$AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.00119A05; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:12:15 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA21252 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 19:58:23 -0700 From: PFoster716@aol.com Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00476 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:29:30 -0500 Received: from emout02.mail.aol.com (emout02.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.93]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id TAA16984 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 19:19:21 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout02.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id UAA07656 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:19:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:19:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970901201914_1388687067@emout02.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: More free gears SMTPOriginator: PFoster716@aol.com From: PFoster716@aol.com Subject: More free gears PostedDate: 09/01/97 05:19:16 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 08:12:26 PM-09/01/97 08:12:27 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 08:12:27 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I have come across a cool timer unit with lots of hacking possibilities. I am a auto mechanic by trade and it seems that 1988 Jeep Cherokees (and possibly other jeep/Chrysler vans & truck) have an Emissions Maintenance Timer that is set to trip a warning light on the dash at about 68,000 miles or so. It is located under & to the right of the steering wheel behind the knee panel. According the service procedure after performing the emission inspection, you are supposed to unplug and or discard the unit (OH NO, not Discard!!!). So here you have a clear plastic case 2 1/2" x 2 1/2" x 1 1/4". Open it up and , OPPS! , all the gears are now on the floor.. Draw a picture first.. Anyway, inside is a couple of cmos I.C.s (mc14060 & mc140027) providing a pulse train to a single inductor stepper motor, very much like a large clock motor. Then the gears start. As you may have guest the gear reduction is tremendous. The stepper motor fires about once a second, the final gear tripe the switch 68,000 miles later. O.K., so you don't have to use all the gears. you do get 3 very nice nylon combination gears 5t & 60t with .060" holes and 2 steel shafts, plus a couple of combo gears with there own pointed ended shafts and some weird cogged gears, plus a nice stepper motor. well, good luck, you may try finding one at a Chrysler or jeep garage, or a friend with a jeep. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.0011ED57; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:15:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA21255 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:04:00 -0700 Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00489 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:29:45 -0500 Received: from mail.compmore.net (mailr.compmore.net [206.222.80.2]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id QAA16463 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 16:40:50 -0500 Received: (from uucp@localhost) by mail.compmore.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) id RAA23425; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 17:32:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from port72.compmore.net(206.222.81.72), claiming to be "ken-huntington" via SMTP by mail.compmore.net, id smtpd023417; Mon Sep 1 17:32:15 1997 Message-ID: <340B36D6.7B59@compmore.net> Date: Mon, 01 Sep 1997 17:42:46 -0400 From: "Ken (K.G.A.) Huntington" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com CC: khaupt@iupui.edu Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: kenh@compmore.net From: kenh@compmore.net Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues PostedDate: 09/01/97 02:42:46 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com CopyTo: khaupt@iupui.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 08:15:51 PM-09/01/97 08:15:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 08:15:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > > > Hi, > > > > I just breadboarded my first flashing led solar engine. > > I'm using a .1 farad cap, 2n2222, 2n2907, 2.2k resistor, the flashing > > led, and a motor ripped from a Walkman. It's overcast here > > today, so I'm using 2 AA batteries in series with a 5.6k resistor to > > simulate the solar cell. > > > > Problem... > > > > The circuit charges great to about 1.7 volts, then the fled starts > > flashing. The circuit continues to charge to the max voltage, and the > > fled is flashing happily, but the transistor never fires. I know the > > circuit works otherwise because when I short across the fled the motor > > spins ( for one damn long time ) and everything starts over. I just > > can't get the fled to fire it. I have tried replacing the 2.2k resistor > > with a 5.6k - same results, then with a 1.0k resistor - same results. > > > > I then replaced the 5.6k I was using to limit current from the batteries > > with a 1.0k - same results, the circuit just charges faster. > > > > I know just the basics of how transistors work, but it seems the fled > > is not pulling the base of the 2n2907 low enough, or for long enough > > to get it to turn on. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. > > > > John > > two things happened later that day. > > 1) the sun came out, and I started using a solarbotics purchased solar > cell. > > The circuit did the same thing. > > 2) I have about 5 walkman derived motors around, so on a whim I tried a > different one. > > The circuit now works fine. > > Both motors draw about 25mA at 1.5volts, and to the resolution I can > measure it, they both have the same resistance when stopped. > I don't have the equipment to > look at the transient characteristics of the motors, so as far as I can > determine other than being a slightly different size, they are the same. > > I put the old motor back in, and the circuit fails again. > > someone please 'splain it to me. > Hello John, Since the fled is firing and you can force the unit to fire, the problem should be the motor(s) you are using. The 2907 is only partially turned by the FLED which causes the 2222 to start conducting through the motor but there must be sufficient impedance so that a voltage greater than 0.7V is developed across the motor so that further current may be drawn through the 2907. If this does not happen the circuit turns into a parallel voltage regulator. If your motor has a capacitor across it, the engine may not fire as it provides a low impedance when the 2222 first starts to conduct. The inductance of the motor is what causes the impedance to be high at firing time. Without inductance the motor would never start because the motor resistance is too low for 0.7V to develop across it for the combined current gain of the 2907/2222. (motor resistance is usually around 10 Ohms but the effective resistance, when running, is 1.5 / 0.025 mA = 60 Ohms.) If you wish to verify this, replace your motor with a 56 Ohm and then a 10 Ohm resistor. The circuit should work fine with the 56 Ohm but not at all with the 10 Ohm. There is a circuit, that I use, which does not rely on the motor characteristics. You may find it more complicated than you would like but it triggers on much less light than the FLED based solar engine (but that does not mean it is more efficient, just that it will work at lower light levels). http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-lezersbijdrage.html If you continue to have problems or don't understand some of what I've written, give me a shout. Ken $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.00134426; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:30:26 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA21260 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:18:21 -0700 From: RobMaier@aol.com Received: from emout08.mail.aol.com (emout08.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.23]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA02943 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 21:28:48 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout08.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id WAA17798 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:28:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:28:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970901222645_940363856@emout08.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: dis-similar gearboxes for walker SMTPOriginator: RobMaier@aol.com From: RobMaier@aol.com Subject: dis-similar gearboxes for walker PostedDate: 09/01/97 07:28:44 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 08:30:28 PM-09/01/97 08:30:29 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 08:30:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Ok, I attached a walkman style motor to my newfound gearbox. seems to work good. Sill need to tune for least current draw. I am running it dry, no lube. Question: do I need lube? grease or oil? Second question: this is the only gearbox like this one I could find, should I look for another exactly the same (reduction, torque & speed) or will I be able to run with 2 different gearboxes (but same motors)? I'll add photos if the assembly to the "OTU photo page" soon ( http://members.aol.com/robmaier/index.html ) ~~Rob $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.001498F8; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:44:58 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA21268 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:33:01 -0700 Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA00574 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:30:57 -0500 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id HAA14699 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 07:43:07 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA13803 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 08:43:09 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709011243.IAA13803@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp21.buffnet.net(205.246.19.128) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma007327; Mon, 1 Sep 97 08:42:08 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: In the distance...GEAR BOX OAISIS! Date: Mon, 1 Sep 1997 20:41:51 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: In the distance...GEAR BOX OAISIS! PostedDate: 09/01/97 06:41:51 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 08:45:06 PM-09/01/97 08:45:06 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 08:45:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US My quest has come to an end. I have found the eternal fountain of gearbox's easy to hack, easy to use and easy to obtain. Anyone know the littl wind up toys? Like the two shoes that *walk* when wound. Or a wind up MCdonalds toy? Belive it or not but the gearbox inside is actually good. Some even have metal casing! I don't have any pictures (I'm workin on it) But if you've seen a gearbox befor and have had enough experience to have spare gears lying around, the hack will be easy. Since there are somany of these toys the hack is almost assured to be diffrent each time, but still very basic. Notes: When connecting the motor, take note the of the gear orientation. You will want to attach it to the output shaft (the one that connected to wheels etc.) not the windup shaft! Do not remove the wind up shaft! The windup shaft is what you will use for your output (driving wheels or legs) The RPM is reasonably slow and strong. When the moderate sized gearboxes are interefaced with a tape motor, TONS of torque. E-mail me if anyone wants me to be more specific. I'm workin on pictures, belive me. Does anyone have susgestions on HOW I do my pictures? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.0018DF0B; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 21:31:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA21306 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 21:19:34 -0700 Received: from ns2.icon.net (mailhost.icon.net [209.54.6.22]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA05093 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:45:59 -0500 Received: from asnd105.icon.net (asnd105.icon.net [209.54.8.105]) by ns2.icon.net (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) with SMTP id WAA16412 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:43:13 -0500 Date: Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:43:13 -0500 Message-Id: <199709020343.WAA16412@ns2.icon.net> X-Sender: lepowell@icon.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: "Lawrence E. Powell Sr." Subject: Question SMTPOriginator: lepowell@icon.net From: lepowell@icon.net Subject: Question PostedDate: 09/01/97 08:43:13 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 09:31:42 PM-09/01/97 09:31:43 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 09:31:43 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello to all I have only just joined this group a few days ago and have enjoyed the information that has been passed to me via the e-mail system very much. I have for years look for a forum such as this as I'm sure many of you have also. The innovation and exuberance of high energy that has been expressed I fined all to refreshing. One of the individuals that wrote a letter I believe mentioned that they worked at a toy factory. I would like very much to fined out if there is any one out there that has any experience making or can direct me to information about making nylon gears. It does not appear to be that difficult but the only info I have on the subject is readying material. I would like to fined some one that is or has actually performed the task of manufacturing such a widget. As far as hydraulics I have worked on units that where required to control there environment with the use of hydraulics and other power sources. The device is a TCR 100 if an one out there recognizes such a designator. RCA manufactured the device in the late sixties and there are some in use today I believe. The device could handle substances as light as tissue paper at speeds in excess of one hundred miles an hour. I'm currently working on a biped that is similar to the pig on robocop show. The design has intrigued me ever sense I first saw it in the movie. Also I would like to know if there is any one out there that has worked with or applied the dynamics of a gyro to there project. Hope to be of more assistance in the future. I will keeping reading and if I fined a question that I can help with I will jump in if that is ok. OH also does any one know of a good simulation software set out there for motor control and timing. Giving all the glory to God and God bless you all. Lawrence E. Powell Sr. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.00203485; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:51:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA21374 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:39:59 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA05879 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 23:58:21 -0500 Received: from Solarbotics.Cadvision.com (ts27ip219.cadvision.com [207.228.69.219]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id WAA19068; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:57:51 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970901225114.00bdeac8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 01 Sep 1997 22:51:14 -0600 To: "Brian O. Bush" , beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: magbot-like solar engines In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: magbot-like solar engines PostedDate: 09/01/97 09:51:14 PM SendTo: bushbo@xtdl.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 10:51:49 PM-09/01/97 10:51:50 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 10:51:50 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:26 PM 8/30/1997 -0400, Brian O. Bush wrote: >Is there any type of coil I should look out for... Many turns of fine, fine wire. There. That's the single most important thing to look for. Many turns of thick wire? NOPE! Not enough inductance and probably too heavy. Small coil about the size of a dime? NOPE! Again, not enough inductance. Look for something about the size of nickel to a quarter. >Does the solar engine need a different resistor value, which also >determines its efficiency and starting power? Depends on the inductance of the coil you use. Start low (ie: 47_ohms_ ) and up the value until it starts working flakey. Then come down down about 25% in value. >Any ideas, or comments, or "one-for-all" sources for coils (i have been >using old relays and homemade ones). Home-make _can_ work, if you don't mind them being thick'n'clunky. Try floppy drives and other "flat" motors. Peel'em RIGHT APART, until you see brushes and coils. That should get you going... BTW, Solarbotics is now ordering custom-made coils for our Magbot Sundancer Butterflys in sufficient quantity that we won't be "out of stock" much longer. We will probably start selling the coils individually early in '98. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.00206E94; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:54:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA21380 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:42:31 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA05880 for ; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 23:58:22 -0500 Received: from Solarbotics.Cadvision.com (ts27ip219.cadvision.com [207.228.69.219]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id WAA94880; Mon, 1 Sep 1997 22:57:53 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970901225327.00bd9424@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 01 Sep 1997 22:53:27 -0600 To: RobMaier@aol.com, beam@webconn.com (beam) From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: more-scrounging for OTUs In-Reply-To: <970830225744_-1969337810@emout17.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: more-scrounging for OTUs PostedDate: 09/01/97 09:53:27 PM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/01/97 10:54:22 PM-09/01/97 10:54:23 PM DeliveredDate: 09/01/97 10:54:23 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:57 PM 8/30/1997 -0400, RobMaier@aol.com wrote: >After applying two band aids, (to my hand) I discover the gearbox is a flat >pear shape with six pins inside, but only four gears. One gear is plastic the >rest metal. The pinion from the motor is a 2mm shaft type. I will have to >find a gear to interface my pager motor with, so I guess I'm stuck at this >point.... ...for now. You can shim up a pager motor output shaft to 2mm with a layer or two of heat-shrink tubing. Then power up the motor and sand the shaft down to the exact press-fit size required. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.0029FAEA; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 00:38:32 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA21501 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 00:26:48 -0700 From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Received: from emout01.mail.aol.com (emout01.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.92]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA07112 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 01:48:40 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout01.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id CAA05010 for beam@webconn.com; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 02:48:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 02:48:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970902024833_775648707@emout01.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: cd motors/groups SMTPOriginator: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Subject: cd motors/groups PostedDate: 09/01/97 11:48:35 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 12:38:37 AM-09/02/97 12:38:38 AM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 12:38:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm a newbie..i've already scrounged and got two Sanyo cd motors(all the other Sanyo cd/dual tape player parts...including cd reading head/circuitry).... i'm trying to get off on the right foot......(also have an electric shaver motor and associated circuitry....the motor isn't HE,though... Question......Are cd motor's appropriate for BEAM applications? I've looked long and hard with my pal,Hotbot and I can't find a BEAM group in my area........... I live in Trenton,GA......Approx.....30 min south of Chattanooga,TN. I am currently attending UTC after a 4 year stint in the Navy as an Avionics Tech on the F/A-18 Radar and FLIR/Laser fire control systems......sure...I'm a squid....... If anyone has any info on cd motors OR groups in my area....it'd be much appreciated............ Jason Courter Xx1101xX@aol.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.0048B850; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 06:14:17 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA21708 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 06:02:10 -0700 Received: from suw3svr01.hisd.harris.com (suw3svr01.hisd.harris.com [158.147.19.67]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA09958 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 07:25:01 -0500 Received: from isdlink1.hisd.harris.com (isdlink1.hisd.harris.com [158.147.18.223]) by suw3svr01.hisd.harris.com (8.8.4/8.8.4/jjs) with SMTP id IAA13349; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 08:24:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from ccMail by isdlink1.hisd.harris.com (SMTPLINK V2.11.01) id AA873213984; Tue, 02 Sep 97 08:23:57 est Date: Tue, 02 Sep 97 08:23:57 est From: "PAtkinso" Message-Id: <9708028732.AA873213984@isdlink1.hisd.harris.com> To: "R. Nortman" , beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? SMTPOriginator: patkinso@harris.com From: patkinso@harris.com Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? PostedDate: 09/02/97 06:23:57 AM SendTo: rnortman@tezcat.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 06:14:26 AM-09/02/97 06:14:27 AM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 06:14:27 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US One possible source for small pneumatics (compressor, cylinders, valves and tubing) is the Lego (tm) Technic series. They have a small single-action cylinder used in a compressor, as well as a storage tank. Some of the pieces are available individually thru Lego (tm) Spare Parts. Another (cheap) possibility for pneumatic cylinders is medical syringes. There is at least one educational supply house which sell a pneumatic learning package based on syringes, plastic tubing, etc. (That's Pitsco 1-800-835-0686 in the USA.) Also I believe that there is a pneumatic valve based on nitinol (memory wire) which is able to regulate pressure. I don't recall seeing any details, but a web search might turn up something. (Nitinol uses lots of current, so likely is not suitable for solar powered use.) Paul $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.0079ED1D; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:11:45 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA24077 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 14:59:58 -0700 Received: from aries.EE.McGill.CA (Aries.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.75.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16142 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:34:47 -0500 Received: from xenon.EE.McGill.CA (root@Xenon.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.31.100]) by aries.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id QAA21174 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 16:44:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (chiarth@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xenon.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id QAA28213 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 16:44:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 16:44:29 -0400 (EDT) From: Arthur Ching X-Sender: chiarth@xenon Reply-To: Arthur Ching To: beam Subject: Microcore controls. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca From: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca Subject: Microcore controls. PostedDate: 09/02/97 01:44:29 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 03:11:48 PM-09/02/97 03:11:49 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 03:11:49 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi everyone, I am relatively new to the scene and need some basic information on how a microcore functions as a controller. More specifically, how to get it to read feedbacks and what sort of response the microcore gives. I need this information for designing a controller that is supposed to track the sun so as to maximise the power it receives. I know that this is not a legged robot, but how a biomorph manages to negotiate an obstacle seems similar to what I want my solar array to do. Please be as detailed as possible in your suggestions: I'm an EE student, I can take it! ;) Thanks in advance. Arthur. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.007B4C33; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:26:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA24133 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:14:55 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16163 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:38:31 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts24ip98.cadvision.com [207.228.69.98]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA53266; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 14:46:48 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902144030.00e514b8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 14:40:30 -0600 To: "Mark W. Dalton" , beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: A few FYI's In-Reply-To: <199708211401.IAA22430@butch.acl.lanl.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: A few FYI's PostedDate: 09/02/97 01:40:30 PM SendTo: mwd@acl.lanl.gov,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 03:26:47 PM-09/02/97 03:26:48 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 03:26:48 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 08:01 AM 8/21/1997 -0600, Mark W. Dalton wrote: >1. Newsgroup: I will take this up in 2 weeks after I move. > I have written up most of the proposal. > e-mail: > People can still receive e-mail, but I will assume all would > prefer the newsgroup. I will send out e-mail well in advance. Actually, I still prefer having the email over the newsgroups. It doesn't seem reasonable to expect you (Mark D.) to keep doing the (splendid) job you've been doing in more than one arena at a time. All we really need is to move the list-server to a provider that'll give us MAJOR-DOMO-style access like the [STAMP] list has. I don't think you have to reinvent the wheel twice/thrice... -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256506.007B7964; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:28:40 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA24149 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:16:53 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16166 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 15:38:54 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts24ip98.cadvision.com [207.228.69.98]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA120020; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 14:46:44 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902143321.00e52f5c@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 14:33:21 -0600 To: Mark Lerman , beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Whiskers In-Reply-To: <2.2.16.19970821082128.3c3f439e@popd.ix.netcom.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Whiskers PostedDate: 09/02/97 01:33:21 PM SendTo: mlerman@ix.netcom.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 03:28:48 PM-09/02/97 03:28:50 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 03:28:50 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:15 AM 8/21/1997 -0500, Mark Lerman wrote: >I'm using a .009 inch guitar string as the actual whisker. Tried making a >'spring coil' like Dave and others have used, but couldn't make them nearly >so neat. (How in the world do you do that Dave?). Not that hard, actually. We made a turning fixture out of 3/32 wire, and soldered on a small sleeve on the end. Chuck it into a variable-speed drill, insert the wire into the sleeve, and slowly start turning the drill over. Guide the wire on carefully with your fingertips (don't worry - won't hurt) so it spools up properly. When you've got as long as you want. Stop the drill and CAREFULLY release tension - the wire will spin off the fixture as you remove the other end from the sleeve. Tada - one spring! -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.000821B9; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 18:28:49 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA24868 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 18:16:47 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us ([198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA18011 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:31:59 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA03386; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 17:35:39 -0700 Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 17:24:42 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Xx1101xX@aol.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: cd motors/groups In-Reply-To: <970902024833_775648707@emout01.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: cd motors/groups PostedDate: 09/02/97 05:24:42 PM SendTo: Xx1101xX@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 06:28:56 PM-09/02/97 06:28:57 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 06:28:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > > Jason Courter > Xx1101xX@aol.com > > Geez. How _did_ you get an Email address like that? Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.0008B141; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 18:34:56 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA24886 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 18:23:05 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us ([198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA18064 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:39:46 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA03705; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 17:43:35 -0700 Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 17:32:39 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: PAtkinso cc: "R. Nortman" , beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? In-Reply-To: <9708028732.AA873213984@isdlink1.hisd.harris.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? PostedDate: 09/02/97 05:32:39 PM SendTo: patkinso@harris.com CopyTo: rnortman@tezcat.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 06:35:04 PM-09/02/97 06:35:05 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 06:35:05 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Tue, 2 Sep 1997, PAtkinso wrote: > Also I believe that there is a pneumatic valve based on nitinol > (memory wire) which is able to regulate pressure. I don't recall > seeing any details, but a web search might turn up something. > (Nitinol uses lots of current, so likely is not suitable for solar > powered use.) > > Paul > No, but remeber: Muscle Wire is _heat_ activated, not electrically. In the Mondotronics catalog they show it using batteries because the electricity flowing through it generates heat, thus making it contract. Actually, I see no reason why you couldn't put the stuff at the focal point of a small Fresnel lens, and then maybe a small pager motor activated shutter over it.. Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.000EB566; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:40:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA24960 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:28:54 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA18487 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:38:42 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA21043 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:38:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709030138.VAA21043@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from gppp6.buffnet.net(205.247.124.113) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma029388; Tue, 2 Sep 97 21:37:27 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: microcore motor problems. Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 09:36:38 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: microcore motor problems. PostedDate: 09/03/97 07:36:38 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 07:40:43 PM-09/02/97 07:40:43 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 07:40:43 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I've got virtually everything working, except my motor drivers. I'm using one PNP and one NPN on each side of the motor. When I have one PNP,NPN combination at one end of the motor connected to one inverter it works fine is the other side of the motor is at positive and the powwer is draining though the motor through the transitors. but when I put the other end to ground so that power flows through the transitors then trough the motor the Net locks up. When I set up two combinations for a full motor controller the same thing happened. The circuit works fine when it "sinks" the power (I think that the right word, power flow's through the motor first, then the trans) but when it comes time for the trans to source the power, it locks up. And as a side note, my transitors say 100ma on the package. Ehh, I'm workin on it. Unfortuanatly school starts very soon for me and my robots will take back burnner for a while. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.000EBF4B; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:41:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA24963 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:29:18 -0700 From: galt@facility.cs.utah.edu Received: from cs.utah.edu (cs.utah.edu [128.110.4.21]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA18472 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:37:34 -0500 Received: from lal.cs.utah.edu by cs.utah.edu (8.8.4/utah-2.21-cs) id TAA17838; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:37:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: by lal.cs.utah.edu (8.8.4/utah-2.15sun-leaf) id TAA04683; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:37:23 -0600 (MDT) Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:37:23 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199709030137.TAA04683@lal.cs.utah.edu> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? SMTPOriginator: galt@facility.cs.utah.edu From: galt@facility.cs.utah.edu Subject: Re: Anybody used pneumatics? PostedDate: 09/02/97 06:37:23 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 07:41:14 PM-09/02/97 07:41:15 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 07:41:15 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Garret wrote: >No, but remeber: Muscle Wire is _heat_ activated, not electrically. In the >Mondotronics catalog they show it using batteries because the electricity >flowing through it generates heat, thus making it contract. Actually, I >see no reason why you couldn't put the stuff at the focal point of a small >Fresnel lens, and then maybe a small pager motor activated shutter over >it.. An LCD shutter would be interesting if it could get dark and clear enough. Just imagine a walker made like that... completely silent... Greg $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.000EFEA5; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:43:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA24966 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:31:29 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA18520 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:44:01 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x64U5-00032r-00; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:43:53 -0400 Received: from ts6-03.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts6-03.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.151.146]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id VAA12653 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:44:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709030144.VAA12653@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 21:19:08 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: cd motors/groups SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: cd motors/groups PostedDate: 09/02/97 06:19:08 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 07:43:57 PM-09/02/97 07:43:58 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 07:43:58 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 02:48 AM 9/2/97 -0400, Xx1101xX@aol.com wrote: > I'm a newbie Welcome. Being a newbie isn't as bad as you make it sound! And we were all there at one time. . . Except Mark. ..i've already scrounged and got two Sanyo cd motors(all >the other Sanyo cd/dual tape player parts...including cd reading >head/circuitry).... Careful with the Laser, stuff. I'm sure you know how to handle it (see work experience, below) but some others may not. Make sure you know about the dangers involved in using lasers. The 'gallows-humor' among laser-techs is "Don't look at the bright light with your remaining eye!" >i'm trying to get off on the right foot......(also have an electric shaver >motor and associated circuitry....the motor isn't HE,though... > Question......Are cd motor's appropriate for BEAM applications? Don't know about the spin-motor, but I have a few here that I've been meaning to try . . . > > I've looked long and hard with my pal,Hotbot and I can't find a BEAM group >in my area........... Is that an invitation?!?!?! We'll be right over! :) With interest in this list increasing steadily (over 300) more of us are starting to find local BEAM-pals. Perhaps one of us with a Website will host an index of locations? We can't have each of us (300!!!) posting a plea for locals to the list; there wouldn't be any room for building topics. > > I live in Trenton,GA......Approx.....30 min south of Chattanooga,TN. > I am currently attending UTC after a 4 year stint in the Navy as an Avionics >Tech on the F/A-18 Radar and FLIR/Laser fire control systems......sure...I'm >a squid....... That job must have had some interesting aspects; like the great big noisy planes!!!! > >If anyone has any info on cd motors OR groups in my area....it'd be much >appreciated............ > > Jason Courter >Xx1101xX@aol.com > Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.0010B7DB; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:02:36 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA24990 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 19:50:35 -0700 From: cam_bremner@vtech.com.hk Received: from meifoo.hk.super.net (meifoo.hk.super.net [202.14.67.37]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18706 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:00:09 -0500 Received: (from Uvtech@localhost) by meifoo.hk.super.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with UUCP id JAA14299; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 09:25:02 +0800 (HKT) X-Authentication-Warning: meifoo.hk.super.net: Uvtech set sender to cam_bremner@vtech.com.hk using -f Received: from cc:Mail by vtech.com.hk id AA873301216 Wed, 03 Sep 97 08:40:15 Date: Wed, 03 Sep 97 08:40:15 Message-Id: <9708038733.AA873301216@vtech.com.hk> To: rnortman@tezcat.com, garrett myrick CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re[2]: OTU Question SMTPOriginator: cam_bremner@vtech.com.hk From: cam_bremner@vtech.com.hk Subject: Re[2]: OTU Question PostedDate: 09/03/97 01:40:15 AM SendTo: rnortman@tezcat.com,gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:02:39 PM-09/02/97 08:02:40 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:02:40 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US "No these are the low-tech wind-up mechanical timers used in your oven or washer/dryer." No... not quite right. The OTU's are the rotor and gearhead from 'shaded pole open frame AC induction motors' They are a part of the oven - the part with the little knobs that stick out of the front with which you can set your oven to come on at a certain time, and shut off at a later time. Grab this whole unit (at the dump, junk shop, surplus, etc...) and turn it over. There will be a bunch of plastic or metal gears, and a transformer-looking thing with 2 wires - See www.solarbotics.com/otu for a picture of the transformer thing. This is the only part you really want. They are line powered devices that spin a rotor in the field generated by a large square transformer. The small metal can embedded in the iron transformer core is the rotor and gear enclosure. The rotor is geared down a few thousand times, to turn a small brass pinion that drives the clockwork that controls your oven. Cam. ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: OTU Question Author: garrett myrick at Supernet Date: 9/2/97 4:01 PM On Fri, 29 Aug 1997, R. Nortman wrote: > > OK, I've seen everything in http://www.solarbotics.com/otu/. But what > _is_ an oven timer unit? Are we talking about something that comes > from actual ovens, or those little wind-up things often called kitchen > timers? No these are the low-tech wind-up mechanical timers used in your oven or washer/dryer. deletia... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.001207BE; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:16:56 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25022 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:03:14 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18800 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:18 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA12032; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:49 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902200625.00e194c8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 20:06:25 -0600 To: khaupt@iupui.edu, beam From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues In-Reply-To: <3408015F.743A@iupui.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues PostedDate: 09/02/97 07:06:25 PM SendTo: khaupt@iupui.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:17:10 PM-09/02/97 08:17:11 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:17:11 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:17 AM 8/30/1997 -0400, John and Kelly wrote: >Both motors draw about 25mA at 1.5volts, and to the resolution I can >measure it, they both have the same resistance when stopped. >I don't have the equipment to >look at the transient characteristics of the motors, so as far as I can >determine other than being a slightly different size, they are the same. > >I put the old motor back in, and the circuit fails again. > >someone please 'splain it to me. 'tis our fault (well, kinda). The motors included with the SE kits are decent, but not the best. What you're seeing is a fault in the motor where the brushes aren't very well aligned up with the rings. We see this about once in 300 units. Using the walkman motors (which are better) just goes to prove that this is indeed the problem. If you want, we can replace your motor with a free replacement. Contact us direct if so, ok? Regards, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.0012261D; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:18:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25031 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:06:30 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18794 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:01 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA38480; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:38 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902195437.00e194c8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 19:54:37 -0600 To: Randy Sargent , BEAM Mailing List From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: gears vs. rubber bands In-Reply-To: <199708300121.SAA17237@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: gears vs. rubber bands PostedDate: 09/02/97 06:54:37 PM SendTo: rsargent@newtonlabs.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:18:18 PM-09/02/97 08:18:19 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:18:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 06:21 PM 8/29/1997 -0700, Randy Sargent wrote: >Has anyone tried using small rubber bands and pulleys instead of gears? Yes. The major problem with them is that there is an inherent inefficiency because of the continual bending & straightening of the rubber as it goes around the pulleys. I've done a few experiments with them, and the increased friction (pulling the pulleys together also caused bearing friction) make them hard to accept for a serious BEAM-bot. For beginners, it's a great way to reduce the curve to getting something going, but for long-term BEAMing, stick with gears. Like you also say, the rubber degrades over time. I don't know how many 1st-generation 'bots of Mark's I've seen dead on the shelf partly due to the belts cracking & breaking. Regards, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.00123BC8; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:19:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25033 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:06:51 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18803 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:18 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA76630; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:57 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902201157.00e194c8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 20:11:57 -0600 To: khaupt@iupui.edu, beam From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: dremel comment In-Reply-To: <340808BB.5560@iupui.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: dremel comment PostedDate: 09/02/97 07:11:57 PM SendTo: khaupt@iupui.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:19:20 PM-09/02/97 08:19:20 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:19:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:49 AM 8/30/1997 -0400, John and Kelly wrote: >Dennlill wrote: >> In the mean time I'm saving up for a Dremel tool, especialy because >> the gear box axel holes were made with an Exacto knife! > >I think Dremel's are way over rated. I have one and hardly use it. HERETIC! Blasphemer! ..uh...GENERALLY NAUGHTY BOY! I personally have used my Dremel for many things, even as an impromptu hammer. Love it. And not them gutless battery-powered versions that Mark T. and Miller rave about. Call it personal preference. But then again, sometimes I'm doing some pretty industrial work with it where a battery just wouldn't last. >For somewhere between free and $5.00 you should be >able to find something to hold small drill bits for drilling by hand. >Try the local hobby shop. They're called "Pin drills". Mine has a hollow handle for holding the tiny bits. They're decent, not _too_ expensive (mine was $8), and have a permanent spot in my kit. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.00127C0D; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:21:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25040 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:10:08 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18809 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:25 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA89204; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:58 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902201330.00ea214c@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 20:13:30 -0600 To: Andrew Miller , beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: A few things about AUVs In-Reply-To: <34081BFF.435A@golden.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: A few things about AUVs PostedDate: 09/02/97 07:13:30 PM SendTo: amiller@golden.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:22:03 PM-09/02/97 08:22:03 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:22:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 09:11 AM 8/30/1997 -0400, Andrew Miller wrote: >and for those that are interested a standard pager motor fits inside a >MacDonalds straw...... And for a *real* buzz, try up yer nose! Ok, ok, so answering 2 weeks of back-email tend to make me a bit giddy. Phlblt! -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.00127D87; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:21:57 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25037 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:09:56 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18801 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:13:18 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA12096; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:55 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902200816.00e194c8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 20:08:16 -0600 To: khaupt@iupui.edu, beam From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: fled solar engine question In-Reply-To: <34080261.29DB@iupui.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: fled solar engine question PostedDate: 09/02/97 07:08:16 PM SendTo: khaupt@iupui.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:22:03 PM-09/02/97 08:22:05 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:22:05 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:22 AM 8/30/1997 -0400, John and Kelly wrote: >My solar engine charges to about 1.7 volts. >The fled begins flashing at this point, but the engine doesn't fire. >With the fled flashing, the circuit charges to about 2.5 volts, >THEN it fires discharging to about .85 volts, and starts over again. > >Is this behavior typical? Yup. Higher bias resistors (10k+) will trigger the SE at a slightly lower voltage, but in general, this _is_ the appropriate behaviour. But for more reliable operation, shield the FLED from light with heat-shrink or black electrical tape. Intense light can make them go flakey. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.0013ECFA; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:37:38 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25054 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:25:44 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18830 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:14:39 -0500 Received: from dave.cadvision.com (ts66ip115.cadvision.com [207.228.75.115]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA54780; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 20:12:36 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970902195024.00e194c8@cadvision.com> X-Sender: skip@cadvision.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 19:50:24 -0600 To: garrett myrick , "R. Nortman" From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: OTU Question Cc: BEAM Mailing List In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: OTU Question PostedDate: 09/02/97 06:50:24 PM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us,rnortman@tezcat.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 08:37:42 PM-09/02/97 08:37:42 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 08:37:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:40 PM 8/29/1997 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >> OK, I've seen everything in http://www.solarbotics.com/otu/. But what >> _is_ an oven timer unit? Are we talking about something that comes >> from actual ovens, or those little wind-up things often called kitchen >> timers? > >No these are the low-tech wind-up mechanical timers used in your oven or >washer/dryer. Nope - not wind-up. Induction coil "Shaded Pole" motors. These are the units that live in the back of the old spinning number-type or clockface units most commonly found on (duh) ovens. And occasionally in dryers/washers. >>So now I'm considering either >> pager motors + OTU gearboxes or modified model airplane servo motors. I found these units to be *quite* acceptable as el-cheapo gearmotors. Relatively strong, servicable, and available. Thoroughly recommended. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.0018854F; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:27:49 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA25116 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 21:15:53 -0700 Received: from iris.iupui.edu (iris.iupui.edu [134.68.220.32]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA20107 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 22:34:18 -0500 Received: from khaupt.iupui.edu (c1p45.dialin.iupui.edu [134.68.241.146]) by iris.iupui.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA01105 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 22:34:12 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <340CCB41.2120@iupui.edu> Date: Tue, 02 Sep 1997 22:28:17 -0400 From: John and Kelly Reply-To: khaupt@iupui.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: khaupt@iupui.edu From: khaupt@iupui.edu Subject: Re: fled misfire, the saga continues PostedDate: 09/02/97 07:28:17 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: khaupt@iupui.