot very precisely on table 3m*2m. It's for > a french competition where the robots have to play football, and we are > allowed to have 3 buoy on the goal and the two sides of the goal, which can > transmit all the information you want by IR ultrasounds, HF waves.... > We would like to determinate precisely the position of the robotion the > table at very moment by using the information of the buoys. > So if someone has got a idea, has already thought about it or know > somewhere i can find some tips thanks for anwsering... Give the robots a specific color and look down on the table using a color video camera. Compute and transmit guidance to your robots, which can be dumb, giving them best power to weight in a small package. There is a `Cognachrome' video board which should achieve 1 or 2cm accuracy, at 60Hz speed. Sold by Mondotronics. And if that isn't allowed, what is? What I remember from some competitions like this, people set up points around the area that they want it to move around in. It creates a grid for the robot to move around in, You start getting into the more college and university robotics, which people spend a whole course building their robot for games like that "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.00816488; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:33:18 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA14322 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:23:14 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA23283 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:58:10 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-14.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.15]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id WAA14899; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 22:57:48 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 23:05:17 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: Robert Nansel cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Rbot's place In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Rbot's place PostedDate: 11/29/97 02:05:17 PM SendTo: bnansel@nauticom.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 03:33:19 PM-11/29/97 03:33:20 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 03:33:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 29 Nov 1997, Robert Nansel wrote: > As far as positional accuracy goes, I'd say it can achieve much better than > "1 or 2cm accuracy" because this is limited only by camera resolution, > geometry, and optics. Fundamentally it is limited by the pixel resolution, > so whatever the projected dimension of a pixel is on the field would be > what your positional accuracy would be. Afaik the Cognachrome board has a resolution of 200 * 250 pixels at 24bit color resolution. The football table mentioned measures 200 * 300 cm; hence my estimate of 1 or 2cm accuracy. As to increasing camera resolution, well, there has to be a balance between speed (60Hz for the Cognachrome), resolution and computing power... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655E.00817B3A; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:34:16 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA14325 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 15:24:11 -0800 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23321 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 16:04:15 -0600 Received: from odi (hlm01-14.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.15]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id XAA15657; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 23:03:56 +0100 (CET) Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 23:11:26 +0100 (MET) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: AA van Zoelen cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper In-Reply-To: <199711291940.UAA19167@smtp1.xs4all.nl> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/29/97 02:11:26 PM SendTo: vsim@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 03:34:20 PM-11/29/97 03:34:20 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 03:34:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 29 Nov 1997, AA van Zoelen wrote: > Didn't work. > I tried 1, 4.7, 10, 47 and 100uF but none worked. Strikes me as odd, since I was able to find a fitting cap for all stepper driven clocks I've found so far. It's a common way to drive such steppers - no invention of mine. > The BiCore, H-Bridge and clock drains 10mA when active. Horrendous! My clock driven photovore makes do with about 1mA when moving about. > BTW is there a way to reverse the turn direction of the clock? I > guess not../ The clockwise rotation is mechanically determined. But as my little photovore demonstrates, it is still possible to back up and move around obstacles :) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.000300ED; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 16:32:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA14359 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 16:22:43 -0800 Received: from sun.tir.com (sun.tir.com [205.138.41.6]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA23619 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 16:56:33 -0600 Received: from tir.com (port04.lapeer03.tir.com [205.218.85.179]) by sun.tir.