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(Total activity, all pages, all sites, in page reloads, since 9/21/2000)
(12-17-98)
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i believe in Gods existance.... actually from a Hindu perspective.. it is a great error to speak of Gods existence.. since God is the source of existence and non-being..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "but.. I understand what you ask..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "so.. to speak of Gods existence.. is to place God within duality.. and thereby diminish Gods majesty..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "thomas jefferson once wrote in a letter to a friend..."Just as no two people have the same face... so .. no two people have the same beliefs...""
Om_Namah_Shivaya Since Hinduism and Buddhism were well established during the lifetime of Jesus... and since Jesus is believed to be God, and therefore, omniscient, knowing all future events, then why is there not one single mention of Buddhism or Hinduism ... or their alleged falsehood... in any of the Gospels... since there is much mention and warning of false teachers, and deception in the last times?
(Holy says... You need a history lesson.. OM)
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im listening holy... why dont you give me one..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im still listeneng.. I would appreciate verse references from new testament which mention the evils of hinduism and buddhism..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes... but holy... since God is omniscient... and since the verses of the new testement are divinely inspired by God.. why no mention of the false teachings of buddhism and hinduism... in the new testament.. when many things are said about the false teachers of the last times...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "so... what are the verse numbers in the book of Acts.. that address all these issues..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "such a ridiculous statement..... people have found time to read all of the old testament.. apocrypha... new testament... and thousands of different kinds of philosophy and theology books..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "hold on.. im taking a look at acts 16:6"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "hmmm... very interesting passage.. acts verse 16:6... very interesting indeed" ... says Paul was about to enter and preach in India.. but the Holy Spirit forbade him.
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "ok ... but consider this following point carefully..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya .Since God has Omniscient foreknowledge of all future events, if TRUE DOCTRINE were so important, then... God, foreknowing the various disputes regarding Trinity, or Christ's Divinity, or Purgatory, or Transubstantiation... God would have inspired additional, more detailed scriptural verses, to elimnate doubts and disputes on key doctrines.
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "there.. forgetting about hinduism and buddhism.. what about disputes on trinity.. eucharist.. purgatory..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "if God cares deeply about doctrinal correctness.... then why no clarifications"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes... that is a good point.. people might disagree no matter what was said.. in fact.. im sure they would..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "if there were a dozen passages in the new testament.. where Jesus came right out and said... "I am God.. and God is a Holy Trinity... Father Son and Spirit... trine-unity...."... that would clear up many arguments about trinity...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes... human intelligence is limited and finite.. and God is infinite.. so .. just as Isaiah says... "As high as heaven is from earth.. so far are My ways from your ways.. my mind from your mind..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya .The past 2000 years shows that Christian and Islamic peoples are no more moral or ethical or loving or peaceful that Hindus/ Buddhist. In light of German Jewish Holocaust, Spanish Inquisition, conquests of North & So. American Indians, the rise of Communism, the African slave trade, witch burnings, and Islamic conquests... Christian and Islamic peoples are considerably less nice than Hindu and Buddhist peoples.