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 09:27:52 PM-09/02/97 09:27:53 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 09:27:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Dave Hrynkiw wrote: > > At 07:17 AM 8/30/1997 -0400, John and Kelly wrote: > >Both motors draw about 25mA at 1.5volts, and to the resolution I can > >measure it, they both have the same resistance when stopped. > >I don't have the equipment to > >look at the transient characteristics of the motors, so as far as I can > >determine other than being a slightly different size, they are the same. > > > >I put the old motor back in, and the circuit fails again. > > > >someone please 'splain it to me. > > 'tis our fault (well, kinda). The motors included with the SE kits are > decent, but not the best. What you're seeing is a fault in the motor where > the brushes aren't very well aligned up with the rings. We see this about > once in 300 units. Using the walkman motors (which are better) just goes to > prove that this is indeed the problem. > > If you want, we can replace your motor with a free replacement. Contact us > direct if so, ok? > Hate to break it to you Dave, but it's not your fault. I built the circuit Ken Huntington clued me into. It has worked like a champ with all caps, motors, and light conditions I've tested it with. For those of you having solarengine woes, look at... http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-lezersbijdrage.html Oh, Dave, I'm sure I could dig up a completely hosed up motor to send you in order to get my free replacement. I'll look around and let you know. Thanks again Ken. John $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.001E87FE; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 22:33:28 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA25185 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 22:21:36 -0700 From: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu Received: from pegasus.montclair.edu (pegasus.montclair.edu [130.68.20.55]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA20957 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:44:51 -0500 Received: from localhost (mccullou@localhost) by pegasus.montclair.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA16881 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 00:44:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 00:44:20 -0400 (EDT) To: beam@webconn.com Subject: X-Files Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu From: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu Subject: X-Files PostedDate: 09/02/97 09:44:20 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 10:33:31 PM-09/02/97 10:33:32 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 10:33:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm watching an episode of The X-Files on FX. There are a swarm of 'alien' cockaroaches(an advanced space probe) killing people in a small town. The local robot researcher (in the local underground mad scientist's lab) described a very BEAM-like philosophy of robot design. I was just wondering... Have any of you guys been holding out on the rest of us? Dave Mc $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.00241917; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:34:17 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA25273 for ; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:22:32 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey.cadvision.com [204.50.1.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA21405 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 00:46:11 -0500 Received: from ts66ip121.cadvision.com (ts66ip121.cadvision.com [207.228.75.121]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id XAA72984; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:45:48 -0600 Received: by ts66ip121.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCB7F9.0543CB40@ts66ip121.cadvision.com>; Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:36:22 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCB7F9.0543CB40@ts66ip121.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: X-Files Date: Tue, 2 Sep 1997 23:36:13 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: X-Files PostedDate: 09/02/97 10:36:13 PM SendTo: mccullou@pegasus.montclair.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/02/97 11:34:24 PM-09/02/97 11:34:25 PM DeliveredDate: 09/02/97 11:34:25 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm watching an episode of The X-Files on FX. There are a swarm of 'alien' cockaroaches(an advanced space probe) killing people in a small town. The local robot researcher (in the local underground mad scientist's lab) described a very BEAM-like philosophy of robot design. I was just wondering... Have any of you guys been holding out on the rest of us? Bah no, everyone is now always thinking there's a conspiracy on everything, too much "Roswell ufo crash, gov coverup" tv shows rot the brain and make changes to logic. *Gesture to Mark T* "build 20 elerium 225 powered nano-bots....That should take care of um...for now" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256507.00568582; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 08:45:02 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA25997 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 08:33:17 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA24134 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 09:35:33 -0500 Received: from darwin (dialup19.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.238]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id KAA11679 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 10:52:15 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970903103338.0098fb40@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 03 Sep 1997 10:33:38 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: cd motors/groups In-Reply-To: <199709030144.VAA12653@inforamp.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: Re: cd motors/groups PostedDate: 09/03/97 07:33:38 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/03/97 08:45:09 AM-09/03/97 08:45:10 AM DeliveredDate: 09/03/97 08:45:10 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >> I've looked long and hard with my pal,Hotbot and I can't find a BEAM group >>in my area........... > >locations? We can't have each of us (300!!!) posting a >plea for locals to the list; there wouldn't be any room >for building topics. If anyone wants I can place there name (contact info) and city to the FAQ under the question: Are there any BEAM Robotics groups?. Just send the info to me via email to avoid splattering the list. Cheers, Brian --- Brian O. Bush, mailto:bbush@xtdl.com Creative Optics, Inc. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.001D93C8; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:23:03 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA29268 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:11:01 -0700 From: BDGuttery@aol.com Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA02241 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 23:29:35 -0500 Received: from emout06.mail.aol.com (emout06.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.97]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id QAA25649 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 16:55:46 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout06.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA07077 for beam@webconn.com; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 17:55:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 3 Sep 1997 17:55:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970903175531_974512528@emout06.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: BEAMer Web List SMTPOriginator: BDGuttery@aol.com From: BDGuttery@aol.com Subject: BEAMer Web List PostedDate: 09/03/97 02:55:40 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/03/97 10:23:09 PM-09/03/97 10:23:11 PM DeliveredDate: 09/03/97 10:23:11 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In a message dated 97-09-03 06:23:23 EDT, you write: << I've looked long and hard with my pal,Hotbot and I can't find a BEAM group >in my area........... Is that an invitation?!?!?! We'll be right over! :) With interest in this list increasing steadily (over 300) more of us are starting to find local BEAM-pals. Perhaps one of us with a Website will host an index of locations? We can't have each of us (300!!!) posting a plea for locals to the list; there wouldn't be any room for building topics. >> I could host such a page, in about a month or so...in the process of moving (had to pack up the Bot--sniff.). If everyone wants to email me with their home town/county/state/country (no addresses or telephone numbers, I should think), I don't foresee a problem with a locale/email address database-page. I will prolly keep the AOL address for another two months...but I am switching. Any takers? Bill Soon to Be in Oklahoma City.... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.001F4D76; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:41:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA29285 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:30:03 -0700 Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA02230 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 23:29:20 -0500 Received: from bud.cc.swin.edu.au (bud.cc.swin.edu.au [136.186.1.113]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id SAA26015 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 18:35:01 -0500 Received: (from 092891@localhost) by bud.cc.swin.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id JAA15137; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 09:24:40 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 09:24:39 +1000 (EST) From: Andrew Leslie Murdoch <092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au> To: "BEAM group." Subject: hello Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: 092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au From: 092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au Subject: hello PostedDate: 09/03/97 04:24:39 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/03/97 10:42:02 PM-09/03/97 10:42:02 PM DeliveredDate: 09/03/97 10:42:02 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US hi two messages ! Does this mean I'm not a newbie ? Second question. What is the difference between 74ls14 and 74ls04 ? Can the 7404 be used for the microcore ? I think it is a hex trigger, but not a Schmitt (?) trigger. thanks andrew $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.001F732A; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:43:31 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA29292 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:31:40 -0700 Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA02233 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 23:29:22 -0500 Received: from bud.cc.swin.edu.au (bud.cc.swin.edu.au [136.186.1.113]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id SAA26043 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 18:42:46 -0500 Received: (from 092891@localhost) by bud.cc.swin.edu.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) id IAA09458; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 08:39:53 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 08:39:52 +1000 (EST) From: Andrew Leslie Murdoch <092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au> To: "BEAM group." Subject: Oh no, another newbie ! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: 092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au From: 092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au Subject: Oh no, another newbie ! PostedDate: 09/03/97 03:39:52 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/03/97 10:43:34 PM-09/03/97 10:43:35 PM DeliveredDate: 09/03/97 10:43:35 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US hi everyone. I've been haunting the list for a couple of week now, ever since I saw an article about Beam in a newspaper. (Sydney Morning Herald.) I've built a solarengine and it actually works. Now I just have to fit wheels etc to it. I am studying to be a mechanical engineer and have a lot to learn about electronics. I was wondering if there was a more detailed description of the solarengine circuit than the one on the websites ? Thanks, Andrew. Reality.sys not found. Universe halted. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.0020C51F; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:57:56 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA29317 for ; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 22:46:05 -0700 Received: from ns.webconn.com (ns.webconn.com [206.42.142.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA02295 for <"beam"@webconn.com>; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 23:31:11 -0500 Received: from ksbe.edu (ksbe.edu [204.63.136.4]) by ns.webconn.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id MAA24791 for <"beam"@webconn.com>; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 12:57:19 -0500 Received: from ksbe.edu by ksbe.edu (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA32156; Wed, 3 Sep 1997 07:40:33 -1000 Message-Id: <340DA563.3371@ksbe.edu> Date: Wed, 03 Sep 1997 07:58:59 -1000 From: Edi Alvare Reply-To: edalvare@ksbe.edu Organization: KSBE X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: "BEAM 'BOTTERS" <"beam"@webconn.com (BEAM)> Subject: BEAM in HI Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: edalvare@ksbe.edu From: edalvare@ksbe.edu Subject: BEAM in HI PostedDate: 09/03/97 10:58:59 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: edalvare@ksbe.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/03/97 10:58:01 PM-09/03/97 10:58:02 PM DeliveredDate: 09/03/97 10:58:02 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Aloha, Anyone known a BEAM group in or around Honolulu? I would be interested even if its in one of the neighbour islands. Doing this "stuff" is hard work without others to compare/show your efforts and errors to. How can one start a BEAM group? Aloha, Edi $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.004256E9; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 05:04:36 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA29505 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 04:52:46 -0700 Received: from smtp2.sympatico.ca (smtp2.on.sympatico.ca [204.101.251.53]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA04700 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 06:01:40 -0500 Received: from LOCALNAME (ppp3286.on.sympatico.ca [206.172.221.22]) by smtp2.sympatico.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA13075; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 07:01:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <340EC016.61EF@sympatico.ca> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 07:05:10 -0700 From: Frank Faubert X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: edalvare@ksbe.edu CC: BEAM Subject: Re: BEAM in HI References: <340DA563.3371@ksbe.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: frank.faubert@sympatico.ca From: frank.faubert@sympatico.ca Subject: Re: BEAM in HI PostedDate: 09/04/97 07:05:10 AM SendTo: edalvare@ksbe.edu CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 05:04:45 AM-09/04/97 05:04:45 AM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 05:04:45 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Edi Alvare wrote: > > Aloha, > > Anyone known a BEAM group in or around Honolulu? I would be interested even if its in > one of the neighbour islands. Doing this "stuff" is hard work without others to > compare/show your efforts and errors to. > > How can one start a BEAM group? > > Aloha, > Edi Hi Edi, Well, starting a BEAM group is really hard so I suggest that you send some tickets to all of us up here in Canada, and we'll come out there and show you how it's done ;-) You can't say that I don't try. Anyhow, about all there is to starting a BEAM group (or any other group for that matter) is to find some kindered souls on the island and get together over some pizza and the beverage of your choice. This list is also a great place for info and meeting new people. Dave Hockeyrink is kinda BEAM central for kits and pics with Andrew Miller as THE site for tech info up here in the hinterland. Mark D. watches over the US and Brian Bush looks out for the UK and Europe. These folks seem to always have an answer for most problems. Keep smilin (makes folks wonder what you're up to) Frank $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.0049C985; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 06:25:57 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA29595 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 06:13:56 -0700 Received: from golden.net (golden.net [199.166.210.183]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA05277 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 07:36:28 -0500 Received: from marvin (cisco1-36.cas.golden.net [207.6.168.36]) by golden.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA26673; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 08:35:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <340EAC1E.45A4@golden.net> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 08:39:58 -0400 From: Andrew Miller Organization: AM innovations X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andrew Leslie Murdoch <092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au> CC: "BEAM group." Subject: Re: hello References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: amiller@golden.net From: amiller@golden.net Subject: Re: hello PostedDate: 09/04/97 05:39:58 AM SendTo: 092891@bud.cc.swin.edu.au CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 06:26:03 AM-09/04/97 06:26:03 AM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 06:26:03 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Andrew Leslie Murdoch wrote: > > hi > two messages ! Does this mean I'm not a newbie ? > > Second question. What is the difference between 74ls14 and 74ls04 ? Can > the 7404 be used for the microcore ? I think it is a hex trigger, but not > a Schmitt (?) trigger. > You're right the only major difference is the Schmitt aspect, but it's an important one..... The Schmitt trigger offers a prolonged hysteresis and provides the MicroCore with thresholds that are significant but not fixed.... In other words the damn thing works better.... I've tried 74c04 with varying degees of sucsess... Loses some of it's stability and dosn't adapt well..... As far as MicroCore goes 74LSXX is not a good move... Internal pull up resistors cuase the LS to require Bigger caps, more power and eventually it'll fry.... You need 74C14 or 74HC14 or 40106 will even work..... the C is deffinatly your best bet...... all4nw $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.006771FF; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 11:49:53 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA01120 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 11:37:57 -0700 Received: from robotic.com (mac2.robotic.com [204.95.191.99]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA08213 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 12:51:32 -0500 Received: from [204.95.191.113] by robotic.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 1.2); Thu, 4 Sep 1997 12:57:59 -0500 Subject: Nitinol & Solar Engines? Date: Thu, 4 Sep 97 12:52:48 -0500 x-sender: clint@mail.robotic.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0v2, June 6, 1997 From: Clint Laskowski To: "Mark W. Tilden" , "BEAM Mail List" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Message-ID: <1338744617-119727347@robotic.com> SMTPOriginator: clint@mac2.robotic.com From: clint@robotic.com Subject: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/04/97 10:52:48 AM SendTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 11:49:56 AM-09/04/97 11:49:56 AM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 11:49:56 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Mark: Has anyone done a walker based on "muscle wire" (i.e., Flexinol) with power from a BEAM-like solar engine? One of the problems with small muscle wire walkers is that they generally have to be tethered to a power source. I'd like to try a muscle wire walker based on a solar engine (caps charged by solar cells). I'm wondering anyone has done anything like this? Any web pages with info? -- Clint $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.00715242; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 13:37:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA01610 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 13:25:55 -0700 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA08936 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 14:45:23 -0500 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA03320; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 13:45:19 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA23153; Thu, 4 Sep 97 13:44:31 MDT Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <1338744617-119727347@robotic.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 13:48:13 -0700 To: Clint Laskowski From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/04/97 01:48:13 PM SendTo: clint@robotic.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 01:37:57 PM-09/04/97 01:37:58 PM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 01:37:58 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi. I built a series of beam-walkers and things several years ago when I was studying nitenol. It works, but nitenol at less than 2% efficiency taxes even die-hard beamer patience. I wrote a chapter on my experiences for a IEEE book called... 7. Tilden, M. W., "The Future of Nitinol Propelled Walking Robots," in Stiquito: Advanced Experiments with a Simple and Inexpensive Robot, edited by James M. Conrad and Jonathan W. Mills, IEEE Computer Society Press: Los Alamitos, CA, 1997. ISBN 0-8186-7408-3. ...which may or may not be out yet and I can't give you details until it is. The bottom line is, stick to motors and solinoids. Nitenol is a heartbreak technology. Trust me. markt. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256508.007A2121; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 15:13:58 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA02054 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 15:02:13 -0700 Received: from smtp1.wanadoo.fr (smtp.wanadoo.fr [193.252.19.36]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09429 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 15:59:00 -0500 Received: from alexandre (bjn2-24.abo.wanadoo.fr [193.252.142.24]) by smtp1.wanadoo.fr (8.7.5/[France Telecom Interactive]) with SMTP id WAA25821 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 22:58:46 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <340F2261.4C18@wanadoo.fr> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 23:04:33 +0200 From: Alexandre Reply-To: Thierry.Alexandre@wanadoo.fr Organization: personnal X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Stepper motors Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: Thierry.Alexandre@wanadoo.fr From: Thierry.Alexandre@wanadoo.fr Subject: Stepper motors PostedDate: 09/04/97 02:04:33 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: Thierry.Alexandre@wanadoo.fr $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 03:14:03 PM-09/04/97 03:14:04 PM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 03:14:04 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello people of the new future, Is one of you can help me on the following research : I am looking for a supplier of unipolar four-phase stepper motors with gearbox with the following caracteristics. Supply voltage : 5-12 Volts Thickness : no more than 25 mm (one inch) Gear ratio : 30 to 60 Thanks a lot for your help on this. A personal robotics hobbyist from Paris, France. thierry Alexandre $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.0000019C; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 17:00:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA02464 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 16:48:11 -0700 Received: from aries.EE.McGill.CA (Aries.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.75.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10272 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 18:03:06 -0500 Received: from bell.EE.McGill.CA (root@Bell.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.42.15]) by aries.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id TAA22020 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 19:04:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (chiarth@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by bell.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id TAA13684 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 19:04:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 4 Sep 1997 19:04:27 -0400 (EDT) From: Arthur Ching X-Sender: chiarth@bell To: beam Subject: Pros and Cons? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca From: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca Subject: Pros and Cons? PostedDate: 09/04/97 04:04:27 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 05:00:12 PM-09/04/97 05:00:13 PM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 05:00:13 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi, Has anyone out there compiled a list of advantages and disadvantages of using a microcore in design? How does it compare with other designs in terms of factors such as space (the area it takes up), and power consumption? I have already read about how it fares against digital design in robotics... Art. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.0000328E; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 17:02:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA02481 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 16:50:21 -0700 Received: from ns.cancom.net (ns.cancom.net [205.206.217.33]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10280 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 18:04:51 -0500 Received: from default (ts-duclos-p3.cancom.net [205.250.149.5]) by ns.cancom.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA11319; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 19:04:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <340F3C25.1D4A@cancom.net> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 19:54:29 -0300 From: Tenhawk Reply-To: tenhawk@cancom.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Mark W. Tilden" CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: tenhawk@cancom.net From: tenhawk@cancom.net Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/04/97 03:54:29 PM SendTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: tenhawk@cancom.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 05:02:15 PM-09/04/97 05:02:16 PM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 05:02:16 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Mark W. Tilden wrote: > > Hi. I built a series of beam-walkers and things several years ago when I > was studying nitenol. It works, but nitenol at less than 2% efficiency > taxes even die-hard beamer patience. I wrote a chapter on my experiences > for a IEEE book called... > > 7. Tilden, M. W., "The Future of Nitinol Propelled Walking Robots," in > Stiquito: Advanced Experiments with a Simple and Inexpensive Robot, edited > by James M. Conrad and Jonathan W. Mills, IEEE Computer Society Press: Los > Alamitos, CA, 1997. ISBN 0-8186-7408-3. > > ...which may or may not be out yet and I can't give you details until it is. > > The bottom line is, stick to motors and solinoids. Nitenol is a heartbreak > technology. Trust me. > > markt. Well how about combining the two? use motors for gross movments and use the nitonal for the fine motor actions... I actually thought of this a couple weeks ago while watching a cartoon on fox. (I know I know... I really need a life) Anyway what gave me this idea was watching a computer animated cheeta walk. It seemed to be a perfect madel for a walking robot. The gross motor movements could be powered by efficient solor motors. (by gross motor movements I mean the movments of the leg back and foreward) then use a small amount of nitinol to lift the leg off the ground so the motor could move the leg ahead or back... Please let me know if this works... (I'm basicly a very vain person so I want to know if I was right... hehehehe) Tenhawk $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.00193321; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 21:35:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA03120 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 21:23:28 -0700 Received: from hoser (in221.inetnebr.com [199.184.119.221]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12295 for ; Thu, 4 Sep 1997 22:48:08 -0500 From: bill_r@inetnebr.com (Bill Richman) To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: magbot-like solar engines Date: Fri, 05 Sep 1997 03:44:44 GMT Message-ID: <34167ef9.255692496@hoser> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: bill_r@inetnebr.com From: bill_r@inetnebr.com Subject: Re: magbot-like solar engines PostedDate: 09/04/97 08:44:44 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/04/97 09:35:19 PM-09/04/97 09:35:20 PM DeliveredDate: 09/04/97 09:35:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I salvaged some little transparent plastic speakers from an old "walkman" style tape player with built-in speakers. I then cut out the center of the speaker (right around the coil) and carefully cut the wires leading from the coil to the diaphragm. These coils (which are about the size of a dime, and about 1/16" thick) in combination with some 1/4" diameter rare-earth magnets from Radio Shack produce a pretty good "kick" when powered by a solar engine. While I doubt it's enough to move a 'bot, it would *certainly* flap wings on a solar-powered butterfly, dragonfly, etc. I plan to build one with them once I find something suitably cool to use for wings... On Sat, 30 Aug 1997 22:26:30 -0400, you wrote: >Is there any type of coil I should look out for... that works. I have >tested coils with various characteristics, such as ohms, number of turns >(yes, i have spent hours winding and winding... still haven't found an old >crank drill), magnet wire/regular wire. -Bill Richman bill_r@inetnebr.com http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------ "When they took the fourth amendment, I was quiet because I didn't deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I was quiet because I was innocent. When they took the second amendment, I was quiet because I didn't own a gun. Now they've taken the first amendment, and I can say nothing about it." -www.paranoia.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.003BC1B3; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 03:52:42 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA03375 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 03:40:38 -0700 Received: from invfacty.factory.com (invfacty.factory.com [199.183.47.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA14331 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 05:30:44 -0500 Received: from murk.factory.com by invfacty.factory.com with SMTP (5.65/1.2-eef) id AA08645; Fri, 5 Sep 97 06:24:52 -0400 Received: from factory.com by bbsnet with UUCP ; Fri, 05 Sep 97 06:20:23 EDT To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Stepper motors From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) Message-Id: <353954.500.uupcb@factory.com> Date: Fri, 5 Sep 97 03:25:00 -0500 Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York NY - 212-274-8110 Reply-To: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) References: <340F2261.4C18@wanadoo.fr> SMTPOriginator: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com Subject: Stepper motors PostedDate: 09/05/97 01:25:00 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 03:54:27 AM-09/05/97 03:54:27 AM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 03:54:27 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > I am looking for a supplier of unipolar four-phase stepper motors with > gearbox with the following caracteristics. > Supply voltage : 5-12 Volts > Thickness : no more than 25 mm (one inch) > Gear ratio : 30 to 60 Not *quite* what you're looking for, but try the stepper motor that positions the drive head in a 3.5" floppy drive. The motor itself would be small enough to be what you're looking for, and if you keep the ballscrew arrangement (linear motion, not rotary motion), the "gearing down" should be about what you're looking for as well. --- . SLMR 2.0 #..jw . ...so I hit him back fist. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.00463530; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 05:46:51 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA03467 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 05:35:05 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA15006 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 07:30:57 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x6xXF-0003h6-00; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 08:30:49 -0400 Received: from ts5-15.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts4-08.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.151.183]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id IAA10497 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 08:31:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709051231.IAA10497@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 05 Sep 1997 08:05:32 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/05/97 05:05:32 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 05:50:07 AM-09/05/97 05:50:08 AM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 05:50:08 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:54 PM 9/4/97 -0300, tenhawk@cancom.net wrote: [snip] >Mark W. Tilden wrote: [snip] >> The bottom line is, stick to motors and solinoids. Nitenol is a heartbreak >> technology. Trust me. >> >> markt. > >Well how about combining the two? use motors for gross movments and use >the nitonal for the fine motor actions... >I actually thought of this a couple weeks ago while watching a cartoon >on fox. (I know I know... I really need a life) >Anyway what gave me this idea was watching a computer animated cheeta >walk. It seemed to be a perfect madel for a walking robot. >The gross motor movements could be powered by efficient solor motors. >(by gross motor movements I mean the movments of the leg back and >foreward) >then use a small amount of nitinol to lift the leg off the ground so the >motor could move the leg ahead or back... >Please let me know if this works... (I'm basicly a very vain person so I >want to know if I was right... hehehehe) >Tenhawk > Is that "basicly vain", or just a little "lazy"? :-) If you think that this is a good idea, even after the contrary advice, then build it! That's better than opinion, isn't it? :-) Mondotronics has nitenol starter kits, with a book full of experiments. It isn't too expensive: www.robotstore.com . . .If I remember correctly. Also, if I remember correctly, from my experimenting with nitenol, it can take _amps_ of current to heat it enough for contraction. It is also fairly slow, let's say six to ten cycles per minute. So, for a back of the envelope calculation: We'll presume that your four-legged walker needs four pieces of nitenol, and that activating all four in sequence results in one "step" for the 'bot. Two steps, takes eight activations of one amp, over the course of one minute. We'll presume that only one leg is activated at a time, so each leg gets 25 percent duty-cycle; lots of time to cool off and extend. Now all you need is a solar engine that will provide one amp for one minute . . . hmmmm. Not impossible, just bigger than usual. Again, this is just a first-guess, from the top of my head, so if I'm off by a few orders of magnitude . . . Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.00734886; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 13:59:12 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA05427 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 13:47:24 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA17946 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 15:14:31 -0500 Received: from darwin (dialup08.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.227]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA25615 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:31:16 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970905161222.009975b0@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 05 Sep 1997 16:12:22 -0400 To: beam From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: Pros and Cons of Nv Network technology? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: Re: Pros and Cons of Nv Network technology? PostedDate: 09/05/97 01:12:22 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 01:59:45 PM-09/05/97 01:59:47 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 01:59:47 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Art et al. ... Good question. Here are some of the pros and cons from a nervous network point of view... if anyone disagrees with any of the following, feel free to correct any views... Advantages of Nv technology: ---------------------------- * small circuit * low power, efficient, thus increased life span for components * immunity to noise (quantitative value?) * immunity to radiation (larger than traditional computers) * cheap, readily available components (well, maybe not the motors) * a design methodology that gives linear ability for linear complexity. * simple equivalents to Central Pattern Generators (CPGs) for those interested in mimicry of biological processes. * breaks the von Neumann bottleneck. Nv networks are completely different computational paradigm. Disadvantages of Nv technology: ------------------------------- * relatively new area, thus there is not alot of literature in comparison to digital electronics (however, Tilden's books are coming...) * no design software, thus prototyping requires alot of work in comparion to digital circuits * it is relatively unknown what happens as you scale up in Nv net size * Tilden says that homogeneous Nv networks loose phase competency at large integration scales -> possible solution: smaller coupled networks(?) * Nv networks are not independent, thus complete system knowledge must be considered... like the kind of motors, your power supply and Nv network are very related. This is also true for traditional robotics, however I believe it is more pronounced in BEAM robotics. ----- and the main disadvantage: * too much fun, thus wife gets mad at you for not cleaning the dishes,... ----- Cheers, Brian >Has anyone out there compiled a list of advantages and disadvantages of >using a microcore in design? How does it compare with other designs in >terms of factors such as space (the area it takes up), and power >consumption? I have already read about how it fares against digital >design in robotics... --- Brian O. Bush, mailto:bbush@xtdl.com Creative Optics, Inc. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.0077AE86; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 14:47:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA05667 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 14:35:11 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA18530 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:26:13 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA00643 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:26:22 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709052126.RAA00643@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp12.buffnet.net(205.246.19.119) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma003876; Fri, 5 Sep 97 17:25:38 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: 74ALS245 Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 05:24:02 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: 74ALS245 PostedDate: 09/06/97 03:24:02 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 02:50:33 PM-09/05/97 02:50:34 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 02:50:34 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Welcome and the Question of the day is.... 1. Which 74ALS245 is best? The regular Octal Bus Transeiver OR the 74ALS245 Octal Bus Transeiver with 3 state output? 2. How many amps do pager and Walkman type motors typically consume? 3. (this is for the solarbotics guy) The motor that you include with your solaroller kit, is this WAlkman type? and if so who is your source? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.0079774E; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 15:06:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA05783 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 14:54:57 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA18812 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:52:55 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA01149 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:52:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709052152.RAA01149@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp12.buffnet.net(205.246.19.119) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma009003; Fri, 5 Sep 97 17:51:55 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Stackin 14's Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 05:50:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Stackin 14's PostedDate: 09/06/97 03:50:17 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 03:10:49 PM-09/05/97 03:10:50 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 03:10:50 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Instead of using the 74245 to drive the motors did anyone ever think of stackin the core it self? like multiple 74HC14's? Would that work even? Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.007CDD85; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 15:43:51 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA05976 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 15:31:59 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA18784 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:49:50 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA01101 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:49:41 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709052149.RAA01101@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp12.buffnet.net(205.246.19.119) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma008479; Fri, 5 Sep 97 17:48:43 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: MOdular NV boards. Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 05:47:05 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: MOdular NV boards. PostedDate: 09/06/97 03:47:05 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 03:46:19 PM-09/05/97 03:46:20 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 03:46:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I had been thinking about some some sort of modualar NV net boards that would be fast and easy sturdy and strong Then I saw MArk T's Hextile boards and they sure are a great idea. Dennison About how long have the guru's of beam been workin on these things? $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.007EB75C; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:04:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA06099 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 15:52:18 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA19163 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:13:24 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA01566 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:13:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709052213.SAA01566@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp12.buffnet.net(205.246.19.119) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma013368; Fri, 5 Sep 97 18:12:59 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 06:11:22 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... PostedDate: 09/06/97 04:11:22 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 04:06:39 PM-09/05/97 04:06:41 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 04:06:41 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US * Tilden says that homogeneous Nv networks loose phase competency at large integration scales -> possible solution: smaller coupled networks(?) I'm sorry, I'm not stupid I assure you, I promise, but I have no idea what this means. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256509.00807634; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:23:08 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA06161 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:11:16 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA19516 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:51:45 -0500 Received: from [206.25.228.241] (dialup22.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.241]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02571; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:08:23 -0400 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709052149.RAA01101@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:56:52 -0400 To: Dennlill , BEAM From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: MOdular NV boards. SMTPOriginator: bushbo@xtdl.com From: bushbo@xtdl.com Subject: Re: MOdular NV boards. PostedDate: 09/05/97 03:56:52 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 04:26:52 PM-09/05/97 04:26:53 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 04:26:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Dennison et al.... Well, ever since I put up the info on the FAQ page on hextiles, I have had the idea of replicating the Hx 1.0 hextile... First prototype was in January 1997, then I realized that I wanted to understand more (sensors, grinding gear boxes and such), so to the back burner the prototyping board went. Just recently, I redid the entire thing with a lot extra pads and such to expand (ie., add sensors, PNCs) the board.... actually i am etching it right now. Due to my manufacturing constraints and costs, the boards are the boring rectangular shape (i.e., not hexagonal) :( but they can be easily made. Specifically, the board has six neurons, where one of them can be configured at solder time to be a PNC of two forms, which can be disabled via a jumper. The LEDs (at least what i am using are high eff ones...) and also can be disabled by removing a jumper. Basically, when all this is finished and I make any revisions, I will create a page (probably small) with the gerber files, and 1-1 images so if anyone wants to they can recreate the prototype board. I can't estimate a time now, but it will eventually be available to those who want it. watch this space. Cheers, Brian At 6:47 AM -0400 9/6/97, Dennlill wrote: >I had been thinking about some some sort of modualar NV net boards that >would be fast and easy sturdy and strong Then I saw MArk T's Hextile boards >and they sure are a great idea. > > >Dennison > >About how long have the guru's of beam been workin on these things? --- brian o bush, gearhead "the moment of terror is the beginning of life." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Robotics FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00001D01; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:01:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA06339 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:49:27 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA20400 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:48:08 -0500 Received: from [206.25.228.241] (dialup20.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.239]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA03824; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:04:49 -0400 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709052213.SAA01566@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:45:01 -0400 To: Dennlill , BEAM From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... SMTPOriginator: bushbo@xtdl.com From: bushbo@xtdl.com Subject: Re: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... PostedDate: 09/05/97 04:45:01 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 05:02:22 PM-09/05/97 05:02:24 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 05:02:24 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Dennison et al.... Well, what I was referring to (as described by Tilden)... was that a nervous network is inherently self-stabalizing in terms of how many pulses are flowing in the nervous network. From the patent (at http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/patent/patent.html ): "It is also possible to have more than one pulse propagating around the central sequencing loop 20, the number of pulses being determined by n, which represents the number of PDC's in the central sequencing loop 20. For an even number of PDC's n, the maximum number of pulses is n/2; for an odd number of PDC's n, the maximum number of pulses is (n-1)/2. In the four PDC central sequencing loop 20 illustrated, up to two pulses may propagate around the loop at any time." this self-stabalizing ability is obvious in a microcore (four nv neurons), it starts up saturated, right? not all of your debugging LEDs are active, right? ok... now if you scale this network up to, say, 12 neurons in one loop you still have a Nv network. To describe that all the neurons are more or less the same, they are considered homogeneous. Tilden said that he had problems with (interpretation here) the pulses (processes) keeping the processes stabalized, that is the following statement from Tilden's patent is not necessarily true with large Nv loops "If a PDC receives a new pulse while it is still in the process of delaying a previous pulse, the previous pulse is immediately passed to the output of the PDC and the new pulse is delayed" And with smaller coupled networks, I was referring to circuits such as a Bicore coupled to another Bicore, or Microcore. The coupling can be a IR sensor/detector, or a direct resistor and so on. On this scale, the Nv loops remain self-stabalizing. Hope this is clear. Cheers, Brian At 7:11 AM -0400 9/6/97, Dennlill wrote: >>* Tilden says that homogeneous Nv networks loose phase competency at large >>integration scales -> possible solution: smaller coupled networks(?) >I have no idea what >this means. --- brian o bush, gearhead "the moment of terror is the beginning of life." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Robotics FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00001E23; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:01:17 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA06341 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 16:49:30 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA20259 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:43:49 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA03834 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:43:49 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709052343.TAA03834@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp13.buffnet.net(205.246.19.120) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma004216; Fri, 5 Sep 97 19:43:05 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Patented Hextiles? Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 07:41:28 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Patented Hextiles? PostedDate: 09/06/97 05:41:28 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 05:02:23 PM-09/05/97 05:02:24 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 05:02:24 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey that makes me wonder, I have a small capacity for my own PCB makeing, although it is rather crummy it produces workables. Not that I have the desire or capital,energy, interest but are the hextiles patented? I know they are just circuit boards but since they use the microcore would they fall unbder the patent? DEnnison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00024896; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:24:56 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA06400 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 17:13:04 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA20823 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:08:43 -0500 Received: from [206.25.228.241] (dialup20.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.239]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA04268; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:25:26 -0400 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709052343.TAA03834@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:13:53 -0400 To: Dennlill , BEAM From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: Patented Hextiles? SMTPOriginator: bushbo@xtdl.com From: bushbo@xtdl.com Subject: Re: Patented Hextiles? PostedDate: 09/05/97 05:13:53 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 05:27:31 PM-09/05/97 05:27:32 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 05:27:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Dennison... No the hextiles are not patented, Tilden's patent covers hooking up PDCs in loops, that is, the microcore, BiCore and any other tech based on Nv technology. The boards are copyrighted I believe, but I can't see how there will be any problems if you are not making money off of your endeavours. I have a different design than that of the Hextile design, but the board is just the medium that makes the nervous network. Not a problem, just as long as I don't sell the board. Cheers, Brian At 8:41 AM -0400 9/6/97, Dennlill wrote: >Hey that makes me wonder, I have a small capacity for my own PCB makeing, >although it is rather crummy it produces workables. Not that I have the >desire or capital,energy, interest but are the hextiles patented? I know >they are just circuit boards but since they use the microcore would they >fall unbder the patent? >DEnnison --- brian o bush, gearhead "the moment of terror is the beginning of life." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM Robotics FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00088823; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:33:11 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA06528 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 18:21:19 -0700 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu [129.130.99.129]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA20896 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:15:28 -0500 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id TAA23560; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:19:20 -0500 Sender: dwhall@fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu Message-ID: <3410A188.49E5DE0F@ksu.edu> Date: Fri, 05 Sep 1997 19:19:20 -0500 From: Dean Hall Organization: EGM Design X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Dennlill CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... References: <199709052213.SAA01566@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dwhall@ksu.edu From: dwhall@ksu.edu Subject: Re: umm..