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA25175; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 17:55:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3480AC2D.963CC2B1@tir.com> Date: Sat, 29 Nov 1997 17:58:38 -0600 From: Joe X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: AA van Zoelen CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: help References: <199711291940.UAA19167@smtp1.xs4all.nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jvv@tir.com From: jvv@tir.com Subject: help PostedDate: 11/29/97 03:58:38 PM SendTo: vsim@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 04:32:56 PM-11/29/97 04:32:57 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 04:32:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello I need help I have a billion different parts from old walkmans (capassitors, trasistors, and such) but dont know how to tell their properitys. Any Help? $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.001E8230; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 21:33:14 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA14539 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 21:23:09 -0800 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25428 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 21:48:53 -0600 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id WAA24648 for ; Sat, 29 Nov 1997 22:47:54 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711300347.WAA24648@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from gppp8.buffnet.net(205.247.124.115) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma010799; Sat, 29 Nov 97 22:47:47 -0500 From: Dennison To: BEAM Subject: Biocore Clock stepper? Date: Wed, 5 Nov 1997 22:56:43 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Biocore Clock stepper? PostedDate: 11/05/97 07:56:43 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/29/97 09:33:18 PM-11/29/97 09:33:18 PM DeliveredDate: 11/29/97 09:33:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US What exactly is a: stepper driven clock? From what I can peice together it's a stepper motors that is driven instead of by four or six wires, by one?? and is made to turn with a pulse, (square wave?) like something from a 555? Am I close? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.0041F537; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:45:13 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA14633 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:34:46 -0800 Received: from mail1.isdnet.net (mail1.hol.fr [194.149.160.35]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA27051 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 02:52:01 -0600 Received: from [195.154.35.7] (massy1-7.hol.fr [195.154.35.7]) by mail1.isdnet.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA01313 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 09:51:37 +0100 (CET) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 09:51:37 +0100 (CET) X-Sender: evauloup@pop.hol.fr Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: zimba SMTPOriginator: zimba@hol.fr From: zimba@hol.fr PostedDate: 11/30/97 12:51:37 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 02:45:17 AM-11/30/97 02:45:17 AM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 02:45:17 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Thank's everyone for your help on my problem... our group will studie these and give you news of our soccer robot as soons as possible... zimba $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.0064B7E6; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 10:20:06 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA14781 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 10:10:00 -0800 Received: from driene.student.utwente.nl ([130.89.220.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA29102 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 10:32:45 -0600 Received: from cal052302.student.utwente.nl by driene.student.utwente.nl with SMTP id AA19268 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:13:52 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971130131905.0067b6c4@mail.student.utwente.nl> X-Sender: s9301798@mail.student.utwente.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:19:05 +0100 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark van dijk Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper SMTPOriginator: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl From: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/30/97 05:19:05 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 10:20:14 AM-11/30/97 10:20:15 AM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 10:20:15 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 20:30 29/11/97 +0100, you wrote: >(steven Bolt worte this) > At 300 ohms, 47uF > was perfect, while a lady's watch having a resistance of 2K6 needed > 4.7uF (Yes, a Photovore using lady's watches is possible :) >seconds arm. I used a hfl 5,- guilder clock (2.5 dollars) with a resistance of 200 ohms. a 47 uF capacitor worked very well. The clock coul run at 49 rpm using 2*1.2V = 2.4V of batteries . Using two clocks running parallel at 40 rpm I needed 147 uF > > Is there a way to reverse the turn direction of the clock? I > guess not../ > I managed to reverse the direction, this means that the clock always will walk in counter clockwise (CCW) direction. So it won't be possible with this method to make one clock turn both directions. This is what I did. I used a 200 Ohms clock with a coil, a magnet and two metal plates (I think). First I opened the clock and removed the part I didn't need (Stevens Bolts page). Then I lifted one(and only one) of the metal plates (leaving the coil, the magnet and the other plate on its original place) for about 1 mm (1/25 inch I think) pushing it a litle to the outside, this made the clock turn CCW. After that I clicked the clock together. This made the clock go in its original direction because in the plastic box they had placed pins to prefix the metal plates. After a little bit of cutting and using paper to lift the metal it walked CCW. I know, another way to achieve this is to buy a CCW clock. (More expensive, less interesting) ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.006D16DF; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 11:51:32 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA14858 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 11:41:23 -0800 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.5]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA29600 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 12:06:46 -0600 Received: from ts57ip38.cadvision.com (ts57ip38.cadvision.com [207.228.74.38]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id LAA128062 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 11:06:09 -0700 Received: by ts57ip38.