* Tilden says that homogeneous... PostedDate: 09/05/97 05:19:20 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 06:37:51 PM-09/05/97 06:37:53 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 06:37:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Dennlill wrote: > > * Tilden says that homogeneous Nv networks loose phase competency at large > integration scales -> possible solution: smaller coupled networks(?) > I'm sorry, I'm not stupid I assure you, I promise, but I have no idea what > this means. Don't worry, you're not the first. Here's the way I read it: A homogeneous net is one that has been homogenized...like milk, but different. And the phase, just like anything adhering to the Dilbert principle, becomes less competent as more of them get involved (committees). But seriously folks: I think he's saying that the Nv nets won't keep a perfect phase as they get larger. Add more Nvs, and get more phase error. (it's tough to get an RC time constant to match another one even with 1% tolerance Rs and Cs; the same reasone no one has a turn signal that blinks at the rate of another's) So if you keep your network loops small, you'll keep your phase error (or time difference) small too. !!Dean $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.0010D5A3; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:03:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA06628 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:52:00 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA21826 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 21:11:29 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x7ALF-0002PN-00; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 22:11:17 -0400 Received: from ts27-01.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts27-01.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.150.32]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id WAA12720 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 22:11:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709060211.WAA12720@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 05 Sep 1997 21:45:53 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: 74ALS245 SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: 74ALS245 PostedDate: 09/05/97 06:45:53 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 08:08:30 PM-09/05/97 08:08:30 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 08:08:30 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:24 AM 9/6/97 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >Welcome and the Question of the day is.... > >1. Which 74ALS245 is best? The regular Octal Bus Transeiver OR the 74ALS245 >Octal Bus Transeiver with 3 state output? Same thing. Anything bearing the 74xx245 designation should have the (tri-state / 3-state / hi-Z) outputs. Different manufacturers will describe them differently because, I belive, of patents and trademarks. *Opperationally* should be identical. That said watch out for the tricky suffixes; if a chip suddenly shows up in your databook as 74xxnnnA, that "A" might make a difference. . . (See Winfield Hill's thread on 1600A FET's on sci.electronics.design for some gory details, it's months old so check 'Deja') > > >2. How many amps do pager and Walkman type motors typically consume? Depends on the load, and voltage, but . . . pager on an oven timer type gearbox, with a moderate load at around two volts, it will run about 70mA. Your mileage will vary. > >3. (this is for the solarbotics guy) The motor that you include with your >solaroller kit, is this WAlkman type? and if so who is your source? Yeah Dave, who is your source? Can I buy them all, then sell them back to you at a *huge* profit? :-) Dennison, I think he'll claim "Industrial Secret" on that one . . . > >Dennison > > > Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.0010E6A2; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:04:36 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA06631 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 19:52:49 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA21702 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:59:27 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id VAA06472 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 21:59:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709060159.VAA06472@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp53.buffnet.net(205.246.19.160) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma029552; Fri, 5 Sep 97 21:58:44 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Tilden says that homogeneous Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 09:57:05 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Tilden says that homogeneous PostedDate: 09/06/97 07:57:05 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 08:08:30 PM-09/05/97 08:08:32 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 08:08:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey yeh now I get it. Thanks alot! Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.0019164F; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 21:34:01 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA06679 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 21:22:08 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA22575 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 23:03:30 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA10710 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 21:06:46 -0700 Date: Fri, 5 Sep 1997 20:56:12 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Some ideas.. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Some ideas.. PostedDate: 09/05/97 08:56:12 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 09:38:54 PM-09/05/97 09:38:54 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 09:38:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi, I was was reading in the Mobile Robots book about DC-DC converters, and it seems like a pretty good idea. The switchy-thing type especially. Seems to me that you could use the high current-low voltage solar cells, then use the DC-DC converter to up the voltage. Then, you have a high current-normal voltage power supply. Anybody try this? Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00202565; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 22:51:07 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA06734 for ; Fri, 5 Sep 1997 22:39:10 -0700 Received: from zephyr.traveller.com (zephyr.traveller.com [206.166.224.206]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA23333 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 00:33:24 -0500 Received: from pierce.traveller.com (tnt1-dynpool1-181.hsv.tis.net [206.166.228.181]) by zephyr.traveller.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA14698 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 05:33:09 GMT Message-ID: <3410E9FF.1453@traveller.com> Date: Sat, 06 Sep 1997 00:28:31 -0500 From: Bill Pierce Reply-To: whpierce@traveller.com X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Some ideas.. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: whpierce@traveller.com From: whpierce@traveller.com Subject: Re: Some ideas.. PostedDate: 09/05/97 10:28:31 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: whpierce@traveller.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/05/97 10:54:06 PM-09/05/97 10:54:07 PM DeliveredDate: 09/05/97 10:54:07 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US garrett myrick wrote: > > Hi, > > I was was reading in the Mobile Robots book about DC-DC converters, and it > seems like a pretty good idea. The switchy-thing type especially. Seems to > me that you could use the high current-low voltage solar cells, then use > the DC-DC converter to up the voltage. Then, you have a high > current-normal voltage power supply. Anybody try this? > > Garrett Maxim has a app-note/design idea in this month's Maxim Journal for exactly that. But remember, the _maximum_ effficiency is 85%. That means you give up 15% or more of your energy before you ever get to your electronics & motors. But if you still interested, Maxim is very good about providing samples. You view datasheets and order their journal and samples thru their WEB site at: http://www.maxim-ic.com/StartPage.htm $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.002D0F29; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 01:12:10 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA06798 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 01:00:16 -0700 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA25365 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 02:59:45 -0500 Received: from odi (hlm01-02.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.3]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id JAA02326; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 09:59:38 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 10:02:04 +0200 (MET DST) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: garrett myrick cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Some ideas.. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Some ideas.. PostedDate: 09/06/97 01:02:04 AM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 01:14:49 AM-09/06/97 01:14:50 AM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 01:14:50 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Fri, 5 Sep 1997, garrett myrick wrote: > I was was reading in the Mobile Robots book about DC-DC converters, and it > seems like a pretty good idea. The switchy-thing type especially. Seems to > me that you could use the high current-low voltage solar cells, then use > the DC-DC converter to up the voltage. Then, you have a high > current-normal voltage power supply. Um, no, what you get is a *low* current, higher voltage supply. The power available (voltage x current) is diminished by losses in the converter, which depend on the type of circuit used and the variability of the load - you'll get best efficiency if the load is constant. In general, it is best to design for the lowest voltage for which you can obtain efficient motors, resorting to a converter only for some indispensable bit of electronics that really needs a higher voltage. Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.004CC17B; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 06:58:22 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA06953 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 06:46:35 -0700 Received: from golden.net (golden.net [199.166.210.183]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA26628 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 07:30:50 -0500 Received: from marvin (cisco4-208.cas.golden.net [207.6.168.208]) by golden.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA06545 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 08:30:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <34114DC1.30E2@golden.net> Date: Sat, 06 Sep 1997 08:34:09 -0400 From: Andrew Miller Organization: AM innovations X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Some ideas.. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: amiller@golden.net From: amiller@golden.net Subject: Re: Some ideas.. PostedDate: 09/06/97 05:34:09 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 07:00:43 AM-09/06/97 07:00:44 AM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 07:00:44 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > I was was reading in the Mobile Robots book about DC-DC converters, and it > seems like a pretty good idea. The switchy-thing type especially. Seems to > me that you could use the high current-low voltage solar cells, then use > the DC-DC converter to up the voltage. Then, you have a high > current-normal voltage power supply. Anybody try this? > > Garrett I've actually done this..... Although its a higher voltage MUCH lower current system.. Bill is right to say look in the direction of Maxim... Thay make the right stuff... In the old HBS (happy birthday singer) solar engine (now quite outdated) the level of effish was Very high but it was a quasi time based design, meaning that as soon as cap voltage got much over a volt the HBS timer started doin its thing. But in low light levels this means the solar engine triggers at say aboiut 1.3V, because the HBS triggers time wise before the cap is up to much higher voltage. Now most motors including the pager don't do much useful stuff untill 2+ volts. So the theory here was to take a Maxim 7660 voltage divider (creates at +5 -5 grnd situation) and run the HBS on the top +5-grnd and run the rest of the solar engine on -5 +5 that way by the time the HBS gets to 1.2V the power cap is at 2.4, boom motor goes MUCH better. Well it worked....sort of.... There is a .6V hump you have to get over, below that the internals of the 7660 leak a fair bit of juice. and as a result you need a bright bit of light to get the thing going once and then it'll go reasonable well in very low light levels. this is becase a HBS type solar engine only discharges to about .9V in nomal opp. so you never go back below the hump. You do however get quite a loss in the converter. for intance a calculator cell that puts out 2.6V 2mA (5.2mW) open gives a max of 5V .2mA (1mW)out of the 7660. I built a photovore based on this solar engine in 95 and it's still kicking about. although it is Lame and limps on one side. Overall its a interesting idea that I only bothered to try because a friend of mine stole a handfull of the 7660's and gave me a few. New solar engine/cell designs obsolete the idea as we now have a Much greater level of effish. I actually have a solar engine that'll work in strong moon light (once every 15-20 min or so). Don't be diswaded from trying though... It's a good idea that I may revist some day using a high poer sola cell... all4nw $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.005B21E5; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 09:35:24 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07022 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 09:23:31 -0700 From: RobMaier@aol.com Received: from emout04.mail.aol.com (emout04.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.95]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA29358 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 11:12:45 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout04.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id MAA25439 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:12:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:12:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970906121152_825673502@emout04.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: flex solar panel SMTPOriginator: RobMaier@aol.com From: RobMaier@aol.com Subject: flex solar panel PostedDate: 09/06/97 09:12:35 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 09:36:07 AM-09/06/97 09:36:07 AM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 09:36:07 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I found an interesting solar panel for sale at American Science Surplus: ( http://www.sciplus.com/cgi-bin/basket/873561562.64/wired/25937.html ) It is 1 3/4" x 6 1/8" and flexible ! They claim the output to be 1.5V @ 400ma in noon sun. Has anybody used one? what do you think about its efficiency and output ? (for a walker). I think the flexibility would make it useful for collecting sunlight from more than one angle. I did not order one yet (10 bucks!!). ~~Rob $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.0068E5E1; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:05:45 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA07135 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 11:53:48 -0700 Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA30247 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:25:53 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA14754 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:25:46 -0500 (CDT) Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 12:25:46 -0500 (CDT) Received: from whp-ny4-04.ix.netcom.com(199.183.44.132) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id sma014738; Sat Sep 6 12:25:31 1997 Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970906133220.4c277cda@popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: mlerman@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Lerman Subject: Nitinol & Solar Engines? SMTPOriginator: mlerman@ix.netcom.com From: mlerman@ix.netcom.com Subject: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/06/97 10:25:46 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 12:06:29 PM-09/06/97 12:06:30 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 12:06:30 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Circuit Cellar Ink had an article on a tiny nitinol powered robot. It was similar to 'stiquito', but was untethered and could carry a microprocessor. The secret was small whiskers that fed power via a conductive floor for negative power and a conductive mesh ceiling for positive. Very clever!. Mark Lerman $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.00759A07; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 14:24:31 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA07212 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 14:12:43 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA00719 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 15:02:40 -0500 Received: from ts72ip91.cadvision.com (ts72ip91.cadvision.com [207.228.76.91]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id OAA144618; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 14:01:53 -0600 Received: by ts72ip91.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBACC.0BBC0F20@ts72ip91.cadvision.com>; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 13:51:59 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBACC.0BBC0F20@ts72ip91.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Mark Lerman'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Nitinol & Solar Engines? Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 13:51:53 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Nitinol & Solar Engines? PostedDate: 09/06/97 12:51:53 PM SendTo: mlerman@ix.netcom.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 02:26:47 PM-09/06/97 02:26:48 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 02:26:48 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Circuit Cellar Ink had an article on a tiny nitinol powered robot. It was similar to 'stiquito', but was untethered and could carry a microprocessor. The secret was small whiskers that fed power via a conductive floor for negative power and a conductive mesh ceiling for positive. Very clever!. Reminds me of a silly old ride called "Bumper cars", just like with Velcro , a guy studied burr's, people laughed at his idea, he makes billions.... Devin "The mother of all invention is calamity " $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.007CB575; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 15:42:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA07239 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 15:29:42 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA02515 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:09:15 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts45ip116.cadvision.com [207.228.72.116]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA55300; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 16:08:42 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970906155620.00a96d20@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 06 Sep 1997 15:56:20 -0600 To: Dennlill , BEAM From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: 74ALS245 In-Reply-To: <199709052126.RAA00643@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: 74ALS245 PostedDate: 09/06/97 02:56:20 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 03:46:54 PM-09/06/97 03:46:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 03:46:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:24 AM 9/6/1997 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >3. (this is for the solarbotics guy) The motor that you include with your >solaroller kit, is this WAlkman type? and if so who is your source? Not quite as good as a regular walkman. Motors that are _designed_ to be battery operated are inherently more power efficient. After all, what good is a walkman if you have to swap the 2 "AA" cells every 1/2 hour? The motors in the Solarengine kit are not _bad_, but they're the best we could get for the price, plus the attached mechanism has some cool stuff. But the pager motors we carry are definitely very efficient. They're designed for 1.3V operation, and are very high-tech DC coreless motors. Regards, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.007F4A52; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 16:10:21 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA07250 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 15:58:27 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA03392 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:16:56 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts45ip116.cadvision.com [207.228.72.116]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA67176; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 16:16:23 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970906161521.00a9b260@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sat, 06 Sep 1997 16:15:21 -0600 To: RobMaier@aol.com, beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: flex solar panel In-Reply-To: <970906121152_825673502@emout04.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: flex solar panel PostedDate: 09/06/97 03:15:21 PM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 04:11:58 PM-09/06/97 04:11:59 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 04:11:59 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 12:12 PM 9/6/1997 -0400, RobMaier@aol.com wrote: >I found an interesting solar panel for sale at American Science Surplus: >Has anybody used one? what do you think about its efficiency and output ? >(for a walker). I think the flexibility would make it useful for collecting >sunlight from more than one angle. I did not order one yet (10 bucks!!). The rating is the only problem - 1.5V at 400mA. 1.5V isn't much good to regular electronics unless if converted by the previously discussed DC-DC converters. Even at which point they can't pump that much current to make it too worthwhile. What we need is the same cell in a configuration that gives 6V @ 100mA. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650A.0080B44D; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 16:25:47 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA07258 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 16:13:54 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA03942 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 18:11:46 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA23459 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 19:12:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709062312.TAA23459@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp54.buffnet.net(205.246.19.161) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma016839; Sat, 6 Sep 97 19:11:10 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Walkman motor's Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 07:09:34 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Walkman motor's PostedDate: 09/07/97 05:09:34 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 04:27:01 PM-09/06/97 04:27:02 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 04:27:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Industrial secret it is then! Oh well it dosen't matter I don't have any money anyway. But if anyone has that edmund SCientific catalog I was blabing about a while ago they have a great selection of small motors. However they arn't really competitivley priced compared to solarbotics. they are all about the same. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.0001794A; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:16:05 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA07353 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:04:12 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA04253 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 18:49:48 -0500 Received: from ts72ip91.cadvision.com (ts72ip91.cadvision.com [207.228.76.91]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id RAA90576 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:49:26 -0600 Received: by ts72ip91.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBAEB.D71834E0@ts72ip91.cadvision.com>; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:39:34 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBAEB.D71834E0@ts72ip91.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Re: 74ALS245 Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:39:31 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Re: 74ALS245 PostedDate: 09/06/97 04:39:31 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 05:17:11 PM-09/06/97 05:17:12 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 05:17:12 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:24 AM 9/6/1997 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >3. (this is for the solarbotics guy) The motor that you include with your >solaroller kit, is this WAlkman type? and if so who is your source? Not quite as good as a regular walkman. Motors that are _designed_ to be battery operated are inherently more power efficient. After all, what good is a walkman if you have to swap the 2 "AA" cells every 1/2 hour? The motors in the Solarengine kit are not _bad_, but they're the best we could get for the price, plus the attached mechanism has some cool stuff. But the pager motors we carry are definitely very efficient. They're designed for 1.3V operation, and are very high-tech DC coreless motors. Ok the real great walkman motors are made by mitsumi, they have an nice 24x cd-rom that I might think about buying, and then scrap my "Super slow 8x" for some great motors. Mitsumi.com is the north America Web Page, and usually American subsidiaries don't mention the "industrial supply's" they sell. www.mitsumi.co.jp has a bit of info about the goodies we want, and they sell some great 3.5 or 5.25 laptop drives. There where some motors which looked very very nice that came from a 3.5, but can't say who(nuff said). If you want killer motors, go to an low cost store, I have some really nice rare things that cannot be bought any where else. One hint for a great prop/motor setup is to buy an medium expensive hair blow drier, look for one that has an black plastic fan inside. If you see a clear plastic one it's trash(keep your receipts or open up the boxes in the store), The first time I hooked it up to an 9v bat, it was "normal", until I brought it along with me to daves, where he checked it out, suggested that it might be better with polarity switched. Lets just say a garbage bag, some duct tape, and a little bit of tinkering has an possible hovercraft robot to add to my collection. Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.000404F7; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:43:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA07379 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:32:06 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA04528 for ; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 19:18:45 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA02847; Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:22:01 -0700 Date: Sat, 6 Sep 1997 17:11:35 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Richard Weait cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Some ideas.. In-Reply-To: <199709062048.QAA09145@inforamp.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: Some ideas.. PostedDate: 09/06/97 05:11:35 PM SendTo: crs0274@inforamp.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/06/97 05:47:17 PM-09/06/97 05:47:17 PM DeliveredDate: 09/06/97 05:47:17 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 6 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: > At 08:56 PM 9/5/97 -0700, you wrote: > In each case, there will be losses just from the > conversion process, (heat, leakage, switching > transients, etc.) and if you can get a total > conversion efficiency of 85 percent you are doing > very well indeed! Actually, the Mobile Robots book _says_ that DC-DC converters have an about 80% effeciency. > You can calculate your total conversion efficiency > by dividing power_out by power_in, but don't trick > yourself by looking at instantaneous power or average > power. Those are two of the popular mistakes made > by the "Free Energy" whackos! Whackos?!?!-> It seems to me that DC-DC converters are "over unity"(kinda), to us "free energy whackos". If you accept the model of the infinite universe, then free energy is definately possible. Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.005CE230; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:54:32 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA07767 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 09:42:38 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA09079 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:02:01 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA05037 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:02:16 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709071602.MAA05037@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp45.buffnet.net(205.246.19.152) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma017399; Sun, 7 Sep 97 12:01:29 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Free Energy Engin Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:59:50 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Free Energy Engin PostedDate: 09/07/97 09:59:50 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 09:54:46 AM-09/07/97 09:54:46 AM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 09:54:46 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Yeh When I was little I built a crystall radio and latter tryed to use it to power something. Contrary to popular belife this system doesn't really work. Yes it does put out DC to run a earphone but that is about it. The power that comes out of an ordiany crystal radio is SOOO small that you would need many many crystall radios wired up to make something work. BUT as I tryed to do about two years ago was make a crystall radio fit inside of a "C" battery with little sucess (major miniturization) and you need more than just some general knowledge about electromagnetic radiation. In other words it takes alot of work. But completly possible. Once built it would be easy to tune the radios into either the sun's radiation or the earths field* to produce a "free energy" type battery for walkers etc. Hey it's worth the effort. Mabey. Dennison *If anyone has ever listened to the radio durring a thunderstorm and heard interference when ligthning flashed then you will understand what I am talking about. At any one time there are at least about One thousand lightning storms takeing place all over the earth. The frequency that lightning "broadcast's" at is actually tunable. and increases in strength depending on the atmosphereic temperature of the earth. Tune in, and you got some major power, or if you live up in canada, forget the lightning and use the satalite unfriendly solarflares. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.00658043; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:28:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA07792 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 11:16:42 -0700 Received: from mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (grunt.ksu.ksu.edu [129.130.12.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA11574 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:46:13 -0500 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu [129.130.99.129]) by mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5/mailhub+tar@ksu.edu) with SMTP id MAA27047; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 12:45:48 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3412E941.7728@ksu.edu> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 12:49:53 -0500 From: Dean Hall Reply-To: dwhall@ksu.edu Organization: EGM Design X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: RobMaier@aol.com CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: flex solar panel References: <970906121152_825673502@emout04.mail.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dwhall@ksu.edu From: dwhall@ksu.edu Subject: Re: flex solar panel PostedDate: 09/07/97 10:49:53 AM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: dwhall@ksu.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 11:29:54 AM-09/07/97 11:29:55 AM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 11:29:55 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Rob, Hmm.... I nabbed some cells of those dimensions that claimed similar output. However, I paid about $7....keep shopping. My cells are flimsy like an aluminum can, not flexible (as if they'd return to a flat shape). They don't take well to fingerprints on the collecting surface. (I'm thinking of some form of plastic wrap or lamination is needed) They have a funny wire running down the middle that's spot soldered in places. Essentially that wire picks up the + side, wile the whole underside of the cell is the - side. I tested the cell on an unusually warm sunny day Feb.4 in central Kansas and got about 0.5v 50mA. I haven't tested it in good sunlight yet. !!Dean RobMaier@aol.com wrote: > > I found an interesting solar panel for sale at American Science Surplus: > ( http://www.sciplus.com/cgi-bin/basket/873561562.64/wired/25937.html ) > It is 1 3/4" x 6 1/8" and flexible ! They claim the output to be 1.5V @ > 400ma in noon sun. > Has anybody used one? what do you think about its efficiency and output ? > (for a walker). I think the flexibility would make it useful for collecting > sunlight from more than one angle. I did not order one yet (10 bucks!!). $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.00761777; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:29:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA07884 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:17:57 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA15671 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:56:30 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x7oNX-0006iF-00; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:56:19 -0400 Received: from ts73-08.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts73-08.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.146.199]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id QAA02507 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:56:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709072056.QAA02507@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:30:36 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: flex solar panel SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: flex solar panel PostedDate: 09/07/97 01:30:36 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 02:30:18 PM-09/07/97 02:30:20 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 02:30:20 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 12:49 PM 9/7/97 -0500, Dean Hall wrote: >Rob, > >Hmm.... I nabbed some cells of those dimensions that claimed similar >output. However, I paid about $7....keep shopping. > >My cells are flimsy like an aluminum can, not flexible (as if they'd >return to a flat shape). They don't take well to fingerprints on the >collecting surface. (I'm thinking of some form of plastic wrap or >lamination is needed) I have two that are already laminated with what appears to be the same stuff you can laminate photos with. . . I think they came from _Electronics Goldmine_, but don't recall the price. Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650B.00763EB9; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:31:33 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA07890 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 14:19:38 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA15669 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 15:56:27 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x7oNU-0006i7-00; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:56:16 -0400 Received: from ts73-08.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts73-08.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.146.199]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id QAA02499; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:56:35 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709072056.QAA02499@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:30:33 -0400 To: garrett myrick From: Richard Weait Subject: Free energy >8-0 (was: Some ideas..) Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Free energy >8-0 (was: Some ideas..) PostedDate: 09/07/97 01:30:33 PM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 02:35:20 PM-09/07/97 02:35:22 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 02:35:22 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:11 PM 9/6/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >On Sat, 6 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: >> In each case, there will be losses just from the >> conversion process, (heat, leakage, switching >> transients, etc.) and if you can get a total >> conversion efficiency of 85 percent you are doing >> very well indeed! > >Actually, the Mobile Robots book _says_ that DC-DC converters have an >about 80% effeciency. I believe that your quote from _Mobile Robots_ supports my statement. A quick look through the current DigiKey catalog (973C) pg.426 shows a series of "Power One SPL series switching power supplies" with "Efficiency 70% +/- 5%. Page 428 shows DC-DC converters with efficiency from 70% to 86%. This is not an exhaustive search by any means. Custom design can probably improve overall efficiency at the expense of other parameters, such as line or load regulation, input range, etc. This appears to be the case with the "Power One" units, judging by the specifications. >> You can calculate your total conversion efficiency >> by dividing power_out by power_in, but don't trick >> yourself by looking at instantaneous power or average >> power. Those are two of the popular mistakes made >> by the "Free Energy" whackos! > >Whackos?!?!-> >It seems to me that DC-DC converters are "over unity"(kinda), to us "free >energy whackos". If you accept the model of the infinite universe, >then free energy is definately possible. > >Garrett > Ummmm, "'over unity' (kinda)" ? Now you have me curious. By what definition would you define a DC-DC converter of 80 percent efficiency, "over unity", or even "kinda over unity." Mind you, I won't accept definitions like; "Steal a truck full of _Duracells_" as a definition of free energy. :-) Cheers, Richard $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.000276F6; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:26:55 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA08000 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:14:49 -0700 Received: from mail-gw2.pacbell.net (mail-gw2.pacbell.net [206.13.28.53]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA17351 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:47:28 -0500 Received: from deepone (ppp-207-214-188-179.anhm01.pacbell.net [207.214.188.179]) by mail-gw2.pacbell.net (8.8.7/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id QAA25766 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 16:47:08 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <34133CCC.301C@geocities.com> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 16:46:35 -0700 From: Michael Scanlon Reply-To: mscan@geocities.com Organization: UCSB X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-PBWG (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Radiation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mscan@geocities.com From: mscan@geocities.com Subject: Radiation PostedDate: 09/07/97 04:46:35 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: mscan@geocities.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 05:27:02 PM-09/07/97 05:27:03 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 05:27:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Not to long ago I heard how Smoke Detectors in the home work. They use a small amount of a radioactive substance (Americanium I think) to send a small beam of radiation to a detector that sets up a current. Everytime that beam is broken (ie. smoke partical or steam) the alarm part of the Smoke Detector goes off. I was wondering if this current generated by the radioactive substance might make a good power source for low power electronics, like BEAM robotics? Any ideas and please point out if I have something wrong here. Michael Scanlon -- http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/7846/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00061C2F; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:06:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA08033 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 17:54:47 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA17883 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:39:43 -0500 Received: from ts67ip133.cadvision.com (ts67ip133.cadvision.com [207.228.75.133]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id SAA109130 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:39:13 -0600 Received: by ts67ip133.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBBBC.04359F00@ts67ip133.cadvision.com>; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:29:45 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBBBC.04359F00@ts67ip133.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'mscan@geocities.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Re: Radiation Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:29:39 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/07/97 05:29:39 PM SendTo: mscan@geocities.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 06:06:50 PM-09/07/97 06:06:51 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 06:06:51 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US First thing, I'm not a nuclear scientist but to my knowledge, this is how nuclear power works: There are three types of reactor : thermal, fast-breeder, and fusion(also known as thermo-nuclear). In a thermal reactor, uranium atoms split sending out neutrons. A moderator such as graphite surrounds the fuel rods and slows the neutrons down so that they have more chance of hitting other uranium atoms and releasing more neutrons and heat energy. In a fast-breeder reactor, the core of fuel is surrounded by low-grade natural uranium. Some neutrons escaping from the core strike the uranium, changing some of it into another isotope of uranium called ?umm U-239. The isotope changes into plutonium that can be used as a reactor fuel the reactor "breeds" more plutonium than it needs as fuel, hence the pretty name. Fusion reactors instead of splitting heavy atoms, they force very light atoms together in all reactors, the heat produced is used to make steam and drive generators that make electricity. As you see, making a beam robot which used nuclear power is VERY expensive (think locally not globaly, we can't afford to buy a few grams for One robot) ,mark t has some in his area, maybe he could be so nice as to send you an envelope of sand from the desert(or is it dessert?) Yes smoke detectors DO contain some americium here's an *Short* article: Smoke Detectors and Americium Nuclear Issues Briefing Paper 35 April 1997 .Most smoke detectors contain an artificially produced radioisotope: americium-241. .Americium-241 is made in nuclear reactors, and is a decay product of plutonium-241. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Smoke detectors are important safety devices, because of their obvious potential to save lives and property. There are two types of smoke detector commonly available. One type uses the radiation from a small amount of radioactive material to detect the presence of smoke or heat sources. These "ion chamber smoke detectors" are the most popular, because they are inexpensive and are sensitive to a wider range of fire conditions than the other type. The other type of detector does not contain radioactive material; it uses a photoelectric sensor to detect the change in light level caused by smoke. This type is more expensive to purchase and install, and is less effective. Americium The vital ingredient of household smoke detectors is a very small quantity of americium-241 (Am-241). This element was discovered 50 years ago during the Manhattan Project in USA. The first sample of americium was produced by bombarding plutonium with neutrons in a nuclear reactor at the University of Chicago. The chemical element americium has atomic number 95 and an atomic weight of 243. Americium is a silvery metal, which tarnishes slowly in air and is soluble in acid. Its most stable isotope, Am-243, has a half-life of over 7500 years, although Am-241, with a half-life of 432 years, was the first isotope to be isolated. Americium oxide, AmO2, was first offered for sale by the US Atomic Energy Commission in 1962 and the price of US$ 1500 per gram has remained virtually unchanged to the present day. One gram of americium oxide provides enough active material for more than 5000 household smoke detectors. Americium (in combination with beryllium) is also used as a neutron source in non-destructive testing of machinery and equipment, and as a thickness gauge in the glass industry. However, its most common application is as an ionisation source in smoke detectors, and most of the several kilograms of americium made each year is used in this way. Operation of Smoke Detectors Americium-241 emits alpha particles and low energy gamma rays. The alpha particles are absorbed within the detector, while most of the gamma rays escape harmlessly. The americium is present in oxide form in the detector. The alpha particles emitted by the Am-241 collide with the oxygen and nitrogen in the air in the detector's ionisation chamber to produce charged particles called ions. A low-level electric voltage applied across the chamber is used to collect these ions, causing a steady small electric current to flow between two electrodes. When smoke enters the space between the electrodes, the alpha radiation is absorbed by smoke particles. This causes the rate of ionisation of the air and therefore the electric current to fall, which sets off an alarm. The alpha particles from the smoke detector do not themselves pose a health hazard, as they are absorbed in a few centimetres of air or by the structure of the detector. Americium-241 is however a potentially dangerous isotope if it is taken into the body in soluble form. It decays by both alpha activity and gamma emissions and it would concentrate in the skeleton . However, swallowing the radioactive material from a smoke detector would not lead to significant internal absorption of Am-241, since the dioxide is insoluble. It will pass through the digestive tract, without delivering a significant radiation dose. The radiation dose to the occupants of a house from a domestic smoke detector is essentially zero, and in any case very much less than that from natural background radiation. The small amount of radioactive material that is used in these detectors is not a health hazard. On the other hand, the ability of domestic smoke detectors to save life and property has been demonstrated in many house fires. Formation of Americium Plutonium-241, which is about 12% of the one percent content of plutonium in typical spent fuel from a power reactor, has a half life of only 14 years, decaying to Am-241 through emission of beta particles. Am-241 has a half life of 432 years, emitting alpha particles (see above) to become neptunium-237. The plutonium 241 is formed in any nuclear reactor by neutron capture ultimately from uranium (actually U-238), such as supplied by Australia on the world market for electricity generation. The detailed steps are: U-238 + neutron => U-239, U-239 by beta decay => Np-239, Np-239 by beta decay =>Pu-239, Pu-239 + neutron => Pu-240, Pu-240 + neutron => Pu-241. This will decay (emitting a beta particle) both in the reactor and subsequently. It is of interest (and some significance in recycling spent fuel) that if too much Am-241 builds up in plutonium separated from spent fuel, it cannot readily be used for mixed oxide (MOX) fuel because it is too radioactive for handling in the normal MOX plant. For instance, British Nuclear Fuels at Sellafield, UK, can handle plutonium with up to 3% Am-241, hence up to 6 years old (any more would need special shielding). Smoke Detector Requirements The Australian Standard AS3786 Self-contained Smoke Alarms requires domestic smoke detectors to be labelled: .the words "Warning - radioactive material"; .the trefoil symbol; .the identity and amount of radioactive material in the source; and .the words "Return to supplier or Department of Health for disposal". AS3786 also sets down various requirements for the radiation source itself. The Commonwealth Government's Scientific Services Laboratory tests the ability of smoke detectors to detect smoke, according to AS3786. The Australian Radiation Laboratory recently conducted tests on the radiation sources used in 25 kinds of smoke detectors that are available in Australia. These tests showed that most of the detectors were properly labelled and that each detector used less than 37 kilobecquerel of Am-241 (a minute amount), as required by AS3786. *phew* 80wpm skills really come in handy Devin ------------------------------------------------------------------------ -----Original Message----- From: Michael Scanlon [SMTP:mscan@geocities.com] Sent: Sunday, September 07, 1997 5:47 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Radiation Not to long ago I heard how Smoke Detectors in the home work. They use a small amount of a radioactive substance (Americanium I think) to send a small beam of radiation to a detector that sets up a current. Everytime that beam is broken (ie. smoke partical or steam) the alarm part of the Smoke Detector goes off. I was wondering if this current generated by the radioactive substance might make a good power source for low power electronics, like BEAM robotics? Any ideas and please point out if I have something wrong here. Michael Scanlon -- http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/7846/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.000A0653; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:49:29 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA08090 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 18:37:34 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA19543 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:15:57 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts78ip183.cadvision.com [207.228.113.183]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id TAA50476; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:15:15 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970907191250.00a8dd50@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 19:12:50 -0600 To: RobMaier@aol.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: flex solar panel Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <970907192451_-1836553690@emout13.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: flex solar panel PostedDate: 09/07/97 06:12:50 PM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 06:49:41 PM-09/07/97 06:49:42 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 06:49:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:27 PM 9/7/1997 -0400, RobMaier@aol.com wrote: >I see most people stick to 2200uf and sometimes 4700uf, but what about the >voltage rating? I know the Solarbotics caps are 5V. Most of the ones I find >are 10V or higher. Is too high bad? I would think I need the best charge to >weight ratio I can get right? and what is a good internal resistance? Actually, a 4700uF is about baseline for decent performance, even though you can make use of as low as 470uF if you design is efficient. Lower voltage caps are generally smaller (and lighter) than their higher voltage counterparts. No problem using the higher voltage types, but I seem to recall being told that the more you "utilize" a capacitor, the longer it lasts. ie: in a 12V application, try to use a 16V cap, rather than a 100V cap. Of course this doesn't cover the topic of voltage spikes and the like. Yes, Charge to weight ratio is pretty important for mobile critters. That's where the 0.33F 2.5V caps are beautiful units - about the size and shape of a 1" length of pencil. As for internal resistance, lower is better. Anything under 100 ohms ESR seems to be acceptable. Later, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00117C7D; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:10:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA08167 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:59:05 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA22683 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:36:08 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA07018; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:39:07 -0700 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:28:50 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Michael Scanlon cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Radiation In-Reply-To: <34133CCC.301C@geocities.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/07/97 07:28:50 PM SendTo: mscan@geocities.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 08:11:09 PM-09/07/97 08:11:10 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 08:11:10 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Michael Scanlon wrote: > Not to long ago I heard how Smoke Detectors in the home work. They use > a small amount of a radioactive substance (Americanium I think) to send > a small beam of radiation to a detector that sets up a current. > Everytime that beam is broken (ie. smoke partical or steam) the alarm > part of the Smoke Detector goes off. I was wondering if this current > generated by the radioactive substance might make a good power source > for low power electronics, like BEAM robotics? Any ideas and please > point out if I have something wrong here. > > Michael Scanlon > -- > http://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Lakes/7846/ > The radiation is an alpha-ray source(two neutrons and two electrons). Not too bad, it can be blocked by a thick peice of paper. But the less radiation exposure the better. I doubt you could power squat with it though. Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.001204A8; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:16:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA08176 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:04:59 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA22508 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 21:26:25 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA06647; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:28:38 -0700 Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:18:20 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Richard Weait cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Free energy >8-0 (was: Some ideas..) In-Reply-To: <199709072056.QAA02499@inforamp.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: Free energy >8-0 (was: Some ideas..) PostedDate: 09/07/97 07:18:20 PM SendTo: crs0274@inforamp.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 08:16:56 PM-09/07/97 08:16:57 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 08:16:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: > At 05:11 PM 9/6/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: > >On Sat, 6 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: > >> In each case, there will be losses just from the > >> conversion process, (heat, leakage, switching > >> transients, etc.) and if you can get a total > >> conversion efficiency of 85 percent you are doing > >> very well indeed! > > > >Actually, the Mobile Robots book _says_ that DC-DC converters have an > >about 80% effeciency. > > I believe that your quote from _Mobile Robots_ > supports my statement. A quick look through the > current DigiKey catalog (973C) pg.426 shows a > series of "Power One SPL series switching power > supplies" with "Efficiency 70% +/- 5%. Page 428 > shows DC-DC converters with efficiency from 70% > to 86%. This is not an exhaustive search by any > means. > Custom design can probably improve overall > efficiency at the expense of other parameters, > such as line or load regulation, input range, etc. > This appears to be the case with the "Power One" > units, judging by the specifications. > > >> You can calculate your total conversion efficiency > >> by dividing power_out by power_in, but don't trick > >> yourself by looking at instantaneous power or average > >> power. Those are two of the popular mistakes made > >> by the "Free Energy" whackos! > > > >Whackos?!?!-> > >It seems to me that DC-DC converters are "over unity"(kinda), to us "free > >energy whackos". If you accept the model of the infinite universe, > >then free energy is definately possible. > > > >Garrett > > > Ummmm, "'over unity' (kinda)" ? Now you have me > curious. By what definition would you define a > DC-DC converter of 80 percent efficiency, "over > unity", or even "kinda over unity." Mind you, I > won't accept definitions like; "Steal a truck full > of _Duracells_" as a definition of free energy. :-) > > Cheers, > > Richard > Last definition of "Over Unity Device" is something that outputs more energy than is given to it. I don't know if a transformer is considered an over unity device, because of power loss.(I don't know if there has to be zero power loss to be "over unity"). Also, what I meant about free energy and an infinate universe was that *IF* space was filled with some sort of virtual electron, then all you half to do is find a way to convert the virtual electron into a "real" electron, that you could use. And if the un iverse is infinite, then you would never run out of virtual electrons. I really have no idea what space is, and I really don't think that space is infinite. So don't go trying to make real electrons from virtual electrons and then when it doesn't work, don't say I didn't warn you! Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00127D91; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:21:57 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA08182 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:09:46 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA23982 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:05:14 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x7u7t-0000KL-00; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:04:33 -0400 Received: from ts73-08.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts2-16.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.151.223]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id XAA05162; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 23:04:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709080304.XAA05162@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 22:38:55 -0400 To: garrett myrick From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: Free energy >8-0 Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: Free energy >8-0 PostedDate: 09/07/97 07:38:55 PM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/07/97 08:22:02 PM-09/07/97 08:22:03 PM DeliveredDate: 09/07/97 08:22:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:18 PM 9/7/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >On Sun, 7 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: [snip] >> Ummmm, "'over unity' (kinda)" ? Now you have me >> curious. By what definition would you define a >> DC-DC converter of 80 percent efficiency, "over >> unity", or even "kinda over unity." Mind you, I >> won't accept definitions like; "Steal a truck full >> of _Duracells_" as a definition of free energy. :-) >> >> Cheers, >> >> Richard >> > >Last definition of "Over Unity Device" is something that outputs more >energy than is given to it. I don't know if a transformer is considered an Nope. A transformer is not an "over unity device." You can wire a transformer as a step-up (output voltage is higher than input voltage) or a step-down (output voltage is lower than input voltage) as two general cases. Don't forget, though, that if the transformer voltage is stepped-up the current is stepped-down! Power_in > Power_out. Every time. Can't change it. You can _feel_ some of the power loss from many trans- formers as heat. >over unity device, because of power loss.(I don't know if there has to be >zero power loss to be "over unity"). Also, what I meant about free energy >and an infinate universe was that *IF* space was filled with some sort of >virtual electron, then all you half to do is find a way to convert the >virtual electron into a "real" electron, that you could use. And if the >universe is infinite, then you would never run out of virtual electrons. >I really have no idea what space is, and I really don't think that space >is infinite. So don't go trying to make real electrons from virtual >electrons and then when it doesn't work, don't say I didn't warn you! > >Garrett > Well, you've really lost me on the "Virtual Electron" stuff. However, should you manage to bring a couple of them to the next BEAM meeting, and demonstrate your method of "convert[ing] the virtual electron into a "real" electron, that you could use" I'll bet that we find that the conversion process uses more power than it liberates. TANSTAAFL - There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.002F946A; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 01:39:41 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA08420 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 01:27:51 -0700 Received: from UPIMSRGSMTP03 (upimsrgsmtp03.msn.com [207.68.152.47]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA24546 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:34:33 -0500 Received: from upmajb09 - 204.95.110.82 by msn.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 19:34:04 -0800 Date: Mon, 8 Sep 97 03:34:23 UT From: "Paul Beckingham" Message-Id: To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Vehicles SMTPOriginator: BECKINGHAM@classic.msn.com From: BECKINGHAM@classic.msn.com Subject: Vehicles PostedDate: 09/07/97 08:34:23 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 01:39:51 AM-09/08/97 01:39:51 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 01:39:51 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I recently received the Valentino Braitenberg book "Vehicles - Experiments in Synthetic Psychology", and I thoroughly recommend it to those who have not yet read it. Go read it! I would consider this text a prerequisite to the "Living Machines" paper. I am looking at my machines a little differently now. Paul. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.0033D7EF; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:26:16 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA08442 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 02:14:08 -0700 Received: from mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (grunt.ksu.ksu.edu [129.130.12.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA24704 for ; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:42:27 -0500 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu [129.130.99.129]) by mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5/mailhub+tar@ksu.edu) with SMTP id WAA16179; Sun, 7 Sep 1997 22:42:01 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <34137500.7F19@ksu.edu> Date: Sun, 07 Sep 1997 22:46:08 -0500 From: Dean Hall Reply-To: dwhall@ksu.edu Organization: EGM Design X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: mscan@geocities.com CC: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Radiation References: <34133CCC.301C@geocities.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dwhall@ksu.edu From: dwhall@ksu.edu Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/07/97 08:46:08 PM SendTo: mscan@geocities.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: dwhall@ksu.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 02:26:27 AM-09/08/97 02:26:28 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 02:26:28 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Michael Scanlon wrote: > > Not to long ago I heard how Smoke Detectors in the home work. They use > a small amount of a radioactive substance (Americanium I think) to send > a small beam of radiation to a detector that sets up a current. My guess (and I'll support it below) is that the detector does not convert the radiation to current of any useful amperage. But rather works like a phototransistor (striking the surface with radiation turns off the transistor, so that when smoke blocks the radiation, the transistor starts conducting). The support is this: if the radiation was converted to any appreciable current, then the whole detector wouldn't need that 9v battery. And it is indeed the current from the 9v battery that sounds the buzzer. Conclusion: I don't think it'd make for a good power source, but it'd make for a helluva pollutant-detecting sensor (with moderate modifications)! !!Dean $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.003E9C45; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:23:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA08488 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:11:40 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA02018 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 05:32:17 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA22809 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:32:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709081032.GAA22809@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp25.buffnet.net(205.246.19.132) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma009478; Mon, 8 Sep 97 06:31:26 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Radiation Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:29:41 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Radiation PostedDate: 09/08/97 04:29:41 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 04:23:58 AM-09/08/97 04:23:59 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 04:23:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I don't think alpha-ray source is usefull. BUT you are on the rigth track, plutonium would be nice to work with. Have you ever heard of nuclear Batteries? They have been around for a long time. Basicly it is a chunk of super hot radioactive material at the center of a thermoelectric junction. (you know, combine two metals heat one cool the other and ta-da you got power) You could build a solar type one at home if you wanted too. They aren't all that hard. DEnnison Oh yeh, Thanks to Xx1101xX, yeh I know the free energy engin isn't really feasable. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.003F05F4; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:28:22 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA08497 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 04:16:26 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA02021 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 05:32:59 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id GAA22813 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:33:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709081033.GAA22813@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp25.buffnet.net(205.246.19.132) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma009531; Mon, 8 Sep 97 06:32:18 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Mobile Electronics Peizo Engin Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:30:33 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Mobile Electronics Peizo Engin PostedDate: 09/08/97 04:30:33 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 04:28:34 AM-09/08/97 04:28:35 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 04:28:35 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey since everybbody is quoting that Mobile robots book, did any of you happen to take notice of the ceramic peizo engin smaller than a dime? That would be cool DEnnison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.0049322B; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:19:29 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA08600 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 06:07:34 -0700 Received: from mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (grunt.ksu.ksu.edu [129.130.12.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA02676 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:13:42 -0500 Received: from humec.ksu.edu (humec.ksu.edu [129.130.248.235]) by mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5/mailhub+tar@ksu.edu) with ESMTP id HAA00424 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:13:10 -0500 (CDT) Received: from HUMEC/MAILQUE by humec.ksu.edu (Mercury 1.21); 8 Sep 97 07:13:10 cdt6cst Received: from MAILQUE by HUMEC (Mercury 1.21); 8 Sep 97 07:13:09 cdt6cst From: "Lloyd Verhage" Organization: College of Human Ecology, KSU To: beam@webconn.com Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 07:13:03 CST6CDT Subject: Re: Radiation Reply-to: verhage@humec.ksu.edu Priority: normal References: <34133CCC.301C@geocities.com> In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.52) Message-ID: <433151E0DDB@humec.ksu.edu> SMTPOriginator: verhage@humec.ksu.edu From: verhage@humec.ksu.edu Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/08/97 06:13:03 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: verhage@humec.ksu.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 06:19:37 AM-09/08/97 06:19:38 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 06:19:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > > Not to long ago I heard how Smoke Detectors in the home work. They use > > a small amount of a radioactive substance (Americanium I think) to send > > a small beam of radiation to a detector that sets up a current. Smoke ionizies the air in the detector. The additional ionization lets a small current flow, setting off the detector. > The radiation is an alpha-ray source(two neutrons and two electrons). Alphas are helium nuclei, two neutrons and two _protons_. Lloyd $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.005E1006; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:07:24 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA09585 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 09:55:35 -0700 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04394 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:05:19 -0500 Received: from esh-mail.lanl.gov (esh-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.3.82]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA00347 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:05:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [128.165.29.34] ([128.165.29.34]) by esh-mail.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA20320 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:05:10 -0600 (MDT) X-Sender: u096767@esh-mail.lanl.gov Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199709081032.GAA22809@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:05:54 -0600 To: beam@webconn.com From: "John A. de Vries II" Subject: Re: Radiation SMTPOriginator: zozzles@lanl.gov From: zozzles@lanl.gov Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/08/97 09:05:54 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 10:07:29 AM-09/08/97 10:07:31 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 10:07:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Why heck, up here we've got LOTS of spare radiation. Seeing as how Tilden works in one of the old Physics buildings here, I'm pretty certain that I've seen a faint glow emanating from him when he leaves the place at night... btw: along with plutonium, uranium and other wonderful materials, we just happen to test people for how much americium they've ingested whilst at work. It is not a good thing to consume. also: there is at least one satellite out there that works on the radioactive source-thermocouple design the Lab has produced. On the other hand, you may remember the flap about the Russian satellite that re-entered with a fair amount nastiness in it that everyone was afraid was going to hit their turf? I don't think that was a full-up reactor but was also the thermocouple-style thing. I understand that they do indeed run moderately warm (to the touch.) Zoz $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.005EBF2B; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:14:53 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA09648 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:02:57 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04319 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:00:36 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts78ip161.cadvision.com [207.228.113.161]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id KAA33760; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:00:07 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970908095754.00a88e80@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 09:57:54 -0600 To: Dennlill , BEAM From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Mobile Electronics Peizo Engin In-Reply-To: <199709081033.GAA22813@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Mobile Electronics Peizo Engin PostedDate: 09/08/97 08:57:54 AM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 10:14:58 AM-09/08/97 10:14:59 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 10:14:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 06:30 PM 9/8/1997 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >Hey since everybbody is quoting that Mobile robots book, did any of you >happen to take notice of the ceramic peizo engin smaller than a dime? Yup. Unfortunately, motors of this size usually have controllers 100X the size of the motor itself (ie: see the smoovy?). -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.005EC3BA; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:15:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA09652 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 10:03:12 -0700 Received: from fh101.infi.net (fh101.infi.net [208.131.160.100]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04638 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 11:42:36 -0500 Received: from dcp1-59.nc5.infi.net (dcp1-59.nc5.infi.net [207.2.241.59]) by fh101.infi.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA16104 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 12:42:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.1.16.19970908114521.450f04a6@nc5.infi.net> X-Sender: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (16) Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 11:45:21 To: beam@webconn.com From: Terry Newton Subject: Re: Some ideas.. (free energy) In-Reply-To: References: <199709062048.QAA09145@inforamp.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net From: wtnewton@nc5.infi.net Subject: Re: Some ideas.. (free energy) PostedDate: 09/08/97 04:45:21 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 10:15:09 AM-09/08/97 10:15:09 AM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 10:15:09 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 05:11 PM 9/6/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >On Sat, 6 Sep 1997, Richard Weait wrote: >> You can calculate your total conversion efficiency >> by dividing power_out by power_in, but don't trick >> yourself by looking at instantaneous power or average >> power. Those are two of the popular mistakes made >> by the "Free Energy" whackos! > >Whackos?!?!-> >It seems to me that DC-DC converters are "over unity"(kinda), to us "free >energy whackos". If you accept the model of the infinite universe, >then free energy is definately possible. I know of *no* physical process that is really "over-unity", what I have seen is a bunch of experimenters getting all excited because they *think* they are getting more power out than going in, but only as measured by a common non-rms power meter. Waveform distortion can make it *appear* to be over-unity but that's because most AC meters are only accurate for sine waves. Another effect that fools the free-energy crowd is the effect of a capacitor in series with an inductor... the sum of voltages across the components will exceed the input voltage (sometimes greatly:) but no energy gain has occured. Higher voltage always means less current. Also, there's the effect of the current and voltage not being in phase, aka power factor, almost always present in AC L/C circuits. Measuring V and A separately is *not* accurate, a true-rms power meter must be used. I'm not saying that "free energy" is definitely impossible - according to most theories the vaccuum itself holds a considerable amount of energy but the trouble is extracting it without violating those pesky physical laws of nature, foremost being energy out is always = energy in (unless mass conversion took place, which only happens in high energy particle physics and nukes afaik). The "energy" *must* appear in physical form to be usable, theoretical energy won't power anything. (but hey, it's free:) - Terry $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00703131; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:25:26 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA10663 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:13:36 -0700 Received: from punt-1.mail.demon.net (punt-1b.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.135]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA07050 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:19:37 -0500 Received: from fuzzgun.demon.co.uk ([194.222.137.155]) by punt-1.mail.demon.net id aa0926098; 8 Sep 97 19:54 BST Message-ID: <3ahrBAAmJwE0Ewu1@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk> Date: Sun, 7 Sep 1997 20:37:10 +0100 To: Beam@webconn.com From: Bob Mottram Subject: Re: In the distance...GEAR BOX OAISIS! In-Reply-To: <199709011243.IAA13803@buffnet4.buffnet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Trial Version 3.03a SMTPOriginator: Bob@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk From: Bob@fuzzgun.demon.co.uk Subject: Re: In the distance...GEAR BOX OAISIS! PostedDate: 09/07/97 12:37:10 PM SendTo: Beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 01:25:30 PM-09/08/97 01:25:31 PM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 01:25:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In article <199709011243.IAA13803@buffnet4.buffnet.net>, Dennlill writes >My quest has come to an end. I have found the eternal fountain of gearbox's >easy to hack, easy to use and easy to obtain. > >Anyone know the littl wind up toys? Like the two shoes that *walk* when >wound. Or a wind up MCdonalds toy? Belive it or not but the gearbox inside >is actually good. Some even have metal casing! I don't have any pictures I've used these for quite some time, but have found such toys in short supply. At car-boot sales you can pick these up very cheaply, but I've found that only about one in ten such toys contains the neccessary gearing which makes it easy to attach to a pager motor. Also, the vast majority of these gears are plastic, so the casings tend to deteriorate in prolonged sunlight. The bonus is that the gearing for these toys seems very standardised, so you can find exactly the same mechanism within many different types of toy. -- Bob Mottram "Complexity is limited by the fidelity of replication" www.fuzzgun.demon.co.uk $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00706B1A; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:27:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA10689 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 13:16:00 -0700 Received: from aries.EE.McGill.CA (Aries.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.75.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA06985 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:14:05 -0500 Received: from xenon.EE.McGill.CA (root@Xenon.EE.McGill.CA [132.206.31.100]) by aries.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with ESMTP id PAA09359 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:15:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (chiarth@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by xenon.EE.McGill.CA (8.8.5/8.6.6) with SMTP id PAA24690 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:15:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:15:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Arthur Ching X-Sender: chiarth@xenon To: beam Subject: Process state questions. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca From: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca Subject: Process state questions. PostedDate: 09/08/97 12:15:44 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 01:28:03 PM-09/08/97 01:29:27 PM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 01:29:27 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I just read about microcore process states on Andrew Miller's webpage. Can anyone tell me what a second or a third process is used for? What is the ideal number processes for a system requiring feedback? And finally, is it possible, or even necessary, to add a process? Please be as detailed as possible! I know these almost sound like exam questions, but with the amount of documentation available on the microcore, I need as much information as I can get! Thanks in advance. Arthur. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.007801EC; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:50:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA11257 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 14:38:56 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA07520 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 15:19:16 -0500 Received: from darwin (dialup28.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.247]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id QAA17690; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:36:28 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970908161714.0097d100@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Mon, 08 Sep 1997 16:17:14 -0400 To: Arthur Ching , beam From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: Re: Process state questions. In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: Re: Process state questions. PostedDate: 09/08/97 01:17:14 PM SendTo: chiarth@ee.mcgill.ca,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 02:50:54 PM-09/08/97 02:50:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 02:50:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Arthur, Questions/Answers are below.... The best place to start looking for information on nervous networks and the microcore is Tilden's patent, which can be found off the BEAM robotics FAQ at: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html Also check out the BEAM Tek page, it has alot of information concerning advanced topics in nervous networks and esp. the microcore. http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/technical.html Once you have read enough to start, dive right in and breadboard a microcore (go through the steps elaborated on Miller's pages), and you will discover alot of details that only experience can give. Good luck! Cheers, Brian PS: questions/answers follow... At 03:15 PM 9/8/97 -0400, Arthur Ching wrote: >I just read about microcore process states on Andrew Miller's webpage. >Can anyone tell me what a second or a third process is used for? i have never used a second or third processes (third process not sustainable in a microcore - 4 Nvs -> n/2 processes maximum) in a microcore, but i have for larger nervous networks, such as 12 nv loops that I have done in experiments with memory. >What is >the ideal number processes for a system requiring feedback? One. Why? Well, it also depends on your walker configuration. If you have the standard two motor-four legged walker one process is all you need. any more and you have a bot on caffeine and your gears-a-strippin... a microcore gets adequate feedback with just one process, what really determines the feedback to the microcore gets is _the motor drivers_, like the 74x245 (HC, HCT and C all limit/cancel/block feedback, but to varying degrees--ALS is the best-but a hog on power, but HC is the best for solar, weigh your options, try different ones). your mileage may vary. check out the patent for more info on nervous networks though.... and check the Tek pages for details on chip specs/power details. >And finally, >is it possible, or even necessary, to add a process? Yes, see miller's pages.... briefly, Vcc to the input of any inverter for a sec and wham.... a process. --- brian o bush, gearhead "follow the black valley trail of death, into the beautiful sunshine." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650C.00815ADE; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:32:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA12006 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 16:21:02 -0700 From: RobMaier@aol.com Received: from emout12.mail.aol.com (emout12.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.38]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA08602 for ; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 17:33:52 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout12.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id SAA18967 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:33:46 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 8 Sep 1997 18:33:46 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970908183056_1189154520@emout12.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Radiation SMTPOriginator: RobMaier@aol.com From: RobMaier@aol.com Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/08/97 03:33:46 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/08/97 04:32:57 PM-09/08/97 04:32:58 PM DeliveredDate: 09/08/97 04:32:58 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US In a message dated 97-09-08 06:56:07 EDT, you write: << Basicly it is a chunk of super hot radioactive material at the center of a thermoelectric junction. >> I have an idea that a thermocouple (stacked thermocouples are a thermopile) is very inefficient (waste as heat) and Plutonium is a very heavy element, Don't forget the lead shielding needed to keep your DNA in its original form. I had heard about a pacemaker battery that used Plutonium or something, it was supposed to have a life of 20 years. ~~Rob $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650D.004E5690; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:15:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA13571 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:03:44 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA13625 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 08:56:44 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA23168 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:56:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709091356.JAA23168@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp69.buffnet.net(205.246.19.176) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma008785; Tue, 9 Sep 97 09:55:49 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: PLant powered solar engin. Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:54:07 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: PLant powered solar engin. PostedDate: 09/09/97 07:54:07 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 07:15:45 AM-09/09/97 07:15:45 AM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 07:15:45 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey I was looking at one of the famous SPUD clocks You know where the potatos are used as batteries? Wouldn't it be kinda neet, (maybe unethical) if you could load a lving plant with electrodes and extract power from it? True it would't be alot but using the solar engin concept couldn't it be adapted? The problem is that the electrodes would eventualy corode so it would not last forever. Sigh. DEnnison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650D.004E7584; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:16:58 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA13583 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 07:05:08 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA13653 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 09:00:19 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA23259 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 10:00:39 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709091400.KAA23259@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp69.buffnet.net(205.246.19.176) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma009414; Tue, 9 Sep 97 09:59:37 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Thermoelectric engine. Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:57:55 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Thermoelectric engine. PostedDate: 09/09/97 07:57:55 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 07:17:06 AM-09/09/97 07:17:07 AM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 07:17:07 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US A thermo-electric engin useing thermo junctions is a good idea, but not very adaptable. Solar Cells can be used anywhere there is sun. But a thermojunction which requires both hot and cold would not work everywhere. In normal east coast enviroment it would be ok. The heat would be generated by the sun falling on a black something. And the cool by white something. Neat idea but if you consider if you have a solar powered thermojunction, a desert situation would be difficult because the diffrences between the temperatures of the metal would be very slight. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650D.006EFFAC; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:12:24 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA15462 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:00:27 -0700 From: mccullou@curie.montclair.edu Received: from pegasus.montclair.edu (pegasus.montclair.edu [130.68.20.55]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA15672 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 14:38:50 -0500 Received: from curie.montclair.edu (curie.montclair.edu [130.68.20.62]) by pegasus.montclair.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA05191 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:38:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost by curie.montclair.edu (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA18593; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:38:06 -0400 Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:38:05 -0400 (EDT) To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: PLant powered solar engin. In-Reply-To: <199709091356.JAA23168@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: mccullou@curie.montclair.edu From: mccullou@curie.montclair.edu Subject: Re: PLant powered solar engin. PostedDate: 09/09/97 12:38:05 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 01:12:28 PM-09/09/97 01:12:29 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 01:12:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Are you thinking of a robot with a plant on it's back, or some kind of vampire beambot that would look for plants in the wild to suck dry of energy? -Dave McCullough On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Dennlill wrote: > Hey I was looking at one of the famous SPUD clocks You know where the > potatos are used as batteries? Wouldn't it be kinda neet, (maybe unethical) > if you could load a lving plant with electrodes and extract power from it? > True it would't be alot but using the solar engin concept couldn't it be > adapted? The problem is that the electrodes would eventualy corode so it > would not last forever. Sigh. > > DEnnison > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650D.0072E20A; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:54:49 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA15631 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:42:52 -0700 Received: from mail.llu.edu (mail.llu.edu [151.112.2.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA16263 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:32:04 -0500 Received: from earthlink.net ([151.112.23.43]) by mail.llu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA25382 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 13:31:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3415B2B7.28031BB6@earthlink.net> Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 13:34:00 -0700 From: Scott Andress X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Plant powered solar engine... References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: srandress@earthlink.net From: srandress@earthlink.net Subject: Re: Plant powered solar engine... PostedDate: 09/09/97 01:34:00 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 01:54:50 PM-09/09/97 01:54:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 01:54:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US It would be interesting to know if exposure to light has a relationship with electrical current generation. If so, would it not be possible to create photovore by arranging two plants in a simular fashion to the solar cell array on some photovores? Mount small potted plants onto the solar engines instead of Suncerams! Now, how much electricity can you get out of a plant??? We're talking about the Borgification of poor defenseless house plants. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE... -Scott Andress srandress@earthlink.net > Are you thinking of a robot with a plant on it's back, or some kind of > vampire beambot that would look for plants in the wild to suck dry of > energy? > > -Dave McCullough > > On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Dennlill wrote: > > > Hey I was looking at one of the famous SPUD clocks You know where the > > potatos are used as batteries? Wouldn't it be kinda neet, (maybe unethical) > > if you could load a lving plant with electrodes and extract power from it? > > True it would't be alot but using the solar engin concept couldn't it be > > adapted? The problem is that the electrodes would eventualy corode so it > > would not last forever. Sigh. > > > > DEnnison > > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650D.007DCECF; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:54:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA16195 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 15:42:19 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA17113 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:31:00 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA04365 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:31:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709092231.SAA04365@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp43.buffnet.net(205.246.19.222) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma011848; Tue, 9 Sep 97 18:30:08 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: PLant Power. continued... Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 06:28:23 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: PLant Power. continued... PostedDate: 09/10/97 04:28:23 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 03:54:16 PM-09/09/97 03:54:17 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 03:54:17 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US The robot would most likely have to be attached to the plant. It would take much to long to "extract" energy from plants to use them as transient "snacks" You would need to mount them on board or put the robot on the plant. Now most of the electrical generation comes from the electrodes, not from the plant itself. The plant more or less acts in a simmilar manner as the salt wwater in a ssalt water battery. You would also need many electrodes, because although I don't know the specifics the voltage IS low. However you could rig up some sort "rechargeable" plant power source using the proper electrodes and possibly use the plant when its dark. It certainly is an interesting idea and even if it dosen't pan out it merits experimentation. DEnnison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.0001494C; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:14:03 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA16704 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:02:06 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA17610 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:53:55 -0500 Received: from ts77ip156.cadvision.com (ts77ip156.cadvision.com [207.228.113.156]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id RAA110940; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:53:26 -0600 Received: by ts77ip156.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBD47.CA49E7A0@ts77ip156.cadvision.com>; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:42:49 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBD47.CA49E7A0@ts77ip156.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Scott Andress'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Re: Plant powered solar engine... Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:42:46 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Re: Plant powered solar engine... PostedDate: 09/09/97 04:42:46 PM SendTo: srandress@earthlink.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 05:14:04 PM-09/09/97 05:14:05 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 05:14:05 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US First thing I would say is that "Yes plants DO take in energy from the sun", remember biology? The leafs absorb sunlight, convert it , blah blah blah. They plants convert the sunlight into umm , ohh boy I've forgotten, well if I remember correctly (which this time prolly isn't right) what they convert it into isn't electricity. A lemon tree might be used, but what the heck for? It's easyier to buy 50 solar cells, put them on your roof, attach them to the robot and let it do it's thing than sticking two wires into every lemon growing from the tree(also it would ruin the crop so you just would loose money) annualy. You know, you could make a robot that is powered by urine (salt water battery), but I think there are somethings which should be just left alone. Devin -----Original Message----- From: Scott Andress [SMTP:srandress@earthlink.net] Sent: Tuesday, September 09, 1997 2:34 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Plant powered solar engine... It would be interesting to know if exposure to light has a relationship with electrical current generation. If so, would it not be possible to create photovore by arranging two plants in a simular fashion to the solar cell array on some photovores? Mount small potted plants onto the solar engines instead of Suncerams! Now, how much electricity can you get out of a plant??? We're talking about the Borgification of poor defenseless house plants. RESISTANCE IS FUTILE... -Scott Andress srandress@earthlink.net > Are you thinking of a robot with a plant on it's back, or some kind of > vampire beambot that would look for plants in the wild to suck dry of > energy? > > -Dave McCullough > > On Tue, 9 Sep 1997, Dennlill wrote: > > > Hey I was looking at one of the famous SPUD clocks You know where the > > potatos are used as batteries? Wouldn't it be kinda neet, (maybe unethical) > > if you could load a lving plant with electrodes and extract power from it? > > True it would't be alot but using the solar engin concept couldn't it be > > adapted? The problem is that the electrodes would eventualy corode so it > > would not last forever. Sigh. > > > > DEnnison > > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.000665B6; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 18:09:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA17014 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:58:01 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA17954 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:47:46 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA05234; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:50:32 -0700 Date: Tue, 9 Sep 1997 17:40:30 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Dennlill cc: BEAM Subject: Re: PLant Power. continued... In-Reply-To: <199709092231.SAA04365@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: PLant Power. continued... PostedDate: 09/09/97 05:40:30 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 06:09:59 PM-09/09/97 06:09:59 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 06:10:00 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Wed, 10 Sep 1997, Dennlill wrote: > The robot would most likely have to be attached to the plant. It would take > much to long to "extract" energy from plants to use them as transient > "snacks" You would need to mount them on board or put the robot on the > plant. Now most of the electrical generation comes from the electrodes, not > from the plant itself. The plant more or less acts in a simmilar manner as > the salt wwater in a ssalt water battery. You would also need many > electrodes, because although I don't know the specifics the voltage IS low. > However you could rig up some sort "rechargeable" plant power source using > the proper electrodes and possibly use the plant when its dark. It > certainly is an interesting idea and even if it dosen't pan out it merits > experimentation. > > DEnnison > I think that with a lemon, you get about either 1.5 or 3 volts.. I'm not sure. But you're right: the plant acts as the electrolyte. So the more acid(I think), i.e citrus(I think), the better the voltage and current. Hold on a sec while I flip through the book.. It doesn't say what the voltage is or anything, so I'll have to look elsewhere.... But I like what Scott Andress said: RESISTANCE IS FUTILE... Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.000D89B5; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:27:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA17207 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 19:15:56 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18478 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 21:03:39 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts30ip93.cadvision.com [207.228.70.93]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA78678 for ; Tue, 9 Sep 1997 20:03:13 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970909200123.009fada0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 09 Sep 1997 20:01:23 -0600 To: beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Jack Kilby's quote... Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Jack Kilby's quote... PostedDate: 09/09/97 07:01:23 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/09/97 07:28:03 PM-09/09/97 07:28:04 PM DeliveredDate: 09/09/97 07:28:04 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Mr. Kilby was just honoured by Texas Instruments on his invention of the transistor. His one regret about what his development begat? "Annoying electronic greeting cards" Heh - does he know what we do with them? -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.0040F358; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:49:26 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA17783 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 04:37:28 -0700 Received: from smtp.tninet.se (mail.tninet.se [195.100.94.10]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA21230 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 06:28:37 -0500 Message-Id: <199709101128.GAA21230@gromit.webconn.com> Received: (qmail 1141 invoked by alias); 10 Sep 1997 11:28:25 -0000 Received: from du45-149.ppp.algonet.se (HELO the-q) (195.100.149.45) by mail.tninet.se with SMTP; 10 Sep 1997 11:28:25 -0000 From: "Adam Ericson" To: "Beam robotics" Cc: "Adam Ericson" Subject: Pulses Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:25:32 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: tpf606a@tninet.se From: tpf606a@tninet.se Subject: Pulses PostedDate: 09/13/97 04:25:32 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com CopyTo: tpf606a@tninet.se $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 04:49:38 AM-09/10/97 04:49:38 AM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 04:49:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi one and all. I have just completed my first microcore but I have a problem. When it starts up it is fully populated with pulses but in a few sec thy have all died out but one that goes on for a few sec before it dies out. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.00456575; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 05:37:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA17815 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 05:26:02 -0700 Received: from golden.net (golden.net [199.166.210.183]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA21631 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:22:35 -0500 Received: from marvin (cisco18-125.cas.golden.net [207.216.79.125]) by golden.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id IAA27133; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:22:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <34169236.13B4@golden.net> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:27:34 -0400 From: Andrew Miller Organization: AM innovations X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Adam Ericson CC: Beam robotics Subject: Re: Pulses References: <199709101128.GAA21230@gromit.webconn.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: amiller@golden.net From: amiller@golden.net Subject: Re: Pulses PostedDate: 09/10/97 05:27:34 AM SendTo: tpf606a@tninet.se CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 05:38:06 AM-09/10/97 05:38:07 AM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 05:38:07 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Adam Ericson wrote: > > Hi one and all. > > I have just completed my first microcore but I have a problem. > > When it starts up it is fully populated with pulses but in a few sec thy > have all died out but one that goes on for a few sec before it dies out. Sounds like a simple "Leak" to ground the MicroCore is sensitive to resistances in the MegOhms so as a result things such as solder flux can cause a slightly conductive path on your circuitry.... somwhere in the vicinity of your "stay on" neuron you have some flux or other crap gumming up the works.... Clean it real well.... Flux cleaner or Acetone for common solder.... But if you can, buy some solder with water souluble or "organic" flux... Kester #31 or Hydo-X by Multicore are the ones to look for... I'm certain once you clean the goop out the system will work fine for you... all4nw $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.004D558B; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:04:41 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA17933 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 06:52:44 -0700 From: IMIvar@aol.com Received: from emout22.mail.aol.com (emout22.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.127]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA22162 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 08:43:41 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout22.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id JAA14868 for beam@webconn.com; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:43:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:43:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970909225905_738492924@emout06.