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCFD87.EA6AA080@ts57ip38.cadvision.com>; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 12:03:05 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCFD87.EA6AA080@ts57ip38.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: "Hackable" Items Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 12:03:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: "Hackable" Items PostedDate: 11/30/97 11:03:03 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 11:51:44 AM-11/30/97 11:51:45 AM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 11:51:45 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Still there are Giga pets, nano pets, tamagotchi, pico pets and much more el cheapo names, selling at competitive prices, you may be able to snag a few for less. Though from what mark tilden said, they were not really good to scrap for parts. With a toy I remember people selling at $600 from news paper classifed ads, the "Tickle me elmo" doll laughs and shakes, may have a good motor inside it. Then there is the sleeping ernie, which snores and does something else, will be on the high demand, elmo will be the thing of the past, leaving us to go around to stores and ask them for their unwanted stock. "What is the sound of two mimes Claping" "Paper Clips are our friends" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 8825655F.007C39F2; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:36:53 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA14961 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:26:47 -0800 Received: from blackadder.cis.mcmaster.ca (blackadder.CIS.McMaster.CA [130.113.128.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA30629 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 14:54:37 -0600 Received: from empB-port32.net.McMaster.CA by blackadder.cis.mcmaster.ca with SMTP id AA10913 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Sun, 30 Nov 1997 15:54:02 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.3.16.19971130163627.2727aff6@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca> X-Sender: parkerca@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (16) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 16:36:27 To: beam@webconn.com From: Chris Parker Subject: A good book for a beginner Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: parkerca@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca From: parkerca@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca Subject: A good book for a beginner PostedDate: 11/30/97 08:36:27 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 02:37:03 PM-11/30/97 02:37:04 PM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 02:37:04 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi. I am new to this list, but I have been interested in robotics for a while. I am wondering if anyone out there can recommend a good book for a beginner in BEAM. I am a second year Electrical Engineering (ERTW, Engineers Rule The World!) student, so electronics aren't a problem. Thanks in advance. -Chris Parker $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256560.00167FB1; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 20:05:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA15238 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 19:55:38 -0800 From: IMIvar@aol.com Received: from mrin51.mail.aol.com (mrin51.mx.aol.com [198.81.19.161]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA31512 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 17:16:30 -0600 Received: (from root@localhost) by mrin51.mail.aol.com (8.8.5/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id SAA22872; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 18:16:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 18:16:07 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <971130181607_1639304464@mrin51.mail.aol.com> To: parkerca@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: A good book for a beginner SMTPOriginator: IMIvar@aol.com From: IMIvar@aol.com Subject: Re: A good book for a beginner PostedDate: 11/30/97 03:16:07 PM SendTo: parkerca@muss.cis.mcmaster.ca CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 08:05:59 PM-11/30/97 08:06:00 PM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 08:06:00 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Hi. I am new to this list, but I have been interested in robotics for a > while. I am wondering if anyone out there can recommend a good book for a > beginner in BEAM. I am a second year Electrical Engineering (ERTW, > Engineers Rule The World!) student, so electronics aren't a problem. > Thanks in advance. In my opinion, the best BEAM book out so far would be the "BEAM Robot Games book" sold by Solarbotics (www.solarbotics.com) a while ago. I think it may also be sold at Mondotronics (www.robotstore.com), but I'm not sure. It's a nifty little book with all of the info about the BEAM Robotics Olympics, along with a few circuits and ideas for build BEAM 'bots. When Mark Tilden finally publishes his book(s) on BEAM robotics, then I STRONGLY suggest you buy it. Currently, the best source of information is the web sites put out by BEAM enthusiasts. Hope it helps. Ivar Thorson -- http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/9879/homepage.htm -- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256560.001BA55E; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 21:01:58 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA15284 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 20:51:51 -0800 Received: from driene.student.utwente.nl (driene.student.utwente.nl [130.89.220.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA31558 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 17:24:14 -0600 Received: from cal052302.student.utwente.nl by driene.student.utwente.nl with SMTP id AA21530 (5.67b/IDA-1.5 for ); Mon, 1 Dec 1997 00:23:49 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19971130232913.0066d11c@mail.student.utwente.nl> X-Sender: s9301798@mail.student.utwente.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 01 Dec 1997 00:29:13 +0100 To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark van dijk Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper SMTPOriginator: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl From: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl Subject: Re: BiCore controller and stepper PostedDate: 11/30/97 03:29:13 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 09:02:07 PM-11/30/97 09:02:07 PM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 09:02:07 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 20:30 29/11/97 +0100, you wrote: > I've tried to hook a stepper from a clock to a bicore. The magnet of > the clock is just wobbling. I use a circuit out of two Nv's. Just standard > with R and C's. I thought the bicore was producing a square wave but am i > wrong? > I tried it too, these are my components: 1) Using a 200 Ohm clock stepper and a 47uF capacitor. 2) Using a basic circuit with 1Mohm resistors and 0.22uF capacitors with red low current leds (with 4k7 R) from the site of "miller". This is a nervous net with 6 nv's. Each nv has a LED. 3) Using 2.4 Volts of batteries First I connected four wires to the circuit. red wire to the V+ black wire to the ground blue wire to exit of an inverter, a LED was also connected here green wire to entrance of inverter Experiment 1: Then I connected the black wire to the clock(in), the clock(out) to the capacitor(-) and the capacitor(+) to the bleu wire. Worked fine. Three state: continiously, 6 steps, wait zero Two state: 4 steps, wait 2 One state: 2 steps, wait 4 Experiment 2: Then I connected the blue wire to the clock(in), the clock(out) to the capacitor(-) and the capacitor(+) to the red wire. Worked fine too. Three state: continiously, 6 steps, wait zero Two state: 4 steps, wait 2 One state: 2 steps, wait 4 Experiment 3: Then I connected the green wire to the clock(in), the clock(out) to the capacitor(-) and the capacitor(+) to the red wire. Did not work, but I got I nice buzzing tone. Probably from the coil of the clock. Also this is another way to make all 6 leds burning at the same side. Experiment 4: Then I connected the black wire to the clock(in), the clock(out) to the capacitor(-) and the capacitor(+) to the green wire. Did not work, but I got I nice buzzing tone. Probably from the coil of the clock. Also this is another way to make all 6 leds burning at the same side. Experiment 5: Then I connected the blue wire to the green wire. Yes bypassing the0.22uF capacitor. Didn't work well any more, but funny to see. Others: Black wire to green wire: PNC Red wire to green wire: PIN Red wire to blue wire: PNC Black wire to blue wire: PIN I hope this helps a bit, Mark van Dijk ------------- Think ----- 1) What was there before there was anything? 2) Does anything equal nothing? ------------- Act ----- Think ------------- React ----- email: m.e.vandijk@student.utwente.nl aka : MuFFeD ------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256560.002B5F77; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 23:53:44 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA15419 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 23:43:39 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA02500 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 1997 01:02:11 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm07-28.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.221]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id IAA27669 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 1997 08:02:08 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199712010702.IAA27669@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: Subject: Solar engine Date: Mon, 1 Dec 1997 08:01:31 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Solar engine PostedDate: 11/30/97 11:01:31 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 11:53:54 PM-11/30/97 11:53:54 PM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 11:53:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi I have problems with hooking a solar engine type 1 to a circuit. How do i connect it because it won't fire regulair anymore. I saw a solar engine in Steven Bolt's design which i could try. But are there any other designs available? Thanks, Bram $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) with SMTP id 88256560.002B60B7; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 23:53:48 -0800 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA15416 for ; Sun, 30 Nov 1997 23:43:36 -0800 Received: from smtp1.xs4all.nl (smtp1.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.51]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA02496 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 1997 01:02:07 -0600 Received: from 486dx4-100 (ztm07-28.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.32.221]) by smtp1.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with ESMTP id IAA27644 for ; Mon, 1 Dec 1997 08:01:59 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: <199712010701.IAA27644@smtp1.xs4all.nl> From: "AA van Zoelen" To: Subject: Re: Biocore Clock stepper? Date: Sun, 30 Nov 1997 20:02:49 +0100 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: vsim@xs4all.nl From: vsim@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Biocore Clock stepper? PostedDate: 11/30/97 11:02:49 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 11/30/97 11:53:54 PM-11/30/97 11:53:56 PM DeliveredDate: 11/30/97 11:53:56 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > Van: Dennison > Aan: BEAM > Onderwerp: Biocore Clock stepper? > Datum: donderdag 6 november 1997 4:56 > > > What exactly is a: > stepper driven clock? > >From what I can peice together it's a stepper motors that is driven instead > of by four or six wires, by one?? and is made to turn with a pulse, (square > wave?) like something from a 555? Am I close? Clocks with fingers that run on a battery are often driven by a stepper motor. Bram.