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Quick Questions. SMTPOriginator: IMIvar@aol.com From: IMIvar@aol.com Subject: Quick Questions. PostedDate: 09/10/97 06:43:21 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 07:04:51 AM-09/10/97 07:04:51 AM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 07:04:51 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey everyone! Just some quick questions from another BEAM novice... Will a PN2222 work in place of a 2N2222? What's the difference between them? Thanks! Ivar Thorson On another note: >You know, you could make a robot that is powered by urine (salt water battery), but >I think there are somethings which should be just left alone. >Devin Uh oh. Time for a new movie titled,"The Killer Replicating Sewer Bots Have Taken Over Cinnicinati!" ;-> $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.00522A34; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:57:27 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA18034 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:45:34 -0700 Received: from ns2.icon.net (mailhost.icon.net [209.54.6.22]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA22480 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:27:14 -0500 Received: from LARRYP (asnd156.icon.net [209.54.8.156]) by ns2.icon.net (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) with SMTP id JAA19788 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:24:50 -0500 Received: by LARRYP with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBDCB.86391570@LARRYP>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:25:48 -0500 Message-ID: <01BCBDCB.86391570@LARRYP> From: "Lawrence E. Powell Sr." To: "'Beam'" Subject: IC's Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 09:24:54 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: lepowell@icon.net From: lepowell@icon.net Subject: IC's PostedDate: 09/10/97 07:24:54 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 07:57:35 AM-09/10/97 07:57:36 AM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 07:57:36 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi This will be my second message to your group. I was hoping to fined out if any one in the group was used a BA6222 motor driver IC. It's power consumption is very low and provides control of the motor with two level states. both states low and the motor is in a free state. one low and the other high you get motion in one direction. reverse the states and the motor reverses direction. with both states high you plaice the motor in a breaking states. This with a timing wheal out of a cheap mouse and the electronics you can position the motor very accurately. I have found by placing a current sensing circuit after the driver circuit and allowing the motor to run it's full range you can calibrate the limits of you motor travel during power up. After this to position the motor is a simple mater of have you control circuit calculate what position you need the motor to assume and run. I'm not sure if I am addressing the right group with this information or not but would appreciate some feed back if possible. Thank you for your time and God Bless. PS: this IC can be found in most any VCR so have fun. Lawrence E. Powell Sr. lepowell@icon.net $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.0064D192; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:21:12 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA19217 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 11:09:20 -0700 Received: from ksbe.edu (ksbe.edu [204.63.136.4]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA23515 for <"beam"@webconn.com>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 12:41:12 -0500 Received: from ksbe.edu by ksbe.edu (AIX 4.1/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA12904; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:24:15 -1000 Message-Id: <3416DC18.F71@ksbe.edu> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 07:42:48 -1000 From: Edi Alvare Reply-To: edalvare@ksbe.edu Organization: KSBE X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02 (Macintosh; I; PPC) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: "BEAM 'BOTTERS" <"beam"@webconn.com (BEAM)> Subject: wall clock parts Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: edalvare@ksbe.edu From: edalvare@ksbe.edu Subject: wall clock parts PostedDate: 09/10/97 10:42:48 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: edalvare@ksbe.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 11:21:15 AM-09/10/97 11:21:17 AM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 11:21:17 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Aloha, I just received two wall clocks for 'bott parts. Has anyone used clock parts for any such purpose? I'll take them apart this weekend but it'll give me more incentive if I know that there are certain "goodies" I can get. If you have used/thought of using clock parts for building send a note as to what parts as should not throw out. Mahalo, Edi $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.007F16C0; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:08:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA20970 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 15:56:06 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA25181 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:09:42 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts55ip217.cadvision.com [207.228.73.217]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA105322 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:09:19 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970910160803.00a01b60@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:08:03 -0600 To: beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Turbot on CNN?` Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Turbot on CNN?` PostedDate: 09/10/97 03:08:03 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 04:08:15 PM-09/10/97 04:08:16 PM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 04:08:16 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I was flipping thru the channels today during lunch, and saw what appeared to be a *LARGE* turbot with wheels on the ends of the flagella. I caught only the last 3 seconds of the bit, but they were discussing Mars/space stuff live on CNN, and the only comment I heard was this "was able to cover more terrain than the present Mars rover". Cool. It was covered in those high-tech NASA-quality cells, but I have no idea what relative scale it was. Anybody else see it? -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650E.008078E9; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:23:15 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA21043 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 16:11:17 -0700 Received: from server1.coqui.net (server1.coqui.net [206.99.218.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA25376 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 17:36:12 -0500 Received: from mycomputer.coqui.net (sanjuan-208-135-3-45.coqui.net [208.135.3.45]) by server1.coqui.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA00431 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:40:51 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709102240.SAA00431@server1.coqui.net> Date: Wed, 03 Sep 1997 13:23:22 -0300 From: Jazmin <"jcorrea@coqui.net"@coqui.net> Reply-To: "jcorrea@coqui.net"@coqui.net Organization: Home for the INSANE and MENTALLY ILL X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Walker legs rotation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net From: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net Subject: Walker legs rotation PostedDate: 09/03/97 09:23:22 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 04:23:22 PM-09/10/97 04:23:23 PM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 04:23:23 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi to all, for some time I been trying to do a Beam Walker. After getting all the parts, the fun really started by putting it together. Just one problem; after one minute the leg slowly rotates and osclilates instead of only oscillating. I try different caps sizes with results of more rotation on no movement at all. How could i fix this problem? Is this normal? I would appreciated any help. Thanks $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.000AE6CD; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:59:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA21658 for ; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 18:47:12 -0700 Received: from shell.istar.ca (shell.iSTAR.ca [204.191.213.253]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA26638 for <"beam"@webconn.com>; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:14:10 -0500 Received: from inforamp.net [204.191.136.8] by shell.istar.ca with esmtp (Exim 1.651 #11) id 0x8xpL-00018M-00; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:13:47 -0400 Received: from ts72-05.tor.iSTAR.ca (ts72-05.tor.iSTAR.ca [204.191.146.212]) by inforamp.net (8.8.5/8.8.4) with SMTP id VAA21169; Wed, 10 Sep 1997 21:14:07 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709110114.VAA21169@inforamp.net> X-Sender: crs0274@inforamp.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 10 Sep 1997 20:47:30 -0400 To: edalvare@ksbe.edu, "BEAM 'BOTTERS" <"beam"@webconn.com (BEAM)> From: Richard Weait Subject: Re: wall clock parts SMTPOriginator: crs0274@inforamp.net From: crs0274@inforamp.net Subject: Re: wall clock parts PostedDate: 09/10/97 05:47:30 PM SendTo: edalvare@ksbe.edu,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/10/97 06:59:10 PM-09/10/97 06:59:11 PM DeliveredDate: 09/10/97 06:59:11 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:42 AM 9/10/97 -1000, Edi Alvare wrote: >Aloha, > >I just received two wall clocks for 'bott parts. [snip] > >Mahalo, >Edi > Hi Edi; The clock movements can be used. Check-out Steve Bolt's web page and his clock-photovore. Cheers, Richard. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.003BD208; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:53:23 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA22267 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:41:26 -0700 Received: from invfacty.factory.com (invfacty.factory.com [199.183.47.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA29400 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:27:18 -0500 Received: from murk.factory.com by invfacty.factory.com with SMTP (5.65/1.2-eef) id AA22143; Thu, 11 Sep 97 06:20:35 -0400 Received: from factory.com by bbsnet with UUCP ; Thu, 11 Sep 97 06:21:14 EDT To: BEAM@webconn.com Subject: Jack Kilby's quote... From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) Message-Id: <358157.500.uupcb@factory.com> Date: Wed, 10 Sep 97 22:00:00 -0500 Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York NY - 212-274-8110 Reply-To: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) References: Mr. Kilby was just honoured by Texas Instruments on his invention of the >transistor. His one regret about what his development begat? >"Annoying electronic greeting cards" >Heh - does he know what we do with them? Umm, redboxes? --- . SLMR 2.0 #..jw . Those phone cops play hardball! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.003BD953; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:53:42 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id DAA22270 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 03:41:51 -0700 Received: from invfacty.factory.com (invfacty.factory.com [199.183.47.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA29398 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 05:27:16 -0500 Received: from murk.factory.com by invfacty.factory.com with SMTP (5.65/1.2-eef) id AA22167; Thu, 11 Sep 97 06:20:41 -0400 Received: from factory.com by bbsnet with UUCP ; Thu, 11 Sep 97 06:21:20 EDT To: BEAM@webconn.com Subject: Quick Questions. From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) Message-Id: <358329.500.uupcb@factory.com> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 97 01:27:00 -0500 Organization: Invention Factory's BBS - New York NY - 212-274-8110 Reply-To: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski) References: <970909225905_738492924@emout06.mail.aol.com> SMTPOriginator: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com From: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com Subject: Quick Questions. PostedDate: 09/10/97 11:27:00 PM SendTo: BEAM@webconn.com ReplyTo: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 03:53:49 AM-09/11/97 03:53:49 AM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 03:53:49 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US >Will a PN2222 work in place of a 2N2222? Maybe. Depends on what kind of current you're pushing through 'em. >What's the difference between them? The 2N2222 is the original in the small metal can (TO-39, iirr), whereas the PN2222 (P = plastic, according to legend) comes in the plastic TO-92 case. Also, there's the [P2]N2222A, being a somewhat reworked/improved version of the [P2]N2222. Up to about 100mA, don't worry about either. --- . SLMR 2.0 #..jw . Zathras warn but, no, no one listen to poor Zathras, no. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.0058B21A; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:08:47 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA23086 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:56:54 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA30860 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 09:47:06 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts77ip143.cadvision.com [207.228.113.143]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id IAA55186; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:46:31 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911084434.00a92780@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 08:44:34 -0600 To: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com (Gene Kwiecinski), BEAM@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Jack Kilby's quote... In-Reply-To: <358157.500.uupcb@factory.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Jack Kilby's quote... PostedDate: 09/11/97 07:44:34 AM SendTo: gene.kwiecinski@factory.com,BEAM@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 09:08:59 AM-09/11/97 09:09:00 AM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 09:09:00 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:00 PM 9/10/1997 -0500, Gene Kwiecinski wrote: >>Heh - does he know what we do with them? > >Umm, redboxes? Nope - "HBS" (Happy Birthday Singer) controllers for the original BEAMbots! -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.00612DE4; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:41:27 -0700 Received: from xochi.tezcat.com (rnortman@[204.128.247.12]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA23541 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 10:29:35 -0700 Received: from localhost (rnortman@localhost) by xochi.tezcat.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/tezcat-96091001) with SMTP id MAA06240; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:37:33 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:37:32 -0500 (CDT) From: "R. Nortman" To: Laurence Mayer cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement In-Reply-To: <8825650F.00549CDD.00@Athena.dl.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: rnortman@tezcat.com From: rnortman@tezcat.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/11/97 10:37:32 AM SendTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 10:41:32 AM-09/11/97 10:41:33 AM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 10:41:33 AM Categories: $Revisions: On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Laurence Mayer wrote: > One of the methods of movement I'm considering using in a walker is > solenoids. This would be used in a bicore-type walker with either one or > two actuators. Sure, it pretty much negates most feedback to the core and > the movements would be very jerky, but I'm thinking of the miniaturization > potential. I've seen capable coils as small as 1/4 inch long by 1/8 inch > thick. (I'm not sure just how much force they would be able to generate.) [...] In fact, the best potential for miniaturization/weight reduction might be a build-it-yourself solenoid, though this takes a lot of patience. I started doing it once myself for a robot idea I had many years ago. I had this idea long before I heard of BEAM, but you may notice great similarities to the Solarengine in it... The bot was to be a "jumper" of sorts; it would charge a capacitor from a solar cell (there's your Solarengine) and when enough charge was built up, discharge it through a home-brew solenoid which would propel a "foot" downward, launching the robot into the air. There was no point other than in scaring people a few minutes after they turned on the lights. ;-> So anyway, I couldn't find any light-weight solenoids that had a long stroke (I needed about an inch), so I set about building my own by wrapping "magnet wire" (you can get this at Radio Shack) around a plastic straw and putting an iron nail in the middle. You must be very careful and neat with the wrapping, as the strength of the magnet is proportional to the number of turns of wire per unit of length. Sloppy wrapping will leave gaps between wires and that sap strength away. You also need to have several layers of wire to get any appreciable strength at all. This process overcame my patience after about 10 hours of wrapping and I never completed the solenoid. Regardless of how you come about the solenoid, I think you may find the current requirements to be prohibitive for a solar-powered bot, but it might be OK. I had no real requirements for how often my jumper bot fired, and in fact I would probably get annoy by it if it fired too often, so it wasn't a problem for that design. If you want your walker to move at more than a snail's pace, though, it might not work. Hope that helps, Randy Nortman rnortman@tezcat.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.0068B8F8; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:03:51 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA24045 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 11:51:53 -0700 Received: from mail.euronet.nl (mail.euronet.nl [194.134.0.67]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA32192 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 13:17:19 -0500 Received: from rog (p136.mas.euronet.nl [194.134.63.98]) by mail.euronet.nl (8.8.3/8.7.3) with SMTP id UAA19565 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:15:04 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970911201734.00b33448@mail.euronet.nl> X-Sender: ragman@mail.euronet.nl X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:17:34 +0200 To: beam@webconn.com From: Daniel Roganti Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement In-Reply-To: <8825650F.00549CDD.00@Athena.dl.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: ragman@euronet.nl From: ragman@euronet.nl Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/11/97 11:17:34 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 12:04:02 PM-09/11/97 12:04:02 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 12:04:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 08:33 AM 9/11/97 -0700, you wrote: > > > > >One of the methods of movement I'm considering using in a walker is >solenoids. This would be used in a bicore-type walker with either one or >two actuators. Sure, it pretty much negates most feedback to the core and >the movements would be very jerky, but I'm thinking of the miniaturization >potential. I've seen capable coils as small as 1/4 inch long by 1/8 inch >thick. (I'm not sure just how much force they would be able to generate.) >But it seems reasonable to interface them to a walker designed for two >motors. With any luck, this would greatly reduce the size of one of the >more bulky parts on the beam walker. > >Has anyone used coils to move a lever/leg on their creations, rather than >flapping wings or the magbot-hop? > >Laurence > > > > I've modified miniature relays to create walking "robots" (non-intelligent) I experiment by lengthening the armature and connecting levers to create legs. Now I have to try to put some "brains" into it. daniel =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Robotics Website http://www.euronet.nl/users/ragman/robotics.html Email home: ragman@euronet.nl Email work: daniel@betronic.nl Hometown: Elmont, N.Y., USA Backhome: Ft.Laud., Fla., USA Smail: Oud Wulvenlaan 35-2, 3523XS Netherlands, Europe ....exploring cyberspace before it runs out of space.... +=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.006CD48D; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:48:43 -0700 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA24201 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 12:36:45 -0700 Received: from odi (hlm01-06.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.7]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id VAA16246; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:43:47 +0200 (CEST) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:45:50 +0200 (MET DST) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: Laurence Mayer cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement In-Reply-To: <8825650F.00549CDD.00@Athena.dl.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: MULTIPART/MIXED; BOUNDARY="8323328-1044170743-874007150=:16277" $FILE: SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/11/97 12:45:50 PM SendTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 12:48:47 PM-09/11/97 12:48:48 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 12:48:48 PM Categories: $Revisions: On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Laurence Mayer wrote: > One of the methods of movement I'm considering using in a walker is > solenoids. This would be used in a bicore-type walker with either one or > two actuators. -----8<------ > Has anyone used coils to move a lever/leg on their creations, rather than > flapping wings or the magbot-hop? Solenoid/magnet actuators as shown in the attached .gif are being used for radio-controlled indoor aeroplane models. I've used them in on/off mode only, but a friend of mine has managed two-channel proportional control of a model weighing 31 grams; this weight includes three 50 mAh nicads to power the motor, the receiver and the two actuators. Flying time between charges is more than five minutes. An actuator can be made to weigh less than 1.5 grams. Current is typically less than 30 mA at 2.6 V, offering a couple of gram.centimeters of output. With a light power source and very short legs, a kind of walking seems not out of the question. An interesting idea! A translation of the Dutch words in the .gif: Aluminium lager - aluminum bearing Magneet - magnet Aansluitingen - connections Spoel - solenoid Koperen hefboom - lever (copper wire) Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - actuator.gif $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.00771618; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:40:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA24682 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:28:46 -0700 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA00374 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:33:54 -0500 Received: from physics.lanl.gov (aerie.lanl.gov [128.165.51.75]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA03503 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:33:45 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [128.165.205.238] (bob1.lanl.gov) by physics.lanl.gov (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA21271; Thu, 11 Sep 97 14:32:53 MDT Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:36:41 -0700 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Mark W. Tilden" Subject: Slow week in the sciences. SMTPOriginator: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov From: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov Subject: Slow week in the sciences. PostedDate: 09/11/97 02:36:41 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 02:40:51 PM-09/11/97 02:40:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 02:40:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Following a solid weekend of testing and involved lab work, I have finally managed to create a nervous-net life-support system for a Tamagouchi egg, so I suspect the Nobel prizes should just start pouring in any day now. Interesting little beast. The three buttons are all active low with internal pull ups, and the power requirements are well within solar-cell current requirements. The only output is the one from the speaker and it is active low also. This means that including power, it is possible to make a complete support interface through only six wires and still have the manual control buttons operate. The support system fits nicely into a single 74c240, and is a pair of 5-7Hz bicores deselected through diodes from a slow master tricore oscillator. The final buffer is used as a pulse extender from the piezo speaker output. This goes to changing the frequency of the "select" button oscillator so that when the thing starts screaming it has some "say" in finding a random function to feed, play, or clean its whiny electronic butt. Hopes of using a tamagouchi as a random function generator for biomechs were dashed as it turns out that even with the best care, the creature "dies" after ten to twelve days, forcing human intervention to reset. Bah. Happy birthday singers are far better for similar results. The real benefit here was the implication that Nv systems can satisfy an arbitrary program in a PIC style computer, which was the main reason for the excercise. As for parts, one of the cool things found was that the LCD module lifts off in one piece, and if glued on top of the 240 on an appropriately through-wired circuit board, the conductive rubber contact strips make a cool Nv system status display. Just crosses, squares, lines and dots, but it does show that there really is a good use for a dead Tamagouchi. Markt, $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.0079106B; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 15:02:20 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA24780 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:50:28 -0700 Received: from mail.llu.edu (mail.llu.edu [151.112.2.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA00720 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:16:16 -0500 Received: from earthlink.net ([151.112.23.43]) by mail.llu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA23502 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:16:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <34186018.239F0DFC@earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 14:18:16 -0700 From: Scott Andress X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.02 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: srandress@earthlink.net From: srandress@earthlink.net Subject: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' PostedDate: 09/11/97 02:18:16 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 03:02:27 PM-09/11/97 03:02:29 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 03:02:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I got a Radio Shack flyer in the mail the other day and noticed something that may interest this group. Here is exactly what the ad says: $19.99 "No batteries! Build a race car powered by the sun. Kit includes everything you need to build the 9"-long Photon solar race car: 1/2-watt solar panel, motor, vacuum formed body and parts. Fun and easy. Recommended for ages 9 and up. RSU#11903127" Then in small print it says "Available by special order for shipment direct to your door. Shipping extra." There is also a small picture and from what I can see, the solar panel looks kind of like one of those 'flex' panels about an inch wide and four inches long, except it appears to be encased in plastic. The car body is blue and looks like one of those stream-lined solar race cars we've seen in competitions -- kind of like a lifting-body jet. There is also a motor (maybe as large as the walkman types that Dave sells?) three wheels and rubber tires, and what looks like a mix of less than a dozen smaller parts including plastic and metal (?) gears. I'd be interested to hear how this 'solar roller' performs...I forget, but is 9" too long for Olympic competition? -Scott Andress srandress@earthlink.net $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 8825650F.007F93D5; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:13:29 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA25086 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:01:30 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01582 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:36:37 -0500 Received: from ts77ip156.cadvision.com (ts74ip53.cadvision.com [207.228.113.53]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id QAA82878; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:36:05 -0600 Received: by ts77ip156.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBECF.6E907580@ts77ip156.cadvision.com>; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:26:18 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBECF.6E907580@ts77ip156.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Scott Andress'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 16:26:15 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' PostedDate: 09/11/97 03:26:15 PM SendTo: srandress@earthlink.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 04:13:33 PM-09/11/97 04:13:34 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 04:13:34 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I got a Radio Shack flyer in the mail the other day and noticed something that may interest this group. Here is exactly what the ad says: $19.99 "No batteries! Build a race car powered by the sun. Kit includes everything you need to build the 9"-long Photon solar race car: 1/2-watt solar panel, motor, vacuum formed body and parts. Fun and easy. Recommended for ages 9 and up. RSU#11903127" Then in small print it says "Available by special order for shipment direct to your door. Shipping extra." There is also a small picture and from what I can see, the solar panel looks kind of like one of those 'flex' panels about an inch wide and four inches long, except it appears to be encased in plastic. The car body is blue and looks like one of those stream-lined solar race cars we've seen in competitions -- kind of like a lifting-body jet. There is also a motor (maybe as large as the walkman types that Dave sells?) three wheels and rubber tires, and what looks like a mix of less than a dozen smaller parts including plastic and metal (?) gears. I'd be interested to hear how this 'solar roller' performs...I forget, but is 9" too long for Olympic competition? Whoa there, ANY robot made from a kit (unless heavily modifyed, but that rule doesn't really apply for solar rollers. Second, This is Radio shack, they won't have the nice HE walkman ones, the'll prolly have their lowest voltage motor in it, and the gears, almost no way, they usually use belts. The flex solar panels might be those ones which snap like a potato chip. I've seen one that is sold by IWO (?) not very good quality from what it looks like. Devin -Scott Andress srandress@earthlink.net $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0001EF4A; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:21:07 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA25328 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:09:08 -0700 From: RobMaier@aol.com Received: from emout14.mail.aol.com (emout14.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.40]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA02084 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:52:43 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout14.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id TAA00766; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:52:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:52:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970911195054_1061552351@emout14.mail.aol.com> To: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov (markw.tilden) cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Mark on TV SMTPOriginator: RobMaier@aol.com From: RobMaier@aol.com Subject: Mark on TV PostedDate: 09/11/97 04:52:33 PM SendTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 05:21:15 PM-09/11/97 05:21:16 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 05:21:16 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Last night I watch a show called Technospy on the Learning Channel, the theme of the show was how high-tec and science have/would greatly advanced spying. One of the segments featured Mark Tilden at LANL. They showed a walker, Magbot and some of the others we have all grown to envy. Mark related how a small walker could be used in conjunction with other walkers and a queen to gather intelligence and basically spy on people. I thought it was a very well done bit. Maybe Mark will comment on it. ~~Rob $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0003A06C; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:39:36 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA25391 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:27:37 -0700 Received: from server1.coqui.net (server1.coqui.net [206.99.218.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA02048 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 18:48:00 -0500 Received: from mycomputer.coqui.net (sanjuan-208-135-6-220.coqui.net [208.135.6.220]) by server1.coqui.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA17431 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:52:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709112352.TAA17431@server1.coqui.net> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 02:20:18 -0300 From: "Jorge L. Correa" <"jcorrea@coqui.net"@coqui.net> Reply-To: "jcorrea@coqui.net"@coqui.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Walker legs rotation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net From: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net Subject: Walker legs rotation PostedDate: 09/03/97 10:20:18 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: jcorrea@coqui.net@coqui.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 05:39:48 PM-09/11/97 05:39:48 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 05:39:48 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi to all, for some time I been trying to do a Beam Walker. After getting all the parts, the fun really started by putting it together. Just one problem; after one minute the leg slowly rotates and osclilates instead of only oscillating. I try different caps sizes with results of more rotation on no movement at all. How could i fix this problem? Is this normal? I would appreciated any help. Thanks $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.000445E0; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:46:40 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA25416 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 17:34:42 -0700 Received: from ns.wavefront.com (ns.wavefront.com [204.73.244.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA02216 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:08:54 -0500 Received: by ns.wavefront.com (8.6.10/SMI-4.1.R931202) id TAA29935; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:08:34 -0500 Message-Id: <199709120008.TAA29935@ns.wavefront.com> Received: from raphael.ddb.com(206.144.165.197) via SMTP by ns.wavefront.com, id smtpdAAAa29926; Fri Sep 12 00:08:29 1997 Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Raphael Carter" Organization: Dept. of Exolinguistics and Misanthropology To: beam@webconn.com Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:10:03 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: RE: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' Reply-to: raphael@wavefront.com Priority: normal In-reply-to: <01BCBECF.6E907580@ts77ip156.cadvision.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.52) SMTPOriginator: raphael@wavefront.com From: raphael@wavefront.com Subject: RE: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' PostedDate: 09/11/97 05:10:03 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: raphael@wavefront.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 05:46:46 PM-09/11/97 05:46:47 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 05:46:47 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US The Photon solar racer is also sold by Edmund Scientific. ES says it goes 10 feet in six seconds. -- Raphael $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.000C3F87; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:13:46 -0700 Received: from inx.inx.net (inx.inx.net [198.70.60.2]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA25565 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:01:48 -0700 Received: from nolasco.inx.net (pm2-95.inx.net [198.70.60.95]) by inx.inx.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12340; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:00:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <3418A3E1.43D3@inx.net> Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:07:29 -0400 From: Jun Nolasco Reply-To: nolasco@inx.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steven Bolt CC: Laurence Mayer , beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: nolasco@inx.net From: nolasco@inx.net Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/11/97 07:07:29 PM SendTo: sbolt@xs4all.nl CopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US,beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: nolasco@inx.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 07:13:51 PM-09/11/97 07:13:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 07:13:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: Could you give some details on how this thing works? I can't seem to figure it out. Jun Nolasco nolasco@inx.net Steven Bolt wrote: > > Solenoid/magnet actuators as shown in the attached .gif are being > used for radio-controlled indoor aeroplane models. I've used them $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.000F73A3; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:48:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA25615 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:36:48 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03112 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:04:20 -0500 Received: from ts77ip156.cadvision.com (ts74ip53.cadvision.com [207.228.113.53]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id UAA93826 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:03:50 -0600 Received: by ts77ip156.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCBEEC.7639F3C0@ts77ip156.cadvision.com>; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:54:06 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCBEEC.7639F3C0@ts77ip156.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: GSE 1.1 (General solar engine) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 19:54:04 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: GSE 1.1 (General solar engine) PostedDate: 09/11/97 06:54:04 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 07:48:53 PM-09/11/97 07:48:54 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 07:48:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I got my hands on a few of the gold GSE 1.1 pcb's, I tried guessing where blah goes blah, but I ended up having one ruined. I've figured out where the cap and 2n2222's go (or 2907 or 3907), and im guessing 3 1k resistors are used. Also, only a few people might know what i'm talking about, if you have no idea of the layout, well you know what to do.... Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.00159568; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:55:45 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25715 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:43:46 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA03813 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:28:48 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts17ip98.cadvision.com [207.228.68.98]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id VAA78372; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:28:16 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911211429.00a976f0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:14:29 -0600 To: Scott Andress , beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' In-Reply-To: <34186018.239F0DFC@earthlink.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Radio Shack to offer 'solar race car' PostedDate: 09/11/97 08:14:29 PM SendTo: srandress@earthlink.net,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 08:55:54 PM-09/11/97 08:55:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 08:55:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 02:18 PM 9/11/1997 -0700, Scott Andress wrote: >I'd be >interested to hear how this 'solar roller' performs...I forget, but is >9" too long for Olympic competition? In direct sunlight, they really scoot! Unfortunately, they're large, (relatively) heavy, and generally suck. Even in direct sunlight, they need to be tweaked just right to run well. I have more fun with solarollers, especially the new prototypes we're playing with as the next Solarbotics kit. 45 seconds in direct sunlight give a 10' run on a smooth surface! As for size, Yup, 9" is a bit larger than the 6" maximum, plus I'd imagine that the solarcell is a liiittle bigger than the 1.25 in^2 maximum allowed. Later, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0015AF33; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:56:51 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA25718 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 20:44:52 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA03821 for ; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 22:29:04 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts17ip98.cadvision.com [207.228.68.98]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id VAA94276; Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:28:18 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970911211755.00a989a0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Thu, 11 Sep 1997 21:17:55 -0600 To: RobMaier@aol.com, mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov (markw.tilden) From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Mark on TV Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <970911195054_1061552351@emout14.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Mark on TV PostedDate: 09/11/97 08:17:55 PM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com,mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/11/97 08:56:55 PM-09/11/97 08:56:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/11/97 08:56:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:52 PM 9/11/1997 -0400, RobMaier@aol.com wrote: >I thought it was a very well done bit. Maybe Mark will comment on it. There's been better Markumentaries done. This was pushing into the "Schlocumentary" classification compared to the Discovery Channel bits, which I suppose you haven't seen as they were on the Canadian Discovery Channel only. Later, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.005F0506; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:17:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA26926 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 10:05:58 -0700 Received: from dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA08249 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:20:05 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id LAA22184 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:19:44 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:19:44 -0500 (CDT) Received: from whp-ny1-23.ix.netcom.com(199.183.44.55) by dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma022077; Fri Sep 12 11:19:11 1997 Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970912122839.1b7f5648@popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: mlerman@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Lerman Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement SMTPOriginator: mlerman@ix.netcom.com From: mlerman@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/12/97 09:19:44 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 10:17:58 AM-09/12/97 10:17:59 AM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 10:17:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Nice design, Steve. A couple of questions: 1. Approx diameter of coil? 2. What motor/prop does the aeroplane use? Is it slow enough to be used in a room rather than an auditorium? Mark Lerman 9:45 PM 9/11/97 +0200, you wrote: >On Thu, 11 Sep 1997, Laurence Mayer wrote: > >> One of the methods of movement I'm considering using in a walker is >> solenoids. This would be used in a bicore-type walker with either one or >> two actuators. >-----8<------ >> Has anyone used coils to move a lever/leg on their creations, rather than >> flapping wings or the magbot-hop? > >Solenoid/magnet actuators as shown in the attached .gif are being >used for radio-controlled indoor aeroplane models. I've used them >in on/off mode only, but a friend of mine has managed two-channel >proportional control of a model weighing 31 grams; this weight >includes three 50 mAh nicads to power the motor, the receiver and >the two actuators. Flying time between charges is more than five >minutes. >An actuator can be made to weigh less than 1.5 grams. Current is >typically less than 30 mA at 2.6 V, offering a couple of >gram.centimeters of output. With a light power source and very >short legs, a kind of walking seems not out of the question. >An interesting idea! > >A translation of the Dutch words in the .gif: >Aluminium lager - aluminum bearing >Magneet - magnet >Aansluitingen - connections >Spoel - solenoid >Koperen hefboom - lever (copper wire) > >Best, > >Steve > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >Content-Type: IMAGE/GIF; name="actuator.gif" >Content-ID: >Content-Description: > >Attachment Converted: C:\EUDORA\ATTACH\actuator.gif > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.006DA6EC; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:57:41 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA27439 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:45:42 -0700 Received: from mailhost.lanl.gov (mailhost.lanl.gov [128.165.3.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA09066 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:58:18 -0500 Received: from esh-mail.lanl.gov (esh-mail.lanl.gov [128.165.3.82]) by mailhost.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07387 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 12:58:15 -0600 (MDT) Received: from [128.165.29.34] ([128.165.29.34]) by esh-mail.lanl.gov (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25219 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:41:11 -0600 (MDT) X-Sender: u096767@esh-mail.lanl.gov Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <8825650F.00549CDD.00@Athena.dl.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 11:41:57 -0600 To: beam@webconn.com From: "John A. de Vries II" Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement SMTPOriginator: zozzles@lanl.gov From: zozzles@lanl.gov Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/12/97 10:41:57 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 12:57:51 PM-09/12/97 12:57:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 12:57:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Today's exceptionally bad, horrid, awful joke: "I thought a solenoid-based movement was when you swallowed a bunch of magnet wire and a soft-iron core...or is it a day or three after that?" TGIF, Zoz $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.00726AB9; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:49:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA27541 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 13:37:45 -0700 Received: from server1.coqui.net (server1.coqui.net [206.99.218.12]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09567 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:14:53 -0500 Received: from mycomputer.coqui.net (sanjuan-208-135-3-247.coqui.net [208.135.3.247]) by server1.coqui.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA00970 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:19:33 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <340F4CC2.7D91@coqui.net> Date: Thu, 04 Sep 1997 21:05:22 -0300 From: "Jorge L. Correa" Reply-To: jcorrea@coqui.net X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Walker legs rotation (Correct Reply Address) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcorrea@coqui.net From: jcorrea@coqui.net Subject: Walker legs rotation (Correct Reply Address) PostedDate: 09/04/97 05:05:22 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: jcorrea@coqui.net $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 01:49:54 PM-09/12/97 01:49:56 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 01:49:56 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US This message was send before with a wrong reply address. Sorry for my error. Hi to all, for some time I been trying to do a Beam Walker. After getting all the parts, the fun really started by putting it together. Just one problem; after one minute the leg slowly rotates and osclilates instead of only oscillating. I try different caps sizes with results of more rotation on no movement at all. How could I fix this problem? Is this normal? I would appreciated any help. Thank $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0076895F; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:34:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA27672 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 14:22:44 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA09905 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:55:59 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA07046 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:55:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709122055.QAA07046@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp71.buffnet.net(205.246.19.250) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma010710; Fri, 12 Sep 97 16:55:04 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Out of commision. Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 04:53:05 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Out of commision. PostedDate: 09/13/97 02:53:05 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 02:34:49 PM-09/12/97 02:34:49 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 02:34:49 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey, just checking up on the list. Started school so I have absolutly NO time for my little bot's. And I weep at the sight of my walker frame lying unused. OH well Buffalo Hamfest in a weekend or two! Flea Market for me BAbe! Anyone ever been to the ROCHESTOR HAmfest? That was friggin awsome. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.007BCD6D; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:32:15 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA27875 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:20:15 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout06.mail.aol.com (emout06.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.97]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA10282 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:38:41 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout06.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA00229 for beam@webconn.com; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:38:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:38:37 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970912173557_314451676@emout06.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: ????? SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: ????? PostedDate: 09/12/97 02:38:37 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 03:32:18 PM-09/12/97 03:32:19 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 03:32:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hey everybody! it's me again and I got some questions. Might be alot cus' I havent got'n online much. First off, what is solenoid? Second, what do you guy's think are the best books to pick up for info on robots? Magazines? Third, where can I find OTU and other parts? I recently purchased a solarroller and am still waiting for it to come... sigh .... wish I had enough dough to get it overnight. Anyway once it comes i'm gonna be asking Dave a lot of questions! Later, Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0082C0A9; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:48:10 -0700 Received: from mail1.noc.netcom.net (mail1.noc.netcom.net [204.31.1.150]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA29063 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:36:17 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by mail1.noc.netcom.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA13770 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 15:49:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA10551 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:19:12 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA09705 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:19:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709122219.SAA09705@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp49.buffnet.net(205.246.19.156) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma027892; Fri, 12 Sep 97 18:18:09 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Buffalo Rochestor Hamfest. Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 06:16:14 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Buffalo Rochestor Hamfest. PostedDate: 09/13/97 04:16:14 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 04:48:20 PM-09/12/97 04:48:21 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 04:48:21 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Yes Buffalo or Rochester NEw York. The Rochestor one is passed, there is a web site for it somewhere. The buffalo one is on September 20 it's the saturday at the Hamburg Fairgrounds. The flea market opens at 6 am. The website is http://www.buffalohamfest.org/buffalo.asp check it out. The rochestor one is Huge!!!!! It rainded and people used computer moniters as stakes to hold tarps down. Laptops five bucks, pagers five bucks. More computers than you have ever seen. It is the best. dEnnison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256510.0083B8AD; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:58:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA29375 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:46:50 -0700 Received: from noc.tor.hookup.net (noc.tor.hookup.net [165.154.1.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10948 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:11:44 -0500 Received: from dada (shadow3.tor.hookup.net [165.154.14.149]) by noc.tor.hookup.net (8.8.6/1.689) with SMTP id TAA25872 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:11:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709122311.TAA25872@noc.tor.hookup.net> From: "Chad Ingles" To: "BEAM" Subject: Need some help with my first type-1 solarengine Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:07:29 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1008.3 X-MimeOle: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE Engine V4.71.1008.3 SMTPOriginator: cingles@thelinc.ca From: cingles@thelinc.ca Subject: Need some help with my first type-1 solarengine PostedDate: 09/12/97 04:07:29 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 04:58:53 PM-09/12/97 04:58:54 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 04:58:54 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi there, I found out recently about all this BEAM stuff and have read through most of the related websites. I have been thinking about building simple wheeled robots for some time (with the hopes of moving to more complex legged creatures in turn). I've collected all the parts and assembled a bread-board version of the solarengine (to mount in a solarroller once it's working). When I attach power to the circuit my motor just spins constantly. I looked through the mailing list archives but didn't find anything there with that problem. I will keep checking the circuit, but if any of you experts out there could provide assistance it would be greatly appreciated. Chad Ingles BEAM Newbie $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.00003BC5; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:02:33 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA29463 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 16:50:34 -0700 Received: from noc.tor.hookup.net (noc.tor.hookup.net [165.154.1.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA11031 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:21:44 -0500 Received: from dada (shadow3.tor.hookup.net [165.154.14.149]) by noc.tor.hookup.net (8.8.6/1.689) with SMTP id TAA10959 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:21:40 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709122321.TAA10959@noc.tor.hookup.net> From: "Chad Ingles" To: "BEAM" Subject: Forgot some info re: help with solarengine Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:17:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1008.3 X-MimeOle: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE Engine V4.71.1008.3 SMTPOriginator: cingles@thelinc.ca From: cingles@thelinc.ca Subject: Forgot some info re: help with solarengine PostedDate: 09/12/97 04:17:30 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 05:02:37 PM-09/12/97 05:02:38 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 05:02:38 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I forgot to mention that I am not using a solar cell right now but instead am using to AA batteries for a total of 3V. Not being overly skilled with circuit knowledge, is there anything I need to wire differently to take this into account? I read mention somewhere about using a resistor in series on the positive lead of the battery? Thanks, Chad Ingles BEAM Newbie $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.0004CD3A; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:52:26 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA00275 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:40:28 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA11343 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 18:55:32 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts49ip234.cadvision.com [207.228.72.234]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id RAA101792; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:54:47 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970912175349.00a998f0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 17:53:49 -0600 To: "Chad Ingles" , "BEAM" From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Need some help with my first type-1 solarengine In-Reply-To: <199709122311.TAA25872@noc.tor.hookup.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Need some help with my first type-1 solarengine PostedDate: 09/12/97 04:53:49 PM SendTo: cingles@thelinc.ca,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 05:52:38 PM-09/12/97 05:52:39 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 05:52:39 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 07:07 PM 9/12/1997 -0400, Chad Ingles wrote: >I've collected all the parts and assembled a bread-board version of the >solarengine (to mount in a solarroller once it's working). When I attach >power to the circuit my motor just spins constantly. What kind of power - DC power supply/solar/battery? The whole purpose of the SE is to turn "low-density" power into something useful. If you're not using a solarcell, try using two AA cells thru a 660ohm resistor (~0.5mA current flow). This will approximate the power from a solarcell, and give you the pulsing action that makes a SE a SE. Regards, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.001043AE; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:57:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02680 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:45:45 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12358 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:30:26 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m018.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.233]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06816; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:25:21 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970913023036.006d9a80@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:30:36 +1000 To: Dennlill From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: PLant powered solar engin. Cc: BEAM SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: PLant powered solar engin. PostedDate: 09/12/97 07:30:36 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 07:57:41 PM-09/12/97 07:57:42 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 07:57:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 21:54 9/09/97 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >Hey I was looking at one of the famous SPUD clocks You know where the >potatos are used as batteries? Wouldn't it be kinda neet, (maybe unethical) >if you could load a lving plant with electrodes and extract power from it? >True it would't be alot but using the solar engin concept couldn't it be >adapted? The problem is that the electrodes would eventualy corode so it >would not last forever. Sigh. I've been developing this idea for a while. Unfortunately all the potatoes end up in food before I grab them :( gives new meaning to silicon chips sorry Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.001043FF; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:57:39 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02682 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:45:46 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12362 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:30:45 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m018.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.233]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06812; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:25:16 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970913023033.006d5384@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:30:33 +1000 To: RobMaier@aol.com From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Mark on TV Cc: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov (markw.tilden), beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Mark on TV PostedDate: 09/12/97 07:30:33 PM SendTo: RobMaier@aol.com CopyTo: mwtilden@aerie.lanl.gov,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 07:57:41 PM-09/12/97 07:57:42 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 07:57:42 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 19:52 11/09/97 -0400, RobMaier@aol.com wrote: >One of the segments featured Mark Tilden at LANL. They showed a walker, >Magbot and some of the others we have all grown to envy. Mark related how a >small walker could be used in conjunction with other walkers and a queen to >gather intelligence and basically spy on people. a hive of bots with a queen, relaying information? Am I the only paranoid one, or does this sound borgish to anybody else? Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.001059AF; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:58:35 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02686 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:46:40 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12356 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:30:22 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m018.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.233]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06818; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:25:22 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970913023038.006db854@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:30:38 +1000 To: Dennlill From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: PLant Power. continued... Cc: BEAM SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: PLant Power. continued... PostedDate: 09/12/97 07:30:38 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 07:58:42 PM-09/12/97 07:58:43 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 07:58:43 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 06:28 10/09/97 -0500, Dennlill wrote: >The robot would most likely have to be attached to the plant. It would take >much to long to "extract" energy from plants to use them as transient >"snacks" You would need to mount them on board or put the robot on the >plant. Now most of the electrical generation comes from the electrodes, not >from the plant itself. The plant more or less acts in a simmilar manner as >the salt wwater in a ssalt water battery. You would also need many >electrodes, because although I don't know the specifics the voltage IS low. >However you could rig up some sort "rechargeable" plant power source using >the proper electrodes and possibly use the plant when its dark. It >certainly is an interesting idea and even if it dosen't pan out it merits >experimentation. that reminds me of a theoretical project I suggested to a friend doing genetic engineering. The idea was to somehow incorporate chlorophyll into the body of a small animal. That way the animal could simply photosynthesize without having to eat. It sort of died (the idea, not the animal) when we came to the ethics side of things Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.00106201; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:58:56 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA02689 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 19:47:03 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA12353 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:30:16 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m018.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.233]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA06814; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:25:19 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970913023035.006d8124@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:30:35 +1000 To: "John A. de Vries II" From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Radiation Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/12/97 07:30:35 PM SendTo: zozzles@lanl.gov CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 07:59:02 PM-09/12/97 07:59:03 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 07:59:03 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:05 8/09/97 -0600, John A. de Vries II wrote: >also: there is at least one satellite out there that works on the >radioactive source-thermocouple design the Lab has produced. On the other >hand, you may remember the flap about the Russian satellite that re-entered >with a fair amount >nastiness in it that everyone was afraid was going to hit their turf? I actually, NASA are kicking up a stink about somebody sending a probe to Saturn loaded with heaps of radioactive material. Probably the Russians, but I'm not sure the problem with their rockets crashing is because they don't spend enough time testing them. They're always rushin' :) I'm sorry Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.001A4034; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:46:43 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02913 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:34:44 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout25.mail.aol.com (emout25.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.130]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA13074 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:26:35 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout25.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id XAA17219 for beam@webconn.com; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:26:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:26:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970912221702_1414671531@emout01.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Release the info! SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Release the info! PostedDate: 09/12/97 08:26:28 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 09:46:52 PM-09/12/97 09:46:53 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 09:46:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Not to start any wars or anything but it's just an opoinion, so don't get mad or anything. From my reasoning, the reason why there are beam web pages is to spread the growth of beam by giving the public the knowlige to build thier own little bots. Now, if this is true then why the hell isn't there enough info out there! I think I speak for all beginners at this when I say we need more info! If you guys really want this field of robotics to grow you're all going to have to break away from you're work bench's and get on you're computers and at least make some crappy text files that explain how to construct the different types of robots that everyone is making. Like I said to Brian a couple o' weeks back, "we need more info on the basics!". I've scanned all the pages recently and have found jack on how to build a photovore other than combinig two solar engines together, but how would you make one with sensory input or infra red detection etc.. If I'm not wrong at least one of you guys have built one of those. So why not tell us beginners how you did it? If you've patented it etc. then we'll understand but can't you at least share with us some of your most basic secrets? If you dont do that at least update you're pages regularly anf tell us about what you've done over the past month or so. Also for the list can you guy's just explain a little bit more in layman's terms when you're answering a question etc. I think that most of the begginers out there who don't have that much expierience in electronics just go brain dead while reading some of you're answers to questions. I don't normally do things like this, when I say like this I'm reffering to being a leader or something like that, but I just got pist off at this, and I really think that we should really take a stand and not feel intimidated by these guys, they're almost like are teachers and when we need help on a certain subject we go and we ask for help. So just please take into consideration what I said and hopefully nothing like this will ever happen again. Later, Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.001A884A; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:49:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA02916 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 21:37:48 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA13515 for ; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 23:03:52 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts77ip141.cadvision.com [207.228.113.141]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id WAA105780; Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:03:24 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970912220249.00a9fcc0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Fri, 12 Sep 1997 22:02:49 -0600 To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com, beam@webconn.com From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Release the info! In-Reply-To: <970912221702_1414671531@emout01.mail.aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Release the info! PostedDate: 09/12/97 09:02:49 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/12/97 09:49:56 PM-09/12/97 09:49:57 PM DeliveredDate: 09/12/97 09:49:57 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 11:26 PM 9/12/1997 -0400, NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: >Not to start any wars or anything but it's just an opoinion, so don't get mad >or anything. Kind of hard not to, considering that there's TONS of material on "How-to" with BEAM tech than there is for traditional robotics. >Like I said to Brian a >couple o' weeks back, "we need more info on the basics!". Hey, you can't get more substantial than what Brian Bush has done on his website here: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/oscillate.html It's a dynamite FAQ that'll get you over the learning curve a *HECK* of a lot faster than 4 years ago when it took me over 4 months to glean together enough materials and know-how to make my 1st solarengine. >I've scanned all >the pages recently and have found jack on how to build a photovore other than >combinig two solar engines together, but how would you make one with sensory >input or infra red detection etc.. ??? There's LOTS to get you going on photovores, including on our own website where we show how to build the omni-directional sensors (http://www.solarbotics.com/images/hirez/sensor1.jpg), and there's been numerous mentions of Photovore ideas on the mailing-list archives. As for IR detection, I'm not sure what you want to do. Also, I should mention that an article on Photovores I wrote for the now-defunct "Robot Practitioner" is now close to publication in the new ...dang, can't recall the name right now. It's published by Bill Gates who also publishes "Midnight Engineer". ALSO, our PhotoPopper circuit has been fully published in "Nuts and Volts" two issues ago. Lots of info, if you want to dig for it. >Now, if this is true then why the hell isn't there enough info out >there! I think I speak for all beginners at this when I say we need more >info! Like I said, there's MUCH more information online on BEAM than any other source with the exception of the free 6.270 MIT Robot Builder's Guide using 68hc11's. >So why not tell us beginners how you did it? If >you've patented it etc. then we'll understand but can't you at least share >with us some of your most basic secrets? So what do you want to know? If I/we posted a bit on every noteworth BEAMbug built, you'd have a pretty decent website (hmmmm, where can you find bits on plenty of BEAMbots on a website....?). A general shotgun of a question won't get as much response as a specific inquiry to what it is you're trying to accomplish. >Also for the list can you guy's just explain a little bit more in >layman's terms when you're answering a question etc. Again, how are we supposed to know what you find confusing unless if you don't ask the question? Take for example, the HBS inquiry floating around here the other day - it just took a quick msg asking what it was to get a paragraph answer to it. In short: Stop reading; get to breadboarding/building; then ASK QUESTIONS. Regards, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.002843C0; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:19:47 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA03080 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:07:35 -0700 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA14810 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:53:48 -0500 Received: from odi (hlm01-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.2]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id IAA24774 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:53:43 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:55:40 +0200 (MET DST) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Release the info! In-Reply-To: <970912221702_1414671531@emout01.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Release the info! PostedDate: 09/12/97 11:55:40 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 12:19:57 AM-09/13/97 12:19:59 AM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 12:19:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Fri, 12 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > Not to start any wars or anything but it's just an opoinion, so > don't get mad or anything. ----8<----- > Now, if this is true then why the hell isn't there enough info out > there! I think I speak for all beginners at this when I say we > need more info! ----8<----- > "we need more info on the basics!". I've scanned all the pages > recently and have found jack on how to build a photovore other than > combinig two solar engines together, but how would you make one > with sensory input or infra red detection etc.. If I'm not wrong > at least one of you guys have built one of those. So why not tell > us beginners how you did it? Well, I think I did my best with http://www.xs4all.nl/~sbolt/e-index.html But I would have to agree that there is a serious gap between the current average knowledge of electronics and what you need to be able to build and understand even a simple photovore. A mailing list isn't the proper medium for distributing info on that level, though. It needs a book, or if you want to be modern, a CDROM. ----8<----- > If you dont do that at least update you're pages regularly anf > tell us about what you've done over the past month or so. ----8<----- I'm probably speaking for most of those actually designing and building little robots when I say: Quite a bit! But nothing I'd like to put on the Web; that will take a little while longer. Refined sensory input is one of the things in my pipeline, but it takes lots of weekends to make an effort worth publishing. And then one has to find the time to write a proper piece of text about it, do the illustrations, the html... And there is the regular living to earn, the Real Life and so on. Sorry. > Also for the list can you guy's just explain a little bit more in > layman's terms when you're answering a question etc. I think that > most of the begginers out there who don't have that much > expierience in electronics just go brain dead while reading some > of you're answers to questions. ----8<----- Perhaps there is a market for a popular science/electronics, from the ground up, seriously illustrated book about building small robots. Hmmm... Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.0029A0F6; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:34:41 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA03101 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 00:22:42 -0700 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA14808 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 01:53:46 -0500 Received: from odi (hlm01-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.2]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id IAA24756; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:53:18 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:55:15 +0200 (MET DST) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: Mark Lerman cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement In-Reply-To: <2.2.16.19970912122839.1b7f5648@popd.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: solenoid-based movement PostedDate: 09/12/97 11:55:15 PM SendTo: mlerman@ix.netcom.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 12:34:45 AM-09/13/97 12:34:46 AM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 12:34:46 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Fri, 12 Sep 1997, Mark Lerman wrote: > A couple of questions: > > 1. Approx diameter of coil? The original ones I made are 15mm outside, 10mm inside diameter, using an 8mm diameter, 4 mm thick magnet. This was reduced to 10mm outside, 6.5mm inside diameter, using two 5mm diameter, 1.5mm thick magnets. > 2. What motor/prop does the aeroplane use? Is it slow enough to be used in a > room rather than an auditorium? Calculating... Based on wing area and weight, speed would be 4 m/s or above, which agrees with recent memory. The only radio controlled airborne things I've seen that would fit in a room are those little Japanese (helium-filled) airships. For more info about RC indoor, try: Linkname: Lightweight RC URL: http://www.astro.su.se/~daniel/radio.html I don't think that 31 gram model is already mentioned, but there are other things worth a read. Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.004A545D; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 06:31:52 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA03310 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 06:19:39 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16545 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 07:57:09 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA23635 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:56:43 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709131256.IAA23635@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from eppp47.buffnet.net(205.246.19.154) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma013145; Sat, 13 Sep 97 08:56:07 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Re: Release the info, your wrong. Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:54:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Re: Release the info, your wrong. PostedDate: 09/13/97 06:54:17 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 06:31:54 AM-09/13/97 06:31:54 AM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 06:31:54 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I understand you where your comming from but I'm sorry to say that you are wrong. There is so much information out there that it's hard to know what to do. I'm not one of the originol gurus of beam by no stretch of the imagination. When IU fist go started on beam about two years ago there was so little information that I gave up on it. Now there is so much information anyone can do it. Experimentation is the key. Although it is nice to read the pages about solar engines and how tey are built I suggest that you ignore them. Thats right, ignore them. You have to scrounge find stuff whip it together and hope it works. Read the objective of a solar engin and fins something else that would acomplish it. This isn't a fixed science. This is the untimate is organized experimentation.Thats what it's all about. Eperimentation. You will have to learn that. No one can tell you how. If you just have to have plans for a photovore or sollar engin their are penty diffrent types out their. You have to look, spend hours burrowing through web pages looking for the basics. They are there. you just have to look for them. And thas half the fun. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.005A4331; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:25:54 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA03563 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 09:13:54 -0700 Received: from mail1.sirius.com (mail1.sirius.com [205.134.253.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA17407 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 10:50:02 -0500 Received: from [205.134.245.155] (ppp-astk19--155.sirius.net [205.134.245.155]) by mail1.sirius.com (8.8.7/Sirius-8.8.7-97.08.12) with SMTP id IAA25077 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 08:49:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709131549.IAA25077@mail1.sirius.com> Subject: Wind-up toys Date: Sat, 13 Sep 97 08:50:30 -0700 x-sender: djohnson@pop.sirius.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Dave Johnson To: "BEAM List" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" SMTPOriginator: djohnson@pop.sirius.com From: djohnson@sirius.com Subject: Wind-up toys PostedDate: 09/13/97 08:50:30 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 09:26:04 AM-09/13/97 09:26:05 AM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 09:26:05 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US For what it's worth: I've been buying and dissecting wind-up toys (for purposes other than BEAM, actually) and found one, it's an eagle that sort of crabs sideways by walking on the tips of its wings, made by Tomy, as most are) that has a gear box with an easily extractable metal shaft 1 mm in diameter on the output. A pager motor shaft isn't quite long enough to stick out the other side (necessary to keep the pinion gear aligned) so I used a piece of music wire and small heat shrink tubing to attach the motor to that. should work for the 1.5 mm shafts just fine, though mine is a 1mm shaft. The gear ratio isn't huge, roughly 6:1 (surprising to me since there are a number of gears in there), so this may not be useful as a wheel drive, or anything else for that matter, but it was sure an easy interface with a pager motor. Thought this might be useful info for someone. I'm still looking for a yard full of old ovens I can dissect. OK, back to lurking... Dave Johnson $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256511.00665BE9; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:38:01 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA03749 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 11:26:00 -0700 Received: from mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (grunt.ksu.ksu.edu [129.130.12.17]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA18110 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:07:15 -0500 Received: from humec.ksu.edu (humec.ksu.edu [129.130.248.235]) by mailhub.cns.ksu.edu (8.8.5/8.8.5/mailhub+tar@ksu.edu) with ESMTP id NAA21183 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:07:01 -0500 (CDT) Received: from HUMEC/MAILQUE by humec.ksu.edu (Mercury 1.21); 13 Sep 97 13:07:02 cdt6cst Received: from MAILQUE by HUMEC (Mercury 1.21); 13 Sep 97 13:06:59 cdt6cst From: "Lloyd Verhage" Organization: College of Human Ecology, KSU To: beam@webconn.com Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 13:06:57 CST6CDT Subject: Re: Radiation Reply-to: verhage@humec.ksu.edu Priority: normal In-reply-to: <1.5.4.32.19970913023035.006d8124@ix.net.au> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.52) Message-ID: <4B0FB2413D7@humec.ksu.edu> SMTPOriginator: verhage@humec.ksu.edu From: verhage@humec.ksu.edu Subject: Re: Radiation PostedDate: 09/13/97 12:06:57 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: verhage@humec.ksu.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 11:38:12 AM-09/13/97 11:38:13 AM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 11:38:13 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > actually, NASA are kicking up a stink about somebody sending a probe to > Saturn loaded with heaps of radioactive material. Probably the Russians, but > I'm not sure > the problem with their rockets crashing is because they don't spend enough > time testing them. They're always rushin' :) Ummm, NASA is sending Cassini to Saturn. Its a few Americans who are complaining. In my opinion, the protesters are wrong. Lloyd $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.0003CA0E; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:41:23 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA04033 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 17:29:23 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout10.mail.aol.com (emout10.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.25]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA19720 for ; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 19:04:54 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout10.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id UAA09307 for beam@webconn.com; Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:04:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 13 Sep 1997 20:04:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970913200442_435069834@emout10.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Main Site SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Main Site PostedDate: 09/13/97 05:04:45 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/13/97 05:41:28 PM-09/13/97 05:41:29 PM DeliveredDate: 09/13/97 05:41:29 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Thanks for the responses, also thanks for not barking down my neck! Even though you guys say there is a lot of info out there then why is it so hard to find it? Also I think that you should put out a bit more info and oganize it a bit more too. Another way we can transmit the info is by compiling it all into one site. We could also set up a message board or a chat room on the site so it would be a lot easier to get the info without the junked up mailboxes, and with the cha room we could engage in real time conversations! I could probably set up the site on my AOL screen name (they are offering 10 megs of space for free!) and you guy's could just tell me what you want on it and I'll put it up as soon as I can. I was also wondering if we could mix i n some of the info from other pages and put it all in one place so it would be easier to find. All that I really need is your permission and your cooperation to help me thrrough this. Later, Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.002ACE85; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 00:47:33 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA04249 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 00:35:34 -0700 Received: from smtp2.xs4all.nl (smtp2.xs4all.nl [194.109.6.52]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA21780 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 02:10:08 -0500 Received: from odi (hlm01-01.dial.xs4all.nl [194.109.53.2]) by smtp2.xs4all.nl (8.8.6/XS4ALL) with SMTP id JAA11546 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 09:09:54 +0200 (CEST) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 09:11:47 +0200 (MET DST) From: Steven Bolt X-Sender: sbolt@odi To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Main Site In-Reply-To: <970913200442_435069834@emout10.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: sbolt@xs4all.nl From: sbolt@xs4all.nl Subject: Re: Main Site PostedDate: 09/14/97 12:11:47 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 12:47:36 AM-09/14/97 12:47:37 AM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 12:47:38 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: -------8<-------- > We could also set up a message board or a chat room on the site > so it would be a lot easier to get the info without the junked up > mailboxes, and with the chatroom we could engage in real time > conversations! This has been proposed before, as well as a newsgroup in addition to or replacing the mailing list. I'm not sure of the status of these proposals; I doubt that I could spend much time in a chatroom. That medium is perhaps to modern for me. -------8<-------- > I was also wondering if we could mix in some of the info from other > pages and put it all in one place so it would be easier to find. > All that I really need is your permission and your cooperation to > help me thrrough this. Um, I thought one advantage of the Net to be the irrelevance of physical location. You can set up a page, make links to other pages and even elements on those other pages, while adding your own comment and info. This way you could for instance combine stuff that adds up to much of the basic info you feel is lacking (in accessibility). Assuming proper credit for the pages you link to, there is nothing wrong with that approach, though it would be nice to ask the owners first, especially for the use you want to make of links to separate elements on their pages. Best, Steve ---------------------------------------------------------------------- # sbolt@xs4all.nl # Steven Bolt # popular science monthly KIJK # ---------------------------------------------------------------------- $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.003615BD; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 02:50:45 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA04390 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 02:38:43 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA22366 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 03:49:18 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m041.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.210]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA06574; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 18:43:56 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970914084916.006d65d8@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 18:49:16 +1000 To: Steven Bolt From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Main Site Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Main Site PostedDate: 09/14/97 01:49:16 AM SendTo: sbolt@xs4all.nl CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 02:50:53 AM-09/14/97 02:50:54 AM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 02:50:54 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 09:11 14/09/97 +0200, Steven Bolt wrote: >On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > >-------8<-------- >> We could also set up a message board or a chat room on the site >> so it would be a lot easier to get the info without the junked up >> mailboxes, and with the chatroom we could engage in real time >> conversations! > >This has been proposed before, as well as a newsgroup in addition >to or replacing the mailing list. I'm not sure of the status of these >proposals; I doubt that I could spend much time in a chatroom. That >medium is perhaps to modern for me. also the widely differing time zones would make it fairly difficult. Unfortunately BEAM is still something most people have never heard of. Until it becomes more popular, real time chat is virtually useless > >-------8<-------- >> I was also wondering if we could mix in some of the info from other >> pages and put it all in one place so it would be easier to find. >> All that I really need is your permission and your cooperation to >> help me thrrough this. > >Um, I thought one advantage of the Net to be the irrelevance of >physical location. You can set up a page, make links to other pages >and even elements on those other pages, while adding your own >comment and info. This way you could for instance combine stuff >that adds up to much of the basic info you feel is lacking (in >accessibility). >Assuming proper credit for the pages you link to, there is nothing >wrong with that approach, though it would be nice to ask the owners >first, especially for the use you want to make of links to separate >elements on their pages. perhaps a web ring is the way to go? I'm actually in the middle of testing a random banner server for my University's UNIX server, to link together everybody's pages. Something similar could be adopted maybe C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.003FA130; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 04:35:00 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA04463 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 04:23:04 -0700 Received: from iris.iupui.edu (iris.iupui.edu [134.68.220.32]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA23050 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 06:05:06 -0500 Received: from khaupt.iupui.edu (c1p4.dialin.iupui.edu [134.68.241.105]) by iris.iupui.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA06062 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 06:04:54 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <341BB556.5916@iupui.edu> Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 05:58:46 -0400 From: John and Kelly Reply-To: khaupt@iupui.edu X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam Subject: Re: Main Site Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: khaupt@iupui.edu From: khaupt@iupui.edu Subject: Re: Main Site PostedDate: 09/14/97 02:58:46 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: khaupt@iupui.edu $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 04:35:10 AM-09/14/97 04:35:11 AM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 04:35:11 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US [clip] > perhaps a web ring is the way to go? I've surfed a lot of these related to art and jewelry. I think a ring would be a great idea. my $.02 $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.0052A1CA; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 08:02:33 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA04577 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 07:50:21 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout15.mail.aol.com (emout15.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.41]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA24312 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 09:25:13 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout15.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id KAA20588 for beam@webconn.com; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 10:24:57 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 10:24:57 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970914102456_1717672003@emout15.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Mega Site SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Re: Mega Site PostedDate: 09/14/97 07:24:57 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 08:02:43 AM-09/14/97 08:02:44 AM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 08:02:44 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Well your all right about one thing, BEAM isn't popular enough to need real time chat yet, also if we set a chat room the time differences would be a problem, unless we create multiple chat rooms for the different locations to counteract the problem. I've also heard about a net pager program that we could utilize to have private conversation. I'm not very familier with net rings but I think that it means a group of web pages interwoven together to create a circle of info, maybe we could make a diagram of the locations of info in a circular pattern and create hyper links to each one. Anyother suggestions will be apprecited. Later, Kyle, 12 $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.0070ED4B; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 13:33:27 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA04870 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 13:21:26 -0700 Received: from buffnet4.buffnet.net (buffnet4.buffnet.net [205.246.19.13]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA25781 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 14:43:43 -0500 Received: from buffnet9.buffnet.net (buffnet9.buffnet.net [205.246.19.19]) by buffnet4.buffnet.net (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA18152 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 15:43:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709141943.PAA18152@buffnet4.buffnet.net> Received: from dppp45.buffnet.net(205.246.19.224) by buffnet9.buffnet.net via smap (V2.0) id xma028296; Sun, 14 Sep 97 15:42:48 -0400 From: Dennlill To: BEAM Subject: Re: Megasite Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 03:40:53 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dennlill@buffnet.net From: dennlill@buffnet.net Subject: Re: Megasite PostedDate: 09/15/97 01:40:53 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 01:33:38 PM-09/14/97 01:33:39 PM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 01:33:39 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I think we are over reacting. Presently the Beam web sties are plesently and well organized and easy to access. Information also is very organized and avalible. I don't think real time chat, Internet Paging, mesasge boards, web rings are needed. To be honest Beam robotics is rather well set up, to do anything else with it would be redundent. The only thing I can think of being usefull is an internet location for all the e-mails, and thats it. I mean I sure wouldn't want to talk to anyone in private, it would be boring. Kyle just start book marking your site and keep checking on things. All of the information presented is enough to build some hardcore beam bots. Just look around! and spend time breadboarding and not complaining. Dennison $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256512.0078D4B7; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 14:59:47 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA04925 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 14:47:34 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout08.mail.aol.com (emout08.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.23]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA26346 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 16:29:26 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout08.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id RAA06933 for beam@webconn.com; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 17:29:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 14 Sep 1997 17:29:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970914172655_267621629@emout08.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Photovore SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Photovore PostedDate: 09/14/97 02:29:06 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 02:59:54 PM-09/14/97 02:59:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 02:59:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US does anyone have a readily available digram of a photovore circuit other than Steven's? I need it for my own use and for the text file I'm creating after I put it together I'll probably turn it into html form and put up a web page. Also if anyone else has any valueable info on anything (even taking a piss) I'll find a place for it. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.00228908; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 23:17:13 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA05427 for ; Sun, 14 Sep 1997 23:04:59 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA28527 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 00:30:40 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m016.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.235]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id PAA16237; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 15:25:24 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970915053047.006cdcf4@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 15:30:47 +1000 To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Mega Site Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Mega Site PostedDate: 09/14/97 10:30:47 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/14/97 11:17:19 PM-09/14/97 11:17:19 PM DeliveredDate: 09/14/97 11:17:19 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:24 14/09/97 -0400, NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: >Well your all right about one thing, BEAM isn't popular enough to need real >time chat yet, also if we set a chat room the time differences would be a >problem, unless we create multiple chat rooms for the different locations to >counteract the problem. I've also heard about a net pager program that we there's a few programs like that. ICQ or PowWow are reasonable examples. ICQ is mainly for text groups, but PowWow is more for one on one voice chatting >could utilize to have private conversation. I'm not very familier with net >rings but I think that it means a group of web pages interwoven together to >create a circle of info, maybe we could make a diagram of the locations of >info in a circular pattern and create hyper links to each one. Anyother >suggestions will be apprecited. there's a program I've seen which most web rings use, but I can't remember the name for the life of me. It automates the process so you just link to the program and it passes you on to the next on the list. I'll do some research into it, if people would like me to set it up C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.00292CF6; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 00:29:44 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA05486 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 00:17:42 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA28970 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 01:39:20 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m049.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.202]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA00289; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:34:00 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970915063928.006c9b74@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:39:28 +1000 To: Dennlill From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: web ring Cc: BEAM SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: web ring PostedDate: 09/14/97 11:39:28 PM SendTo: dennlill@buffnet.net CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 12:29:49 AM-09/15/97 12:29:49 AM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 12:29:49 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US well, I've established the web ring already :) I'm still working on the code and graphics to put in member pages, but it's up and running. The homepage is at: http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/beam if you don't want to join, that's fine, but I think it will make it easier for the newbies to find e verything Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.0031B216; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 02:02:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id BAA05575 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 01:50:34 -0700 Received: from zenith.Berkeley.EDU (zenith.Berkeley.EDU [128.32.177.33]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA29419 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 02:52:56 -0500 Received: from [128.32.177.184] (vault-particle.Berkeley.EDU) by zenith.Berkeley.EDU (4.1/1.31) id AA22448; Mon, 15 Sep 97 00:55:10 PDT X-Sender: pangloss@thor.he.net Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Eudora Pro 3.0 for Macintosh Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 00:57:51 -0800 To: beam@webconn.com From: Chris Seidel Subject: BEAM Chat SMTPOriginator: seidel@pangloss.com From: seidel@pangloss.com Subject: BEAM Chat PostedDate: 09/15/97 01:57:51 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 02:02:54 AM-09/15/97 02:02:54 AM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 02:02:54 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US [snip] >We could also set up a message board or a chat room on the site [snip] Well, this might seem kind of whacky, but I programmed a Chat Site for my homepage in an effort to learn CGI some time ago. So with a few slight modifications, I made a BEAM Chat page that uses the Basic Chat engine I wrote. It's not real time, but close enough for most folks (i.e. not stingy on bandwidth). Basically it displays one page worth of text. New messages are added at the bottom, while old messages are deleted from the top. So if no one is around, your message can still be seen by someone poking in sometime later. Here's the URL if anyone wants to try it: http://www.pangloss.com/BEAM/chat.html It's designed to be very simple, such that no specific software is required to use it (like Pow Wow, IRC, etc). Any web browser is sufficient, and it's Lynx friendly. I allow HTML in the text of messages, so people wanting to display a graphic can do so with an html tag. If people find it useful, great! If not, it was only 5 minutes worth of editing on my part and I can easily dipose of it. Feel free to use it. Also, because it's part of my other chat site some of the links may not be seemless, and may lead to my regular chat site (which is usually deserted). I'm not a chatter myself usually, but it was a fun and simple programming project. (I also wrote a simple bulletin board interface, in case anyone is serious about NeTKiLL78's bulletin board comment above). Also, because it's part of my other site some of the links may not be seemless, and may lead to my regular chat site. Chris Seidel http://zenith.berkeley.edu/seidel/ Dept of Molecular and Cell Biology University of California at Berkeley $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.0033ABFC; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 02:24:23 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA05592 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 02:12:22 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id DAA29686 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 03:40:14 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m052.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.199]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA01880; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 18:35:07 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970915084031.006d2a10@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 18:40:31 +1000 To: BEAM From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: web ring Cc: BEAM SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: web ring PostedDate: 09/15/97 01:40:31 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 02:24:30 AM-09/15/97 02:24:31 AM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 02:24:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US ok everybody! The web ring is now operational (I think) I'd appreciate it if some people would help me out by joining it. The address is: http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/beam/ I've got it set up to display in the listing once we get five sites together. Anyway, hope to hear from you soon C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.004DF31F; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 07:11:25 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA05891 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 06:59:28 -0700 Received: from mail1.sirius.com (mail1.sirius.com [205.134.253.131]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA31258 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 08:39:53 -0500 Received: from [205.134.235.72] (ppp-asfm02--072.sirius.net [205.134.235.72]) by mail1.sirius.com (8.8.7/Sirius-8.8.7-97.08.12) with SMTP id GAA10416 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 06:39:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199709151339.GAA10416@mail1.sirius.com> Subject: wind-up toys Date: Mon, 15 Sep 97 06:40:33 -0700 x-sender: djohnson@pop.sirius.com x-mailer: Claris Emailer 2.0, March 15, 1997 From: Dave Johnson To: "BEAM List" Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" SMTPOriginator: djohnson@pop.sirius.com From: djohnson@sirius.com Subject: wind-up toys PostedDate: 09/15/97 06:40:33 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 07:11:29 AM-09/15/97 07:11:31 AM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 07:11:31 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US For what it's worth: I've been buying and dissecting wind-up toys (for purposes other than BEAM, actually) and found one, it's an eagle that sort of crabs sideways by walking on the tips of its wings, made by Tomy, as most are) that has a gear box with an easily extractable metal shaft 1 mm in diameter on the output. A pager motor shaft isn't quite long enough to stick out the other side (necessary to keep the pinion gear aligned) so I used a piece of music wire and small heat shrink tubing to attach the motor to that. should work for the 1.5 mm shafts just fine, though mine is a 1mm shaft. The gear ratio isn't huge, roughly 6:1 (surprising to me since there are a number of gears in there), so this may not be useful as a wheel drive, or anything else for that matter, but it was sure an easy interface with a pager motor. Thought this might be useful info for someone. I'm still looking for a yard full of old ovens I can dissect. OK, back to lurking... Dave Johnson $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.006AEA0E; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 12:27:47 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id MAA07440 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 12:15:45 -0700 Received: from eclipse.qis.net (eclipse.qis.net [207.114.40.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id NAA00251 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 13:22:59 -0500 Received: from alleng.baltsun.com (saturn.baltsun.com [207.22.85.254]) by eclipse.qis.net (8.8.5/8.8.2) with ESMTP id OAA17433; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 14:20:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <341D7C81.FF784F7B@reborn.com> Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 14:20:49 -0400 From: Al Gardenghi Organization: The Baltimore Sun X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "beam@webconn.com" Subject: Motors...... X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: al@reborn.com From: al@reborn.com Subject: Motors...... PostedDate: 09/15/97 11:20:49 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 12:27:52 PM-09/15/97 12:27:53 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 12:27:53 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hi to all ! I'm newb to BEAM robots, could someone tell me where to buy motors - [Pager maybe?] or whatever... It seems all the motors I cam find are too inefficient. Thanks Al ****************** Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." ****************** $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.007C465E; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 15:37:24 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA08328 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 15:25:22 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emin16.mail.aol.com (emout31.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.14]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA01606 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 17:07:59 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emin16.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id SAA12967 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 18:07:44 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 18:07:44 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970915180321_-163836014@emout04.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Mega site update and requests. SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Mega site update and requests. PostedDate: 09/15/97 03:07:44 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 03:37:30 PM-09/15/97 03:37:31 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 03:37:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Well this is just a little report on my current proggress on the site. I have just recently started searching all the sites that I currently have listed and would appreciate it if everyone who's got a site to send the url to me so I could post it for you. I would also appreciate it if all you big guy's would do a quick update on you're sites and give me the permission to copy some of the info and paste it on mine, It's for the info purposes only. And again if you have any photovore plans other than the solarengine type and steve's I would appreciate it if you sent me it. Does anyone have a Type-2 solarengine plan? All 4 Now! Kyle Martin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256513.007EDFEC; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:05:48 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id PAA08438 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 15:53:45 -0700 Received: from lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (timehost.lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us [198.59.98.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA01925 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 17:43:11 -0500 Received: from localhost (medendob@localhost) by lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id QAA00067 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:42:54 -0600 Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:42:54 -0600 (MDT) From: Brian Medendorp To: BEAM Subject: web-page Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us From: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us Subject: web-page PostedDate: 09/15/97 03:42:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 04:05:58 PM-09/15/97 04:05:59 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 04:05:59 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello, I am just about to the point of drastically updateing my robotics page, and was wondering if you all had any good beam (or otherwise) realated robotics links, that I could use to update it with. If you would like to see what It looks like now, the url is: http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob/robotics/ Note: I haven't updated it for a while, so I have no idea if any of the links work, or what the condition of the page is. (I know that at least I had a problem with part of my images being transparent, and they werent supposed to be). If you would like to see some of the type of stuff that I will be adding (possibly), or just have some extra time, check out: http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob/ <== and go to dynamic -or- http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob/dynamic/ Note: you will have to have Netscape Communiactor (IE4.0 should work, but it is not tested). - |3rian :) "Hey, it's George, I've got nothing to say" \\// -George Costanza *>-o00o~(,,)~o00o-<*************************************************** () |~~) /\/\ |__)RIAN /_/\_\EDENDORP "Mouse, Head, Bob, etc..." oo0 0oo -> http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob <- **>~(_)~~~~~~(_)~<**************************************************** $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.000038AF; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 17:02:25 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA08681 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:50:24 -0700 Received: from lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (timehost.lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us [198.59.98.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA01997 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 17:50:04 -0500 Received: from localhost (medendob@localhost) by lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id QAA01940; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:49:48 -0600 Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:49:48 -0600 (MDT) From: Brian Medendorp To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. In-Reply-To: <970915180321_-163836014@emout04.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us From: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. PostedDate: 09/15/97 03:49:48 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 05:02:32 PM-09/15/97 05:02:33 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 05:02:33 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Thats kind of ironic that I got this message, after sending the one I just sent, but anyway: In reference to the question about the type-2 solar engine plans, I have build one, well I t could probably be considered one, eventhough, thats not what I planned, (but if that didn't happen to us every once in a while, things would not have developed as much as they have), and I guess I could make a "plan", but I stil have to work on the front wheel(s). anyway, laters- - |3rian :) "Hey, it's George, I've got nothing to say" \\// -George Costanza *>-o00o~(,,)~o00o-<*************************************************** () |~~) /\/\ |__)RIAN /_/\_\EDENDORP "Mouse, Head, Bob, etc..." oo0 0oo -> http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob <- **>~(_)~~~~~~(_)~<**************************************************** On Mon, 15 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > Well this is just a little report on my current proggress on the site. > > I have just recently started searching all the sites that I currently have > listed and would appreciate it if everyone who's got a site to send the url > to me so I could post it for you. > > I would also appreciate it if all you big guy's would do a quick update on > you're sites and give me the permission to copy some of the info and paste it > on mine, It's for the info purposes only. > > And again if you have any photovore plans other than the solarengine type and > steve's I would appreciate it if you sent me it. Does anyone have a Type-2 > solarengine plan? > > All 4 Now! > Kyle Martin > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.000118B7; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 17:11:58 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA08749 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:59:55 -0700 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA02408 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 18:46:35 -0500 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id QAA29240; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:46:22 -0700 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199709152346.QAA29240@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 16:46:21 -0700 (PDT) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <970915180321_-163836014@emout04.mail.aol.com> from "NeTKiLL78@aol.com" at Sep 15, 97 06:07:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. PostedDate: 09/15/97 04:46:21 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 05:12:05 PM-09/15/97 05:12:06 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 05:12:06 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I have been running a Perl utility I wrote called grokurl.pl on this list. What it does is search my mailbox archive of this list for URLs. Currently I have 211 links from this list (80% or so are working). One of the best things about this email list is finding out about new robo-web pages... The link list is located at: http://www.ee.calpoly.edu/~jcline/beam-list.htm All links on the above page are automatically updated and all links sent to the BEAM e-list are automatically added to the above list. Many of the links have broken over time (many get moved). So if anyone recognizes one of their old pages, e-mail me the updated link (or post it here) and it will get automagically added. > > Well this is just a little report on my current proggress on the site. > > I have just recently started searching all the sites that I currently have > listed and would appreciate it if everyone who's got a site to send the url > to me so I could post it for you. > > I would also appreciate it if all you big guy's would do a quick update on > you're sites and give me the permission to copy some of the info and paste it > on mine, It's for the info purposes only. > > And again if you have any photovore plans other than the solarengine type and > steve's I would appreciate it if you sent me it. Does anyone have a Type-2 > solarengine plan? > > All 4 Now! > Kyle Martin > Jonathan jcline@vision.calpoly.edu $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.000ECD87; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:41:41 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA09152 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:29:38 -0700 From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Received: from emout09.mail.aol.com (emout09.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.24]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03538 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:24:10 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout09.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id WAA09300 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:24:01 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970915222116_-230909545@emout09.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re:Motors... SMTPOriginator: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Subject: Re:Motors... PostedDate: 09/15/97 07:24:01 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 07:41:44 PM-09/15/97 07:41:45 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 07:41:45 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I'm new to BEAM,myself... HOWEVER...I'd like to encourage you to keep religious preferences and quotes off a BEAM mailing list...I'm here to read and learn about BEAM robotics...not your religion...I'm not trying to be harsh...just keep in mind that most people subscribing to this service aren't looking for preachers...they're looking to build better BEAM creatures..... I don't mean to offend anyone...I just think there's a time...and place for everything... short of global destuction,of course... "The only joy in the world is to begin"Cesare Pavese. Xx1101xX $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.000EDDEF; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:42:23 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA09158 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:30:20 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03564 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:26:37 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m045.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.206]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA12037; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 12:21:03 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970916022630.006de5a8@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 12:26:30 +1000 To: Jonathan From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. Cc: NeTKiLL78@aol.com, beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Mega site update and requests. PostedDate: 09/15/97 07:26:30 PM SendTo: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu CopyTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 07:42:25 PM-09/15/97 07:42:25 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 07:42:25 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 16:46 15/09/97 -0700, Jonathan wrote: > >I have been running a Perl utility I wrote called grokurl.pl on >this list. What it does is search my mailbox archive of this >list for URLs. Currently I have 211 links from this list (80% or >so are working). One of the best things about this email list is >finding out about new robo-web pages... > >The link list is located at: > http://www.ee.calpoly.edu/~jcline/beam-list.htm > >All links on the above page are automatically updated and all links >sent to the BEAM e-list are automatically added to the above list. >Many of the links have broken over time (many get moved). So if >anyone recognizes one of their old pages, e-mail me the updated >link (or post it here) and it will get automagically added. unfortunately, it ain't there! Nice idea though Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.0010AB1E; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 20:02:03 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id TAA09213 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 19:50:01 -0700 From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Received: from emout28.mail.aol.com (emout28.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.133]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03753 for ; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 21:39:25 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout28.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id WAA14699 for beam@webconn.com; Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:39:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 15 Sep 1997 22:39:15 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970915223404_1651192222@emout13.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: CD motors?..responses?...so far...none.... SMTPOriginator: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Subject: CD motors?..responses?...so far...none.... PostedDate: 09/15/97 07:39:15 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/15/97 08:02:09 PM-09/15/97 08:02:10 PM DeliveredDate: 09/15/97 08:02:10 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I sent in a question about a week or so ago concerning CD motors and their usefullness in BEAM creations...I'd like to know if they are acceptable/practical for use in BEAM.I also yanked a tape motor out of the same unit from which the cd motors came...looks too big to me...it had to be able to run at least two tapes simultaneously(play/record)... I would very much appreciate any response from the "BEAM alumni"... thank you, Jason $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.00369854; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 02:56:19 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id CAA09695 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 02:44:20 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id EAA05915 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 04:34:16 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m025.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.226]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA17710 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:29:15 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970916093442.006e9e38@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:34:42 +1000 To: From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: web ring graphic SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: web ring graphic PostedDate: 09/16/97 02:34:42 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 02:56:26 AM-09/16/97 02:56:26 AM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 02:56:26 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US ok everybody! The web ring is functioning fine now, so please add your site the main problem I have is getting a decent image for the button. I just knocked together an image from a picture of a photopopper, but other submissions would be GREATLY accepted! I've chosen to use the javascript console, but I've checked and it works with pre-Java browsers too. Also, content for the homepage is needed desperately! Basically it needs a brief description of BEAM robotics and the qualifications needed to join the ring (basically any BEAM related page) I have assignments due very soon, so I'm running low on time. If nobody helps out I'll probably be able to do it eventually anyway, thanks Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.005843A8; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 09:04:04 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id IAA10317 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 08:52:02 -0700 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA07465 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 10:01:20 -0500 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id K[Z07637; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 10:57:20 EDT To: tink@ix.net.au, beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Mark on TV Message-ID: <19970916.102742.7807.1.nytwulf@juno.com> References: <1.5.4.32.19970913023033.006d5384@ix.net.au> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-5 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Nyt wulf) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 10:57:20 EDT SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: Re: Mark on TV PostedDate: 09/16/97 07:57:20 AM SendTo: tink@ix.net.au,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 09:04:15 AM-09/16/97 09:04:16 AM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 09:04:16 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Sat, 13 Sep 1997 12:30:33 +1000 Andrew Vaughan writes: >a hive of bots with a queen, relaying information? Am I the only >paranoid one, or does this sound borgish to anybody else? the first thing that came to my mind was Aliens... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256514.0064B76D; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 11:20:05 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA11206 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 11:08:08 -0700 Received: from user.xtdl.com (user.xtdl.com [206.25.228.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA08359 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 12:37:21 -0500 Received: from darwin (dialup06.bedford.xtdl.com [206.25.228.225]) by user.xtdl.com (8.6.11/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA19950 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 13:54:27 -0400 Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19970916133508.009b8100@wingate> X-Sender: bbush#user.xtdl.com@wingate X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 13:35:08 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: "Brian O. Bush" Subject: robo kitty Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: bbush@xtdl.com From: bbush@xtdl.com Subject: robo kitty PostedDate: 09/16/97 10:35:08 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 11:20:11 AM-09/16/97 11:20:12 AM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 11:20:12 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello all, well, evolvable hardware has finally gotten some press... from PC Magazine online, you will find an article on Robo Kitty: Researchers create artificial brain to power robotic kitten. http://www8.zdnet.com/pcmag/news/trends/t970916b.htm Now, evolvable hardware might be the next leap in tek for many hardware based areas, including BEAM robotics once the nervous systems get larger and larger. Cheers, Brian --- brian o bush, gearhead "follow the black valley trail of death, into the beautiful sunshine." http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo BEAM FAQ: http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/FAQ.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.000261F2; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 17:26:01 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA12869 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 17:13:58 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emin24.mail.aol.com (emout36.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA10472 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 18:03:02 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emin24.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id TAA14331 for beam@webconn.com; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:02:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:02:47 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970916185712_1491201311@emout04.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Solenoid Projectile SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/16/97 04:02:47 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 05:26:09 PM-09/16/97 05:26:10 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 05:26:10 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US This might not have anything to do with BEAM but I was just reading some stuff from the 11th and was wondering if you could use solenoids in series and fire them one by one in succession in about one second with a high pawer circuit. If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire a projectile at very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00088A2E; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 18:33:16 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA13098 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 18:21:13 -0700 Received: from lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (lahs.lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us [198.59.98.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA10933 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:33:51 -0500 Received: from localhost (medendob@localhost) by lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) via SMTP id SAA29208; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 18:33:37 -0600 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 18:33:37 -0600 (MDT) From: Brian Medendorp To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile In-Reply-To: <970916185712_1491201311@emout04.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us From: medendob@lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/16/97 05:33:37 PM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 06:33:25 PM-09/16/97 06:33:26 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 06:33:26 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Well, actually, (if I understand you correctly) this has already been done, starting back in the 70's. It's called a mass driver cannon or rail cannon (ever seen Eraser -- although, they had serious problems with their concept of the device). It's basically a linear accelerator, and can launch projectiles at something like 60% the speed of light. One original ideas was to use it to launch things into orbit. - |3rian :) "Hey, it's George, I've got nothing to say" \\// -George Costanza *>-o00o~(,,)~o00o-<*************************************************** () |~~) /\/\ |__)RIAN /_/\_\EDENDORP "Mouse, Head, Bob, etc..." oo0 0oo -> http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob <- **>~(_)~~~~~~(_)~<**************************************************** On Tue, 16 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > This might not have anything to do with BEAM but I was just reading some > stuff from the 11th and was wondering if you could use solenoids in series > and fire them one by one in succession in about one second with a high pawer > circuit. > > If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire a projectile at > very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? > > Kyle > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0014276E; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 20:40:08 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id UAA13301 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 20:28:10 -0700 Received: from mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA11757 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:55:46 -0500 Received: from linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us (linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us [198.187.135.22]) by mail.kitsap.lib.wa.us (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA09666; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:57:10 -0700 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:48:02 -0700 (PDT) From: garrett myrick To: Brian Medendorp cc: NeTKiLL78@aol.com, beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us From: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/16/97 07:48:02 PM SendTo: medendob@LAHS.LosAlamos.K12.nm.us CopyTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 08:40:13 PM-09/16/97 08:40:14 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 08:40:14 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Tue, 16 Sep 1997, Brian Medendorp wrote: > Well, actually, (if I understand you correctly) this has already been > done, starting back in the 70's. It's called a mass driver cannon or rail > cannon (ever seen Eraser -- although, they had serious problems with their > concept of the device). It's basically a linear accelerator, and can > launch projectiles at something like 60% the speed of light. One original > ideas was to use it to launch things into orbit. > > - |3rian :) > > "Hey, it's George, I've got nothing to say" > \\// -George Costanza > *>-o00o~(,,)~o00o-<*************************************************** > () |~~) /\/\ > |__)RIAN /_/\_\EDENDORP "Mouse, Head, Bob, etc..." > oo0 0oo -> http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob <- > **>~(_)~~~~~~(_)~<**************************************************** > > On Tue, 16 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > > > This might not have anything to do with BEAM but I was just reading some > > stuff from the 11th and was wondering if you could use solenoids in series > > and fire them one by one in succession in about one second with a high pawer > > circuit. > > > > If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire a projectile at > > very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? > > > > Kyle > > > I can think of several uses for something like that... Could someone please explain the concept a little better? Garrett $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00191D07; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:34:18 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA13348 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:22:15 -0700 From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Received: from emout01.mail.aol.com (emout01.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.92]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA11920 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:22:32 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout01.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id XAA08110 for beam@webconn.com; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:22:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:22:13 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970916232042_-664860468@emout01.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: sig Apology SMTPOriginator: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Subject: sig Apology PostedDate: 09/16/97 08:22:13 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 09:34:29 PM-09/16/97 09:34:31 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 09:34:31 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US To anyone who was offended by my statement to being offended by a certain sig..... I Apologize........ I was not trying to police,nor was I trying to be closed-minded,I simply made a statement;not a correction ,nor a reprimand. I did not expect everyone to agree,and I apologize for the way I came across... I definitely don't want to be on someone's bad side because of this... Xx1101xX@aol.com Jason Courter....you want shoe size?..... this space intentionally left blank........... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.001A0420; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:44:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id VAA13360 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:32:06 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA11911 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:20:34 -0500 Received: from ts39ip143.cadvision.com (ts39ip143.cadvision.com [207.228.71.143]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id VAA48720; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:19:53 -0600 Received: by ts39ip143.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCC2E4.C8291980@ts39ip143.cadvision.com>; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:09:12 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCC2E4.C8291980@ts39ip143.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'garrett myrick'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:09:08 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/16/97 08:09:08 PM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 09:44:22 PM-09/16/97 09:44:22 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 09:44:22 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Tue, 16 Sep 1997, Brian Medendorp wrote: > Well, actually, (if I understand you correctly) this has already been > done, starting back in the 70's. It's called a mass driver cannon or rail > cannon (ever seen Eraser -- although, they had serious problems with their > concept of the device). It's basically a linear accelerator, and can > launch projectiles at something like 60% the speed of light. One original > ideas was to use it to launch things into orbit. > > - |3rian :) > > "Hey, it's George, I've got nothing to say" > \\// -George Costanza > *>-o00o~(,,)~o00o-<*************************************************** > () |~~) /\/\ > |__)RIAN /_/\_\EDENDORP "Mouse, Head, Bob, etc..." > oo0 0oo -> http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob <- > **>~(_)~~~~~~(_)~<**************************************************** > > On Tue, 16 Sep 1997 NeTKiLL78@aol.com wrote: > > > This might not have anything to do with BEAM but I was just reading some > > stuff from the 11th and was wondering if you could use solenoids in series > > and fire them one by one in succession in about one second with a high pawer > > circuit. > > > > If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire a projectile at > > very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? > > > > Kyle > > > I can think of several uses for something like that... Could someone please explain the concept a little better? So yer planning on building a gun like in eraser....ok you set off the solenoids off 1/2 second apart from each other, Particle accelerators do alot better job.....Trust us when we say "There aren't many uses for it except for ones which end up with a few cows "tipped over" from very long distances away" Devin $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.001CA7D5; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:12:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA13420 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:00:52 -0700 Received: from dns.img.net (dns.img.net [207.34.144.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA12185 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:59:10 -0500 Received: from port110.img.net ([207.34.144.110]) by dns.img.net (Netscape Mail Server v1.1) with SMTP id AAA219; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:04:52 -0700 Received: by port110.img.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BCC2E3.F27A5740@port110.img.net>; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 21:03:14 -0700 Message-ID: <01BCC2E3.F27A5740@port110.img.net> From: "Mairs, T." To: "'Xx1101xX@aol.com'" , "beam@webconn.com" Subject: RE: Motors... Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 20:38:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: tmairs@img.net From: tmairs@img.net Subject: RE: Motors... PostedDate: 09/16/97 08:38:23 PM SendTo: Xx1101xX@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 10:13:08 PM-09/16/97 10:13:08 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 10:13:08 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US I know I am going to get beat up for replying to your senseless and immature posting in this medium but I feel your comments justify an equally verbose response. Your comments referred to a contributor's tag line. These lines are usually automatically generated and are generally chosen by a user to reflect some aspect of their personality, or belief. Whether that tag line is acceptable to you or not is irrelevant. The "offending comment" was a Bible verse. If the Tag had said "Where's the beef ?" would you scream heresy for all vegetarians of the world ? If the tag referred to Star Trek, would you suddenly become an offended Babylon 5 Fan ? Where does this stupidity stop. Yes, I agree that this is not the forum for any discussion other than BEAM related issues. However, there was no intended desire for discussion, preaching, or recruitment here. This was a TAG LINE ! - an AFTER THOUGHT - a P.S. --- GET IT ????? As a member of the Christian community, I forgive you. As a member of the Web world, I accept that people like you exist. As a member of the human race, I loathe the fact that people like you are permitted to communicate with the rest of us. My advice for the coward who hides behind the username of Xx1101xX@aol.com is just this : - Grow up! TOM http://www.img.net/aasland - Don't miss out.... -----Original Message----- From: Xx1101xX@aol.com [SMTP:Xx1101xX@aol.com] Sent: Monday, September 15, 1997 7:24 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re:Motors... I'm new to BEAM,myself... HOWEVER...I'd like to encourage you to keep religious preferences and quotes off a BEAM mailing list...I'm here to read and learn about BEAM robotics...not your religion...I'm not trying to be harsh...just keep in mind that most people subscribing to this service aren't looking for preachers...they're looking to build better BEAM creatures..... I don't mean to offend anyone...I just think there's a time...and place for everything... short of global destuction,of course... "The only joy in the world is to begin"Cesare Pavese. Xx1101xX $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00211090; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:01:09 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA13500 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:49:05 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA12606 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:46:39 -0500 Received: from ts39ip143.cadvision.com (ts39ip143.cadvision.com [207.228.71.143]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id WAA97374 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:46:02 -0600 Received: by ts39ip143.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCC2F0.D20F7820@ts39ip143.cadvision.com>; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:35:23 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCC2F0.D20F7820@ts39ip143.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: Mark t's H-bridge Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 22:35:20 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: Mark t's H-bridge PostedDate: 09/16/97 09:35:20 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 11:01:20 PM-09/16/97 11:01:21 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 11:01:21 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US While I'm doing cad designs of my Robot for next years robot wars, and my cash flow is actully above 0, I finally can do things other than breadboarding. Well I'm sure as hell not paying for some H-bridge of some sort, so I'm guessing if mark's might be able to work under higher V and A. A makita 9.4 V battery is what I might be using for it, 2 12VDC 10,000 RPM motors or some other fairly high ( by my standards)rpm high torque. Just tell me what situations l298N blows up in, if you know. Devin "More Building less thinking " $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00225D0B; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:15:20 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA13517 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:03:16 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA12787 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:04:35 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m054.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.197]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA10321; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 14:59:03 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970917050435.006dfc3c@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 15:04:35 +1000 To: garrett myrick From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile Cc: Brian Medendorp , NeTKiLL78@aol.com, beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/16/97 10:04:35 PM SendTo: gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: medendob@LAHS.LosAlamos.K12.nm.us,NeTKiLL78@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 11:15:27 PM-09/16/97 11:15:28 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 11:15:28 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 19:48 16/09/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >I can think of several uses for something like that... Could someone >please explain the concept a little better? well, the diagrams I've seen involve a tube lined with electromagnetic coils. A piece of metal is placed at one end, then the closest coil is magnetized. As the metal reaches that one, its turned off and the next one is turned on. Basically it progresses down the tube like that until it shoots out the end. I'll scan some pictures if you really want anyway, C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00241337; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:34:02 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA13529 for ; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:21:58 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA13071 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:36:08 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts67ip144.cadvision.com [207.228.75.144]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id XAA19084; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:35:43 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970916232938.00a05100@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:29:38 -0600 To: Hyndman , "'beam@webconn.com'" From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Mark t's H-bridge In-Reply-To: <01BCC2F0.D20F7820@ts39ip143.cadvision.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Mark t's H-bridge PostedDate: 09/16/97 10:29:38 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/16/97 11:34:10 PM-09/16/97 11:34:11 PM DeliveredDate: 09/16/97 11:34:11 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 10:35 PM 9/16/1997 -0600, Hyndman wrote: >Just tell me what situations l298N blows up in, if you know. They're not too good. It tops out at about 2 amps, so it ain't the greatest. I tried tying two together (4 amps, oooo!), and the simply couldn't drive one of my 8 amp (unloaded - peak at 15A) Sumo motors. Only thing close that'll handle it is MOSFET drivers like the better R/C car controllers use. Sorry I don't have more "powerful" help, but I can forward you some info I've gleaned off the net if you're interested in building your own high-power H-Bridge. >"More Building less thinking " Good boy - have a biscuit. -Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.002A8747; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:44:31 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA13598 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:32:27 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA13773 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 01:44:29 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts67ip144.cadvision.com [207.228.75.144]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id AAA51572; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:44:03 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970917004229.00a04bc0@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:42:29 -0600 To: Randy Sargent From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars Cc: In-Reply-To: <199709170618.XAA18845@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars PostedDate: 09/16/97 11:42:29 PM SendTo: rsargent@newtonlabs.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 12:44:39 AM-09/17/97 12:44:40 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 12:44:40 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 11:18 PM 9/16/1997 -0700, Randy Sargent wrote: >La Machine's secret? What I saw was servos mechanically linked to >switches. Makes it harder to control, but I think the on resistance beats >any mosfet you'll find :-). Is true, but you can't argue that full proportional control for 9.2V with only .004 Ohms resistance isn't that far off! I had looked at some relays for my Sumobot too. Them suckers aren't cheap when you get to the 10+ amp range - and LARGE too! Any idea what they did to surpress the sever arcing of Full Fwd to Full Rev transitions? Or did they simply swap in new relays every match? Later, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.002B0DF1; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:50:16 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id AAA13607 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 00:38:17 -0700 Received: from quasar.newtonlabs.com (quasar.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.97]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA13605 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 01:31:44 -0500 Received: from bogomips.newtonlabs.com (rsargent@bogomips.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.108]) by quasar.newtonlabs.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id XAA31957; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:18:58 -0700 Received: (from rsargent@localhost) by bogomips.newtonlabs.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id XAA18845; Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:18:58 -0700 Date: Tue, 16 Sep 1997 23:18:58 -0700 Message-Id: <199709170618.XAA18845@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> From: Randy Sargent To: Dave Hrynkiw cc: Subject: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars SMTPOriginator: rsargent@newtonlabs.com From: rsargent@newtonlabs.com Subject: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars PostedDate: 09/16/97 11:18:58 PM SendTo: dave@solarbotics.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 12:51:58 AM-09/17/97 12:51:59 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 12:51:59 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > From: Dave Hrynkiw > > ... > They're not too good. It tops out at about 2 amps, so it ain't the > greatest. I tried tying two together (4 amps, oooo!), and the simply > couldn't drive one of my 8 amp (unloaded - peak at 15A) Sumo motors. Only > thing close that'll handle it is MOSFET drivers like the better R/C car > controllers use. Sorry I don't have more "powerful" help, but I can forward > you some info I've gleaned off the net if you're interested in building > your own high-power H-Bridge. > ... If I remember right, I saw the motor driver used for "La Machine", the heavyweight robot placing second a little over a year ago (I didn't see Robot Wars this past year). From my recollection, La Machine could pour more power into its motors than any of its competitors. It was very heavy, and could accelerate fast enough to scare anyone not physically behind a sturdy wall from the robot. (It missed first place due to a clever "forklift" design which managed to topple it). La Machine was certainly a crowd favorite, I think due to the way it rammed opponent machines, accelerated them across the floor, and plastered them vertically onto the wall (imagine pieces flying everywhere). La Machine's secret? What I saw was servos mechanically linked to switches. Makes it harder to control, but I think the on resistance beats any mosfet you'll find :-). -- Randy ---------------------------------------------------------------- Randy Sargent Newton Research Labs Senior Design Engineer Robotic Systems and Software rsargent@newtonlabs.com http://www.newtonlabs.com/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.003ECD2C; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 04:25:57 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@[206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id EAA13734 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 04:13:53 -0700 Received: from brickbat8.mindspring.com (brickbat8.mindspring.com [207.69.200.11]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id FAA15131 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 05:42:30 -0500 Received: from darthvader (user-37kbbgi.dialup.mindspring.com [207.69.174.18]) by brickbat8.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id GAA20161 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:42:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.32.19970917064510.0092be40@atl.mindspring.com> X-Sender: cmckenna@atl.mindspring.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0 (32) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:45:19 -0400 To: beam@webconn.com From: Chuck McKenna Subject: Re: unsubscribing? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: robotman@mckennanet.com From: robotman@mckennanet.com Subject: Re: unsubscribing? PostedDate: 09/17/97 03:45:19 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 04:26:01 AM-09/17/97 04:26:02 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 04:26:02 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US If you are unhappy with the large number of these posted, maybe someone could periodically post Unsubscribe instructions to the list. -Chuck At 06:04 PM 9/15/97 +0100, you wrote: >Lawrence E. Powell Sr. wrote: >> >> > > >GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR > >Matthew > > > Later, -Chuck McKenna (KF4JPE) http://www.mindspring.com/~cmckenna Homebrew, Ham Radio, and more! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00430893; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 05:12:11 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA13779 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 05:00:06 -0700 Received: from eclipse.qis.net (eclipse.qis.net [207.114.40.20]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA15456 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:31:35 -0500 Received: from alleng.baltsun.com (saturn.baltsun.com [207.22.85.254]) by eclipse.qis.net (8.8.5/8.8.2) with ESMTP id HAA22148; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:29:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <341FBF24.1E60F44E@reborn.com> Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:29:40 -0400 From: Al Gardenghi Organization: The Baltimore Sun X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "beam@webconn.com" Subject: sig Apology X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: al@reborn.com From: al@reborn.com Subject: sig Apology PostedDate: 09/17/97 04:29:40 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 05:12:21 AM-09/17/97 05:12:22 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 05:12:22 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US It takes a big person to stand up and apologize..... Lets ALL stay Beamer friends...... I except your apology Jason ........ Now "everyone" back to the Beam.... Al ..... 73 til' later ****************** Romans 6:23 "For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." ****************** $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00433B60; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 05:14:21 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id FAA13782 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 05:02:17 -0700 Received: from timbuk.cray.com (timbuk-fddi.cray.com [128.162.8.102]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA15442 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:31:01 -0500 Received: from ironwood.cray.com (root@ironwood-fddi.cray.com [128.162.21.36]) by timbuk.cray.com (8.8.5/CRI-gate-news-1.3) with ESMTP id GAA15816; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:30:52 -0500 (CDT) Received: from esgi051.cray.com (esgi051 [128.162.105.161]) by ironwood.cray.com (8.8.4/CRI-ironwood-news-1.0) with ESMTP id GAA27153; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:30:51 -0500 (CDT) From: Mark Dalton Received: by esgi051.cray.com (8.8.0/btd-b3) id LAA16109; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 11:30:38 GMT Message-Id: <199709171130.LAA16109@esgi051.cray.com> Subject: Re: unsubscribing? To: robotman@mckennanet.com (Chuck McKenna) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:30:37 -0500 (CDT) Cc: beam@webconn.com In-Reply-To: <3.0.32.19970917064510.0092be40@atl.mindspring.com> from "Chuck McKenna" at Sep 17, 97 06:45:19 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24-CRI-d] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mwd@cray.com From: mwd@cray.com Subject: Re: unsubscribing? PostedDate: 09/17/97 04:30:37 AM SendTo: robotman@mckennanet.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 05:14:23 AM-09/17/97 05:14:24 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 05:14:24 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US > > If you are unhappy with the large number of these posted, maybe someone could periodically post Unsubscribe instructions to the list. > We have periodically about once per week had a message reminding people to send _ALL_ admin related questions and _ALL_ subscribe/Unsubscribe message to: beam-request@webconn.com Also this is Clearly explained on my WWW page, and on _everyones_ welcome message. Again do not send this to the list! Only to beam-request@webconn.com This will be eliminated once I get the newgroup setup. But these messages waste time.. Again _ALL_ admin type questions should _ONLY_ be sent to: beam-request@webconn.com This includes concerns about 'policing'.. hint, hint. Mark -- Mark Dalton CH3-S-CH2 H H O H SGI/Cray Research | | | \ | Eagan, MN 55121 CH2-C-COO //\ ---C--CH2-C-COO C-CH2-C-COO mwd@cray.com | | || || | // | NH3 \\/ \ / CH NH3 O NH3 NH My home page: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/mwd.html BEAM Robotics: http://www.webconn.com/~mwd/beam.html WWW Cell Bio. course: http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/cell.html $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.004A16AC; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:29:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id GAA13883 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 06:17:16 -0700 Received: from dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.10]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA15884 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:28:49 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id HAA17762 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:28:42 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:28:42 -0500 (CDT) Received: from whp-ny2-20.ix.netcom.com(199.183.44.84) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma017752; Wed Sep 17 07:28:13 1997 Message-Id: <2.2.16.19970917083502.34279d9a@popd.ix.netcom.com> X-Sender: mlerman@popd.ix.netcom.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (16) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: beam@webconn.com From: Mark Lerman Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars SMTPOriginator: mlerman@ix.netcom.com From: mlerman@ix.netcom.com Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars PostedDate: 09/17/97 05:28:42 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 06:29:26 AM-09/17/97 06:29:26 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 06:29:26 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Vantec (805 929-5055), a company in California makes incredible medium and high powered dual motor controllers that are perfect for radio controlled type robots. They plug into a rc receiver like servos and provide super control of speed, acceleration, steering, etc. They have built in microcontrollers that 'mix' the channels allowing pinpoint control. I know at least one Robotwars winner that uses this controller. It's biggest problem is its cost: $235 US for the least expensive. Mark Lerman At 12:42 AM 9/17/97 -0600, you wrote: >At 11:18 PM 9/16/1997 -0700, Randy Sargent wrote: >>La Machine's secret? What I saw was servos mechanically linked to >>switches. Makes it harder to control, but I think the on resistance beats >>any mosfet you'll find :-). > >Is true, but you can't argue that full proportional control for 9.2V with >only .004 Ohms resistance isn't that far off! I had looked at some relays >for my Sumobot too. Them suckers aren't cheap when you get to the 10+ amp >range - and LARGE too! > >Any idea what they did to surpress the sever arcing of Full Fwd to Full Rev >transitions? Or did they simply swap in new relays every match? > >Later, >Dave > > >-- >"Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, >that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only >2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com >Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com > > > $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.005296E0; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:02:05 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA14212 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:50:07 -0700 Received: from ccshst09.cs.uoguelph.ca (ccshst09.cs.uoguelph.ca [131.104.96.18]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA16366 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:39:23 -0500 Received: from ccshst01 (ccshst01.cs.uoguelph.ca) by ccshst09.cs.uoguelph.ca with SMTP (1.40.112.3/16.2) id AA005133486; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:38:06 -0400 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:38:04 -0400 (EDT) From: David M Barker X-Sender: dbarker@ccshst01 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: It speaks! Message-Id: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: dbarker@uoguelph.ca From: dbarker@uoguelph.ca Subject: It speaks! PostedDate: 09/17/97 06:38:04 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 08:02:15 AM-09/17/97 08:02:16 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 08:02:16 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Because it happenned to be lying on the bench, last night I hooked up a speaker to a microcore I have breadboarded. Actually I was hoping to get a better *visualization* of the process cycles (maybe just a different one). The result was kind of surprising. I wired the speaker off a doubled up 74als245 to up the current with the connection to one of the outputs of the microcore. I thought I would hear the pulse that went through that cap much in the same way that I see the LED light up. In fact I heard several *clicks* that concided with other LEDs around the loop lighting up. Also not all the clicks sounded the same, and their rhythm was not evenly spaced, as I would have expected nor did it stay the same, the sequence of clicks actually shifted in phase over time (if that makes sense) kind of like scrolling around the pattern but with a relatively long period. Has anybody tried this before and why aren't I getting one click every time the single process I've got going passes my output? I realize this is all very abstract and doesn't have much to do with making a robot live but there you go. Also, I'd like to thank Andrew and Richard for their help at the Toronto meeting last month. The walker is ambling about very happily, I just need to get a smaller battery pack so it's not leashed. Thanks guys. *------------------------------------------------------------------* Dr. David M. Barker ! How we spend our days is, Department of Zoology ! of course, how we spend our University of Guelph ! lives. What we do with this Guelph, Ontario, Canada ! hour, and that one, is what N1G 2W1 ! we are doing. Ph 519-824-4120 x3831 ! Annie Dillard FAX 519-767-1656 ! ! Remember, wherever you go, ! there you are. ! Buckaroo Banzai *-------------------------------------------------------------------* $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0052BAF7; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:03:38 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA14221 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:51:33 -0700 Received: from engmail.uwaterloo.ca (engmail.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.50.62]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA16462 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:48:05 -0500 Received: from [198.27.97.129] (eestaf78.watstar.uwaterloo.ca [129.97.27.198]) by engmail.uwaterloo.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA09524; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:48:43 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:47:46 EDT From: "ED Spike, E&CE Dept." Subject: Re: Projectile Cannon To: NeTKiLL78@aol.com cc: beam@webconn.com X-Warning: UNAuthenticated Sender In-Reply-To: <970916185712_1491201311@emout04.mail.aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII SMTPOriginator: SPIKE@EESTAFF.watstar.uwaterloo.ca From: SPIKE@EESTAFF.watstar.uwaterloo.ca Subject: Re: Projectile Cannon PostedDate: 09/17/97 06:47:46 AM SendTo: NeTKiLL78@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 08:03:48 AM-09/17/97 08:03:49 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 08:03:49 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Air cannon: We used a thick walled tube and fired ping-pong balls. A 10 ohm (half watt) resistor was put into the blanked off end of the tub with the ping-pong ball dropped in as the projectile. I believe we charged 1000 uF capacitor bank up to over 1000 volts. The capacitors were discharged throught the 10 ohm resistor. --- The resistors has to be replaced each time. Penny Cannon: A coil well secured on a tube with a copper penny just inside has been used in our high voltage laboratory. A bank of charged capacitors was connected across the coil. The penny could be heard "pinging" off the roof of the laborartory (22 feet high). -- The coil has to be held in place or it will fold itself inside out. I try this several times myself with just coils suspended with their own leads (18 gauge wire). --------------------------------------------------------------------- Ed Spike -----------0o0o.-------.o0o0---------------------------------------- ( ) ( ) $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.00531536; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:07:29 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA14245 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 07:55:21 -0700 Received: from slc-ns1.utah-inter.net (slc-ns1.utah-inter.net [206.107.178.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA16800 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:19:48 -0500 Received: from ns.utah-inter.net (RAY.utah-inter.net [206.107.179.174]) by slc-ns1.utah-inter.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0813 ID# 0-11875) with SMTP id AAA845; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:19:30 -0600 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:19:23 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCC342.67872820@rcox@usinfo.com> From: Ray Cox To: "'Andrew Vaughan'" , garrett myrick Cc: Brian Medendorp , "NeTKiLL78@aol.com" , "beam@webconn.com" Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:19:21 -0600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4025 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: rcox@usinfo.com From: rcox@usinfo.com Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/17/97 07:19:21 AM SendTo: tink@ix.net.au,gamyrick@linknet.kitsap.lib.wa.us CopyTo: medendob@LAHS.LosAlamos.K12.nm.us,NeTKiLL78@aol.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 08:07:32 AM-09/17/97 08:07:33 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 08:07:33 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Isn't that also--more or less--how a mag-lev train operates? The ones I've heard about running in Japan reach some pretty incredible speeds and never even touch the track. Ray Cox -----Original Message----- From: Andrew Vaughan [SMTP:tink@ix.net.au] Sent: Tuesday, September 16, 1997 11:05 PM To: garrett myrick Cc: Brian Medendorp; NeTKiLL78@aol.com; beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile At 19:48 16/09/97 -0700, garrett myrick wrote: >I can think of several uses for something like that... Could someone >please explain the concept a little better? well, the diagrams I've seen involve a tube lined with electromagnetic coils. A piece of metal is placed at one end, then the closest coil is magnetized. As the metal reaches that one, its turned off and the next one is turned on. Basically it progresses down the tube like that until it shoots out the end. I'll scan some pictures if you really want anyway, C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.005A5C6A; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:26:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA14655 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:14:59 -0700 Received: from judge.lis.net.au (judge.lis.net.au [203.35.83.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA16910 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:30:38 -0500 Received: from greg (juror01.lis.net.au [203.35.83.40]) by judge.lis.net.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id AAA01200 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:32:08 +1000 Message-ID: <341FE91A.E1F907C@lis.net.au> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:28:43 +1000 From: Greg Denehy Organization: AMD Web Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Beam Mailing List Subject: [Fwd: BEAM Solar Engine circuit help!] X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------A5E74D011ADC9E4942723D99" SMTPOriginator: gdenehy@lis.net.au From: gdenehy@lis.net.au Subject: [Fwd: BEAM Solar Engine circuit help!] PostedDate: 09/17/97 07:28:43 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 09:27:06 AM-09/17/97 09:27:07 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 09:27:07 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Message-ID: <341FE47A.FB4E4F56@lis.net.au> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:08:59 +1000 From: Greg Denehy Organization: AMD Web Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics. basics,sci.electronics,aus.electronics,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic Subject: BEAM Solar Engine circuit help! X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello. I am somehow having trouble with this most simple of all circuits. It is availiable at http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/beam.gif or attatched to this file. How do you get it to work!!!! With 3 small calculator cells (about 3V) wired in series or parralel, the voltage over the cap just gets up to about 1.5V then just sits there. It seems that the transistors are drawing more current than the cells can provide. If I connect a 3V battery instead of the cells, the motor runs fine. I reconfigured a different cell (0.5v 400mA) so that it gave out 4V (?mA) and the motor would squeak a couple of times a second, but didn't seem to have enough juice to get going. (This cell was quite large, and I see that it your diagrams that you are just using small cells) I am using a BC548B and a C557 transistor. The diode is a 1N4730. Various resistances tried. The base of the PNP always has some voltage on it, which I assume is why the current is leaking (through the motor?) What I don't understand is why it has this voltage. It is there even if the diode and resistor are disconnected. I am using small 3V motors from walkmans. Please help me, I have spent so many hours on such a simple circuit! $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.005B90BC; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:40:08 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA14773 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 09:28:09 -0700 Received: from quasar.newtonlabs.com (quasar.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.97]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA17543 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:31:58 -0500 Received: from bogomips.newtonlabs.com (rsargent@bogomips.newtonlabs.com [206.125.74.108]) by quasar.newtonlabs.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) with ESMTP id IAA02775; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:18:51 -0700 Received: (from rsargent@localhost) by bogomips.newtonlabs.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id IAA22029; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:18:49 -0700 Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 08:18:49 -0700 Message-Id: <199709171518.IAA22029@bogomips.newtonlabs.com> From: Randy Sargent To: Dave Hrynkiw cc: Randy Sargent cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars SMTPOriginator: rsargent@newtonlabs.com From: rsargent@newtonlabs.com Subject: Re: Unusual H-bridges from Robot Wars PostedDate: 09/17/97 08:18:49 AM SendTo: dave@solarbotics.com CopyTo: rsargent@newtonlabs.com,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 09:40:14 AM-09/17/97 09:40:15 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 09:40:15 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US From: Dave Hrynkiw > Is true, but you can't argue that full proportional control for 9.2V with > only .004 Ohms resistance isn't that far off! I had looked at some relays > for my Sumobot too. Them suckers aren't cheap when you get to the 10+ amp > range - and LARGE too! > > Any idea what they did to surpress the sever arcing of Full Fwd to Full Rev > transitions? Or did they simply swap in new relays every match? I think that's why they used servos connected to actual switches, rather than relays, because you can get switches rated at much higher voltage/current and that will therefore handle the arcing. I agree though that this approach is a far cry from proportional control! -- Randy ---------------------------------------------------------------- Randy Sargent Newton Research Labs Senior Design Engineer Robotic Systems and Software rsargent@newtonlabs.com http://www.newtonlabs.com/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0061DB40; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:48:51 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA15237 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:36:48 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA18037 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 11:31:47 -0500 Received: from sb2 (ts53ip146.cadvision.com [207.228.73.146]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id KAA134578; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:31:11 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.3.32.19970917102945.00aa4e70@wingate> X-Sender: skip#cadvision.com@wingate X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.3 (32) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:29:45 -0600 To: Greg Denehy , Beam Mailing List From: Dave Hrynkiw Subject: Re: [Fwd: Help with Solarengine circuit] In-Reply-To: <341FF7BE.507577F1@lis.net.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" SMTPOriginator: dave@solarbotics.com From: dave@solarbotics.com Subject: Re: [Fwd: Help with Solarengine circuit] PostedDate: 09/17/97 09:29:45 AM SendTo: gdenehy@lis.net.au,beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 10:48:52 AM-09/17/97 10:48:53 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 10:48:53 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 01:31 AM 9/18/1997 +1000, Greg Denehy wrote: >> Please help me, I have spent so many hours on such a simple circuit! >Please help me, I have spent so many hours on such a simple circuit! >Attachment Converted: "O:\ATTACH\beam.gif" Sure we can help, but you didn't have to email your msg twice and include that monster GIF file as an attachment. Anyways, it sounds like you're running into the "old" problem of leakage current thru the trigger diode. Replace it with a FLASHING LED, like you can buy at Radio Shack. Make sure you put it in Cathode-negative, as it *will* still run when installed backwards, but not as efficiently. Also, shield it with black tape or something else, as the FLEDS can be locked up by intense light. What's been happening in your circuit is that the solarcells can't quite make the diode trigger properly as there isn't enough current to do so. The FLED runs in an off/on state, which makes it more power efficient. Good luck, Dave -- "Um, no - that's H,R,Y,N,K,I,W. No, not K,I,U,U, K,I,_W_. Yes, that's right. Yes, I know it looks like "HOCKYRINK." Yup, only 2 vowels. Pronounciation? _SMITH_". EMAIL:dave@solarbotics.com Solarbotics http://www.solarbotics.com $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0063BF53; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 11:09:30 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id KAA15384 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:57:06 -0700 Received: from judge.lis.net.au (judge.lis.net.au [203.35.83.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA17571 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 10:33:30 -0500 Received: from greg (juror01.lis.net.au [203.35.83.40]) by judge.lis.net.au (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id BAA01833 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:34:35 +1000 Message-ID: <341FF7BE.507577F1@lis.net.au> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:31:10 +1000 From: Greg Denehy Organization: AMD Web Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Beam Mailing List Subject: [Fwd: Help with Solarengine circuit] X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------AC989ED821011EA6EC898BC7" $FILE: SMTPOriginator: gdenehy@lis.net.au From: gdenehy@lis.net.au Subject: [Fwd: Help with Solarengine circuit] PostedDate: 09/17/97 08:31:10 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 11:09:41 AM-09/17/97 11:09:42 AM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 11:09:42 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Greg Denehy wrote: > Hello. I am somehow having trouble with this most simple of all > circuits. > It is availiable at http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/beam.gif or > attatched to this file. > > How do you get it to work!!!! > > With 3 small calculator cells (about 3V) wired in series or parralel, > the voltage over the cap just gets up to about 1.5V then just sits > there. It seems that the transistors are drawing more current than > the > cells can provide. If I connect a 3V battery instead of the cells, > the > motor runs fine. I reconfigured a different cell (0.5v 400mA) so that > > it gave out 4V (?mA) and the motor would squeak a couple of times a > second, but didn't seem to have enough juice to get going. (This cell > > was quite large, and I see that it your diagrams that you are just > using > > small cells) I am using a BC548B and a C557 transistor. The diode > is > a 1N4730. Various resistances tried. > > The base of the PNP always has some voltage on it, which I assume is > why > > the current is leaking (through the motor?) What I don't understand > is > why it has this voltage. It is there even if the diode and resistor > are > > disconnected. > > I am using small 3V motors from walkmans. > > Please help me, I have spent so many hours on such a simple circuit! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > [Image] Message-ID: <341FF548.8ED456BC@lis.net.au> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:20:40 +1000 From: Greg Denehy Organization: AMD Web Services X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.0 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: sci.electronics.misc,sci.electronics. basics,sci.electronics,aus.electronics,alt.binaries.schematics.electronic Subject: Help with Solarengine circuit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------54CC2C6CB4D80220A3FECE56" Hello. I am somehow having trouble with this most simple of all circuits. It is availiable at http://www2.xtdl.com/~bushbo/beam/beam.gif or attatched to this file. How do you get it to work!!!! With 3 small calculator cells (about 3V) wired in series or parralel, the voltage over the cap just gets up to about 1.5V then just sits there. It seems that the transistors are drawing more current than the cells can provide. If I connect a 3V battery instead of the cells, the motor runs fine. I reconfigured a different cell (0.5v 400mA) so that it gave out 4V (?mA) and the motor would squeak a couple of times a second, but didn't seem to have enough juice to get going. (This cell was quite large, and I see that it your diagrams that you are just using small cells) I am using a BC548B and a C557 transistor. The diode is a 1N4730. Various resistances tried. The base of the PNP always has some voltage on it, which I assume is why the current is leaking (through the motor?) What I don't understand is why it has this voltage. It is there even if the diode and resistor are disconnected. I am using small 3V motors from walkmans. Please help me, I have spent so many hours on such a simple circuit! - beam.gif $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0073ABDF; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 14:03:26 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA16308 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 13:51:21 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emin25.mail.aol.com (emout37.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.29]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA19978 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 15:34:32 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emin25.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA28911; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:34:26 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:34:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970917162911_-1197249678@emout18.mail.aol.com> To: hyndmanm@cadvision.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/17/97 01:34:26 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 02:03:39 PM-09/17/97 02:03:40 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 02:03:40 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Well i'm not really planning on it, I was just reading some old mail about solenoid controlled walkers. Just popped in my head when I started thinkin about it! Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.0077684C; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 14:44:14 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id OAA16559 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 14:32:11 -0700 From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Received: from emout41.mail.aol.com (emout41.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.59]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id PAA20017 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 15:36:33 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout41.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id QAA14370; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:36:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:36:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970917163200_1162727411@emout04.mail.aol.com> To: hyndmanm@cadvision.com cc: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile SMTPOriginator: NeTKiLL78@aol.com From: NeTKiLL78@aol.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/17/97 01:36:27 PM SendTo: hyndmanm@cadvision.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 02:44:17 PM-09/17/97 02:44:18 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 02:44:18 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Well i'm not really planning on it, I was just reading some old mail about solenoid controlled walkers. Just popped in my head when I started thinkin about it! I'snt the same concept used in linear moters? Hmmm..... Maybe you could wire up some linears and attatch a leg or somethomg to it and add a moter behind it a make a neat little leg for a microcore. If this came twice sorry, pushed send too early! Kyle $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.007F9190; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:13:23 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA17163 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:01:25 -0700 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA21043 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 17:59:08 -0500 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id SgY13436; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:56:54 EDT To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile Message-ID: <19970917.182725.7807.2.nytwulf@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1,3,5-6,13-14,19 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Nyt wulf) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:56:54 EDT SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/17/97 03:56:54 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 04:13:31 PM-09/17/97 04:13:32 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 04:13:32 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:48:02 -0700 (PDT) garrett myrick writes: >> If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire >>a projectile at very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? >I can think of several uses for something like that... Could >someone please explain the concept a little better? reminds me of an idea i had back in the 8th grade for a toy in a model train set i wanted to build.. basicaly a 'car' ran along a track propelled by magnets.. the car would have a solar pannel just big enough to power an i.r. led and a cap big enough to hold it over through a tunnel.. but the led would signal the track where the car was and the track would build up a magnetic field that would lift and propell the car.. i later discovered it was already invented in france :P back to the subject.. if you want to see how the solenoid thing would work.. borrow a sock (if you dont want to use yours) and place a marble or other such thing in it and push it along by squeezing the sock right behind it. now think of a bunch of fingers along the whole line of it all squeezing at just the right moment to push it along... $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256515.007F9A79; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:13:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id QAA17166 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 16:01:47 -0700 Received: from x15.boston.juno.com (x15.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.28]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA21037 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 17:58:19 -0500 Received: (from nytwulf@juno.com) by x15.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id SgW13436; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:56:53 EDT To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile Message-ID: <19970917.182725.7807.0.nytwulf@juno.com> References: <970916185712_1491201311@emout04.mail.aol.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.38 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0-3,5 From: nytwulf@juno.com (Nyt wulf) Date: Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:56:53 EDT SMTPOriginator: nytwulf@juno.com From: nytwulf@juno.com Subject: Re: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 09/17/97 03:56:53 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 04:13:50 PM-09/17/97 04:13:52 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 04:13:52 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US On Tue, 16 Sep 1997 19:02:47 -0400 (EDT) NeTKiLL78@aol.com writes: >If you place the solenoids on a tube you could probably fire a >projectile at very high speeds. Is this theory plausible? sounds similar to how a maglev train works.. and some rolercoasters work on a similar principal $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.00079377; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:22:45 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id SAA17741 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 18:10:46 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA21971 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 20:05:29 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m021.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.230]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id LAA23395; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 11:00:24 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19960818010551.006e80ec@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 18 Aug 1996 11:05:51 +1000 To: Ray Cox From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile Cc: SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: RE: Solenoid Projectile PostedDate: 08/17/96 06:05:51 PM SendTo: rcox@usinfo.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 06:22:48 PM-09/17/97 06:22:49 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 06:22:50 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 08:19 17/09/97 -0600, Ray Cox wrote: >Isn't that also--more or less--how a mag-lev train operates? The ones I've >heard about running in Japan reach some pretty incredible speeds and never >even touch the track. pretty much, although the diagrams I've seen of mag-lev trains, it looks like the magnetic propulsion is actually in the train. Basically if generates a magnetic field which holds it above the permanent magnets in the track. It moves by manipulating the polarity (or similar concept) of the electromagnet in the train. The rail gun method is often used in science fiction. Remember the trans pacific train in SeaQuest DSV? That was a combination of rail gun technology and a vacuum. Virtually no friction! Cool, hey! :) C'ya Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.001E71DA; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 22:32:32 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id WAA18395 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 22:20:28 -0700 From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Received: from emout20.mail.aol.com (emout20.mx.aol.com [198.81.11.46]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA23452 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:14:08 -0500 Received: (from root@localhost) by emout20.mail.aol.com (8.7.6/8.7.3/AOL-2.0.0) id BAA13320 for beam@webconn.com; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:13:59 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:13:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <970918010915_404696626@emout20.mail.aol.com> To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Solenoid projected sattelites? SMTPOriginator: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Xx1101xX@aol.com Subject: Solenoid projected sattelites? PostedDate: 09/17/97 10:13:59 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 10:32:40 PM-09/17/97 10:32:40 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 10:32:40 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US This has a tad to do with BEAM...NASA is looking into smaller and cheaper spacecraft(of course).....some of the current designs are very small... They will be launched in large numbers to cut back on failure rates(if a few fail...ya still got a hundred or so left)...if a "rail gun" or solenoid-employing projector can be made to toss these puppys up...there ya go!...They are very light...and very compact...I guess it ultimately depends upon how tough these mini sattelites are,and how fast the "gun" can accelerate them.... (they will most likely be powered by solar means,because of their small size...and I'm assuming,low power requirements) If I went off on a tangent...I'm sorry,I tend to do that.... Xx1101xX@aol.com Jason Courter $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.0023DE2A; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:31:46 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA18511 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:19:41 -0700 Received: from huey.cadvision.com (huey2.cadvision.com [207.228.64.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA23918 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:18:26 -0500 Received: from ts64ip38.cadvision.com (ts64ip38.cadvision.com [207.228.75.38]) by huey.cadvision.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/DCE/TRI) with SMTP id AAA82792; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:17:51 -0600 Received: by ts64ip38.cadvision.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BCC3C6.CAE864E0@ts64ip38.cadvision.com>; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:07:03 -0600 Message-ID: <01BCC3C6.CAE864E0@ts64ip38.cadvision.com> From: Hyndman To: "'Xx1101xX@aol.com'" Cc: "'beam@webconn.com'" Subject: RE: Solenoid projected sattelites? Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 00:07:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable SMTPOriginator: hyndmanm@cadvision.com From: hyndmanm@cadvision.com Subject: RE: Solenoid projected sattelites? PostedDate: 09/17/97 11:07:01 PM SendTo: Xx1101xX@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 11:31:55 PM-09/17/97 11:31:55 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 11:31:55 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Solenoids are not what their using, they're using satalights with magnets on them, and then charging an electronic magnet behind them, causing the magnets to oppose...moving the blah...With electronic magnets you can make things go almost the speed of light (Atoms, particle accelerator)... Devin -----Original Message----- From: Xx1101xX@aol.com [SMTP:Xx1101xX@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 17, 1997 11:14 PM To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Solenoid projected sattelites? This has a tad to do with BEAM...NASA is looking into smaller and cheaper spacecraft(of course).....some of the current designs are very small... They will be launched in large numbers to cut back on failure rates(if a few fail...ya still got a hundred or so left)...if a "rail gun" or solenoid-employing projector can be made to toss these puppys up...there ya go!...They are very light...and very compact...I guess it ultimately depends upon how tough these mini sattelites are,and how fast the "gun" can accelerate them.... (they will most likely be powered by solar means,because of their small size...and I'm assuming,low power requirements) If I went off on a tangent...I'm sorry,I tend to do that.... Xx1101xX@aol.com Jason Courter $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.0024EBF4; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:43:17 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA18534 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:31:08 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA24053 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:31:12 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m046.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.205]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA27704; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 16:25:59 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970918063118.006cc6d0@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 16:31:18 +1000 To: Xx1101xX@aol.com From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: Re: Solenoid projected sattelites? Cc: beam@webconn.com SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: Re: Solenoid projected sattelites? PostedDate: 09/17/97 11:31:18 PM SendTo: Xx1101xX@aol.com CopyTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 11:43:29 PM-09/17/97 11:43:30 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 11:43:30 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US At 01:13 18/09/97 -0400, Xx1101xX@aol.com wrote: > This has a tad to do with BEAM...NASA is looking into smaller and cheaper >spacecraft(of course).....some of the current designs are very small... >They will be launched in large numbers to cut back on failure rates(if a few >fail...ya still got a hundred or so left)...if a "rail gun" or >solenoid-employing projector can be made to toss these puppys up...there ya >go!...They are very light...and very compact...I guess it ultimately depends >upon how tough these mini sattelites are,and >how fast the "gun" can accelerate them.... >(they will most likely be powered by solar means,because of their small >size...and I'm assuming,low power requirements) >If I went off on a tangent...I'm sorry,I tend to do that.... I first saw the rail gun idea proposed as a method of launching ore from a mining base on the Moon. It was some book printed in 1979 apparently, the theory was that because there's no atmosphere it would get REALLY fast extremely easily and launch it into an earth orbit Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.00262D4C; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:56:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA18546 for ; Wed, 17 Sep 1997 23:44:55 -0700 Received: from ns1.ix.net.au (ns1.ix.net.au [203.33.239.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA24099 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 01:33:54 -0500 Received: from andrewvo (m046.dialup.ix.net.au [203.76.2.205]) by ns1.ix.net.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA27746 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 16:28:51 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19970918063410.006cd6f8@ix.net.au> X-Sender: tink@ix.net.au X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 16:34:10 +1000 To: beam@webconn.com From: Andrew Vaughan Subject: web ring SMTPOriginator: tink@ix.net.au From: tink@ix.net.au Subject: web ring PostedDate: 09/17/97 11:34:10 PM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/17/97 11:57:05 PM-09/17/97 11:57:05 PM DeliveredDate: 09/17/97 11:57:05 PM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US alright everybody the web ring homepage has moved permanently to http://www.ix.net.au/~tink/beam/ this is because my UNIX account at the University will no doubt change at the end of the year. So come on people, start using it! I've had to move my personal page! Anyway, thanks Andrew Vaughan http://athene.mit.csu.edu.au/~avaugh02/ $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.00500D03; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 07:34:22 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id HAA19127 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 07:22:22 -0700 Received: from rapidnet.com (ns1.rapidnet.com [205.164.216.1]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA26142 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 08:22:22 -0500 Received: from dell (pt1-16.rapidnet.com [206.150.191.175]) by rapidnet.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA25673 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 07:22:01 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <34212B69.29D9@rapidnet.com> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:23:53 -0400 From: Michael Joyce Reply-To: mikejjs@rapidnet.com Organization: JJS Software X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: Re: Solenoid projected sattelites? References: <1.5.4.32.19970918063118.006cc6d0@ix.net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: mikejjs@rapidnet.com From: mikejjs@rapidnet.com Subject: Re: Solenoid projected sattelites? PostedDate: 09/18/97 06:23:53 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com ReplyTo: mikejjs@rapidnet.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/18/97 07:34:28 AM-09/18/97 07:34:29 AM DeliveredDate: 09/18/97 07:34:29 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Andrew Vaughan wrote: > > At 01:13 18/09/97 -0400, Xx1101xX@aol.com wrote: > > This has a tad to do with BEAM...NASA is looking into smaller and cheaper > >spacecraft(of course).....some of the current designs are very small... > >They will be launched in large numbers to cut back on failure rates(if a few > >fail...ya still got a hundred or so left)...if a "rail gun" or > >solenoid-employing projector can be made to toss these puppys up...there ya > >go!...They are very light...and very compact...I guess it ultimately depends > >upon how tough these mini sattelites are,and > >how fast the "gun" can accelerate them.... > >(they will most likely be powered by solar means,because of their small > >size...and I'm assuming,low power requirements) > >If I went off on a tangent...I'm sorry,I tend to do that.... > > I first saw the rail gun idea proposed as a method of launching ore from a > mining base on the Moon. It was some book printed in 1979 > apparently, the theory was that because there's no atmosphere it would get > REALLY fast extremely easily and launch it into an earth orbit As far as I know, given enough juice it's possible to accelerate an object to escape velocity. The problem is very few objects can survive traveling at escape velocity through our atmosphere. But it might make a nice 4th of July display! Mike $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.005B1DB8; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:35:13 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA19660 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:23:13 -0700 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu [129.130.99.129]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA26867 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 10:15:34 -0500 Received: from fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu (8.8.4/8.8.4) with SMTP id KAA08400 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 10:19:35 -0500 Sender: dwhall@fmfs.reshall.ksu.edu Message-ID: <34214687.4BA0AE@ksu.edu> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 10:19:35 -0500 From: Dean Hall Organization: EGM Design X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; Linux 2.0.27 i586) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: beam@webconn.com Subject: New sanyo power solar cells Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: dwhall@ksu.edu From: dwhall@ksu.edu Subject: New sanyo power solar cells PostedDate: 09/18/97 08:19:35 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/18/97 09:35:14 AM-09/18/97 09:35:15 AM DeliveredDate: 09/18/97 09:35:15 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello, Front page of my CNN custom news mentions sanyo's new Heterojunction with Intrinsic Thin Layer (HIT) type solar cells reaching 17.3% efficiency. These are the big power cells. I'm wondering, do the small cells get that %eff, or is this something we should be praying will trickle-down? Here's a two sentence clip: The cells use a Heterojunction with Intrinsic Thin Layer (HIT) type solar cell, a hybrid that is made up of a thin single crystal silicon wafer surrounded by layers of ultra-thin amorphous silicon. ... The entire solar module, with the HIT cells, has a module efficiency of 15.2-percent, another world best, it claimed. Maximum output of each module is 180 watts. !!Dean $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.005B7821; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:39:05 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id JAA19678 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:27:02 -0700 Received: from host.ott.igs.net (host.ott.igs.net [206.248.16.2]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA26708 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:52:45 -0500 Received: from semicon.semiconductor.com (semicon.semiconductor.com [206.248.18.27]) by host.ott.igs.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA18342 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 10:52:26 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199709181452.KAA18342@host.ott.igs.net> Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 11:12:00 -0400 From: Thomas Kapler Subject: motor question To: BEAM X-Mailer: Worldtalk (NetConnex V3.50b)/MIME SMTPOriginator: thomas@semiconductor.com From: thomas@semiconductor.com Subject: motor question PostedDate: 09/18/97 08:12:00 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/18/97 09:39:09 AM-09/18/97 09:39:10 AM DeliveredDate: 09/18/97 09:39:10 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Hello, I finally managed to get some gear assemblies and motors from Active Surplus in Toronto. The gears work quite well - it's a timer assembly similar to the oven timer units, only a bit bigger. It's pretty easy to remove the springs and hook it up to a motor. It's the motors that are a problem. I've got a few, but they're not very efficient. At 2.7 volts, they draw almost 140 mA of current, and this is too much to handle for a 245 driver. Can anyone please suggest an alternate method of interfacing the microcore with the motors? This is my first walker, and I was planning to use batteries anyway. thank you, Thomas Kapler. $AdditionalHeaders: Received: from dl.com by Athena.dl.com (Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) with SMTP id 88256516.006410FE; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 11:12:59 -0700 Received: from gromit.webconn.com (root@gromit.webconn.com [206.42.142.5]) by dl.com (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id LAA20273 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 11:00:49 -0700 Received: from vision.ee.calpoly.edu (vision.ee.calpoly.edu [129.65.26.115]) by gromit.webconn.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA27567 for ; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 11:49:46 -0500 Received: (from jcline@localhost) by vision.ee.calpoly.edu (8.6.10/ELEE) id JAA03778 for beam@webconn.com; Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:49:34 -0700 From: Jonathan Message-Id: <199709181649.JAA03778@vision.ee.calpoly.edu> Subject: BEAM Discussion List URL collection To: beam@webconn.com Date: Thu, 18 Sep 1997 09:49:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit SMTPOriginator: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu From: jcline@vision.ee.calpoly.edu Subject: BEAM Discussion List URL collection PostedDate: 09/18/97 09:49:34 AM SendTo: beam@webconn.com $UpdatedBy: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US,CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteServers: CN=Athena/O=DLNOTES/C=US RouteTimes: 09/18/97 11:13:07 AM-09/18/97 11:13:07 AM DeliveredDate: 09/18/97 11:13:07 AM Categories: $Revisions: BlindCopyTo: CN=Laurence Mayer/O=DLNOTES/C=US Like I mentioned previously, my list of URL's grabbed off this e-mail list is going strong. In light of the recent requests for links I'll go ahead and post it here. Everyone's web pages are incredible, considering the general lack of any amateur robot info on the 'net only a few years ago! This list is at http://www.ee.calpoly.edu/~jcline/beam-links.htm The links are generated by a Perl program I wrote which spies on this discussion list. To add a link, you can email me, or mention it on this list, or add it on the page. There are 162 links here! UNOFFICIAL LINKS FROM BEAM ROBOTICS EMAIL DIGEST Updated on Mon Sep 15 17:27:16 PDT 1997 * Biologically-based Robots at http://brl.ee.washington.edu/BRL/bbr.html * Autonomous Underwater Vehicle Information at http://bronte.umcs.maine.edu/auv-page.html * Unmanned Underwater Vehicle Project at http://cimar.me.ufl.edu/~asme/contests/uuv.html * The requested URL was not found at http://digiserv.com/takdesign/pic-faq/publinks/publinks.htm * [Untitled, 896 lines] at http://ee.cityu.edu.hk/~rtbrad/micromouse.html * CSULB MicroMouse Home Page at http://heart.engr.csulb.edu/studorgs/micromouse/index.html * Beginners' PIC page at http://hobbes.king.ac.uk:80/matt/pic * The Atacama Desert Trek at http://img.arc.nasa.gov/Nomad * Happyworldland at http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob/dynamic * Robotics: The C.A.R project at http://lahs.losalamos.k12.nm.us/~medendob/robotics * [Untitled, 223 lines] at http://lcs.www.media.mit.edu/groups/el/projects/handy-board/misc/f redm423.txt * WWW Cell Biology Course at http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/cell.html * Mark Dalton's Home Page at http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/mwd.html * Marks Robotics Home Page at http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/robot.html * On-line Magazines, Journals and suppliers at http://lenti.med.umn.edu/~mwd/robot/resource.html * A Beginning BEAM Robotics Web Site at http://members.aol.com/imivar/homepage.htm * A Beginning BEAM Robotics Web Site at http://members.aol.com/imivar/microfaq.htm * Pictures of an Oven Timer at http://members.aol.com/robmaier * Pictures of an Oven Timer at http://members.aol.com/robmaier/index.html * The 6 th International BEAM Robotic Games at http://members.tripod.com/~biru/CMS2.html * CMS1 at http://members.tripod.com/~biru/cms.html * Aerodynamics of Animals - Marine Life - instructor at http://muttley.ucdavis.edu/Book/Animals/instructor/marine-01.html * 404 Not Found at http://nis-www.lanl.gov/robot/events.html * A Potential Maze Solving Algorithm for a Micromouse Robot at http://nyquist.ee.ualberta.ca/~wyard/pacrim.html * HTML document for the World Wide Web at http://ogun.stanford.edu/~bnayfeh/mazealgo.html * USCAE - Swimming and flying in nature at http://ostrich.usc.edu/rsg/bfd/biofluid_index.html * M & T Systems at http://pw2.netcom.com/~mandtsys/robots.html * NiCd Batteries at http://pw2.netcom.com/~mandtsys/robots/nicd.html * Automated Walking Vehicle at http://real.uwaterloo.ca:80/~robot * Autonmous Under Water Vehicles Lab at MIT Sea Grant (under construction) at http://seagrant.mit.edu/~auvlab * BEAM ROBOTICS at http://sst.lanl.gov/robot * 404 Not Found at http://sst.lanl.gov/robot/micromouse_rules.html * Robotic Insects at Discovery World Museum at http://tesla.braintools.org/insect.html * Down to the Sea in Robots at http://web.mit.edu/afs/athena/org/t/techreview/www/articles/oct94/ searobot.html * RoboTuna at http://web.mit.edu/afs/athena/org/t/towtank/www/tuna * Autonomous Underwater Vehicles Resources at http://www.acim.usl.edu/~maja/AUV/AUV-list.html * Mobile Robots at http://www.ai.mit.edu/people/anita/book.html * Boadicea - A small, pneumatic walking robot at http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/boadicea/boadicea.html * The Rockettes: 10-Gram Microrovers for Mars at http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/mars-rovers/rockettes.html * Mobile Robot Research at the MIT AI Laboratory at http://www.ai.mit.edu/projects/mobile-robots * The Art of Electronics at http://www.artofelectronics.com * Lightweight RC at http://www.astro.su.se/~daniel/radio.html * TTS '96 - Automatic UXO Detection Using Robots at http://www.atc.army.mil/~tecom/tts/proceed/biomorph.html * Underwater photo of stingray off Ambergris Caye, Belize at http://www.belize.com/ray1.html * Underwater Photo of Sting Ray off Ambergris Caye, Belize at http://www.belize.com/ray2.html * Eric's PIC Page at http://www.brouhaha.com/~eric/pic/index.html * BUFFALO HAMFEST - SEPT. 20, 1997 at http://www.buffalohamfest.org/buffalo.asp * TheUniversity of Rochester's Micro Mouse Robot at http://www.ceas.rochester.edu:8080/ee/users/weisberg/mouse.html * CRANFIELD AUV (Autonomous Underwater Vehicle) at http://www.cranfield.ac.uk/sims/marine/sea/auv.htm * NPS Center for AUV Research at http://www.cs.nps.navy.mil/research/auv/auv.html * [Untitled, 170 lines] at http://www.cs.uwa.edu.au/~mafm/robot/PWM.html * MOSFET H-Bridge Schematic & Theory of Operation at http://www.cs.uwa.edu.au/~mafm/robot/blanch-h-bridge.html * [Untitled, 688 lines] at http://www.cs.uwa.edu.au/~mafm/robot/h-bridge.html * 404 File Not Found at http://www.cuug.ab.ca:8001/~hrynkiwd/images/hirez/mb_3.gif * 404 File Not Found at http://www.cuug.ab.ca:8001/~hrynkiwd/index.html * McConville Enterprises at http://www.cyberbundle.net * Digi-Key Corporation Home Page at http://www.digikey.com * [Untitled, 608 lines] at http://www.droids.engsoc.carleton.ca/text/stepping * Dick Smith Electronics - Welcome at http://www.dse.com.au * Scott's CyberNiche at http://www.earthlink.net/~srandress * UC Davis Micro Mouse -- what's a mouse? at http://www.ece.ucdavis.edu/umouse/object.html * Micromouse Page of Sairo at http://www.ece.utexas.edu/~jchoi/micromouse.html * [Untitled, 53 lines] at http://www.ee.cit.ac.nz/~b_provo/Mechatron/BEAM/plans.txt * WSU Micro Mouse at http://www.eecs.wsu.edu/~ieee/mouse/index.html * HOT DEALS GADGETS at http://www.eio.com/gadgets.htm * NOMAD: El vagabundo del desierto at http://www.entelchile.net/Nomad * EurekAlert! Public Contents at http://www.eurekalert.org * Roganti's Robotics Zone: Main menu at http://www.euronet.nl/users/ragman/robotics.html * The Bryan Rittmeyer Hobby Robotics Web Site at http://www.flash.net/~bryanr/robot.html * [Untitled, 0 lines] at http://www.frasco.demon.co.uk * [Untitled, 0 lines] at http://www.frasco.demon.co.uk/rodney/mechan/design.htm * A Beginning BEAM Robotics Web Site/FAQ at http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/9879/microfaq.htm * A Beginning BEAM Robotics Home Page at http://www.geocities.com/researchtriangle/9879/homepage.htm * AM Innovations title page at http://www.golden.net/~amiller * [Untitled, 81 lines] at http://www.golden.net/~amiller/Microcore.htm * [Untitled, 28 lines] at http://www.golden.net/~amiller/beam.htm * [Untitled, 15 lines] at http://www.golden.net/~amiller/hswitch.gif * [Untitled, 395 lines] at http://www.golden.net/~amiller/nvmove.htm\ * [Untitled, 119 lines] at http://www.golden.net/~amiller/what.htm * Seat