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes... but st. paul claims that christianity transforms people.. hinduism makes no such claim... that is my point.. Paul and epistle of Romans"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "the new testament says.. a tree is known by its fruits.. I am simply pointing out that in 2000 years.. christian peoples have been the least noticible in producing "christian fruits""
snorked says, "to be a hindu is to be born into it. very nice if you're a brahmin, I suppose. not so nice if you're untouchable"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i am a white guy.. blond blue eyed.. raised in no religion by nominally protestant parents.. who converted to greek orthodox xtianity at age 23.. spent 2 yrs in a monastery.. and 17 yrs as an enthusiastic layperson... before... disillusionment set in"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and.. my parents never brought me inside a church even once.. forgot to mention that"
(someone starts saying how evil jews are)
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "jews are much nicer than most christians I know..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "at least they dont attack everyone.. and condemn everyone to eternal torment..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "the only demons I really know of.. or believe in.. are the christians..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "their religion invented hell and satan.. and they are the only ones who constantly talk about it..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "if jews are communists.. how come only jews were allowed to escape from russia during the 1970's.... if they were communists.. why would they have wanted to leave russia>>>????"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "there are only 17 million jews in the entire world.. they cant be some great.. secret conspiracy force..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and.... reform jews.. are totally different from conservative jews.. which are totally different from orthodox.. who are all totally different from Lubavitcher jews...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and a huge number of people who are of jewish ancestry are not religious at all.. they are avowed atheists...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "or agnostics..... mm1963.. you are just another brainless paranoid anti-semitic person.. so I am putting you on ignore.. so I wont waste my time seeing your ignorant remarks" (sexy lady says she dances "skyclad"... i.e. naked)
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "lady.. are you familiar with Jain theology???"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "ladyvix... are you familiar with JAIN theology??"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes... where did you learn the word "skyclad"???"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "ladyvix.... where did you learn the word "skyclad""
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes.. but what is significan... St. Paul claims in Romans.. that Christianity somehow TRANSFORMS people.. which 2000 years of history have obviously proved false..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "ladyvixen... where did you learn the word "skyclad".. that refers to a Jain religious sect...???"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "oh... in wicca .. you learned "skyclad""
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i know what it means.. but.. it is a Jain religious term.. thats why I ask"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "it is a religion which existed at the time of sidharth gautama 600 bc.. (the historical buddha).. their "buddha" whas Mahavira... which means "great man".. and Jain means ... "victorious""
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "actually.. the oldest longest continuously practiced religions in the world are Jain and Shivite... an its a toss-up.. which is older..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "but both have a shiva-like figure in yogic meditation posture.... the jains and shivites"
rahul248001 says, "Sorry OM , Hinduism cannot even be given a date of commence"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i put mm1963 on ignore a long time ago.. I have no use for anti-semitism"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im just quoting what the archeologists and paleontologists say.. based on jain and shivite religious figures.... and what Ninian Smart says in his texbooks on world religions"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i realize that vedic religion goes to far back in antiquity to date it"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "actually.. I have a URL to a Jain historical time line which attempts to date various Jain/Hindu/Buddhist scriptures and events..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "let me find the URL..."
rahul248001 says, "remember MAHAVIR WAS a HINDU before he started JAINISM, but i,m not hinting at anything controvercial"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "here is the URL for the Jain Historical time-line outline of history -> http://www.cs.colostate.edu/~malaiya/jainhout1.html"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i know for certain that sidhartha gautama was hindu... but.. im not at all certain about mahavira..."
rahul248001 says, "who"
rahul248001 says, "he was OM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul... you arnt seriously asking me WHO sidhartha gautama is .. I hope"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul.. do you know WHO sidhartha gautama is...???"
rahul248001 says, "YES , please"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul... are you ASKING me to tell you who sidhartha gautama is????"
rahul248001 says, "YES , please"
rahul248001 says, "Disagrees with MM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "ok... look.. sidhartha gautama (of the shakya clan.. called Shakyamuni).. is the historical founder of Buddhism...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i think perhaps rahul.. you are confusing buddha with mahavira..."
rahul248001 says, "NO no OM I am not I too live in INDIA"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "if you dont know the name sidhartha gautama, rahul.. that is like discussing hinduism .. and not knowing the name of Shankaracharya... I am inclined to take anything you say now with a grain of salt..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i dont want to hurt your feelings. but your ignorance is too overwhelming.. to take anything you say seriously...."
rahul248001 says, "I know Gautam , Mahavir, Sankracharya et all, OM ,"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i do have some history books of Jain religion here. and I will look up mahavira now... just to see what is said..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "well. you sure didnt know sidhartha gautama a minute ago!!!"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "hmmm... ok here is Jain Philosophy..Historical Outline by Narendra Nath Bhattacharyya"
rahul248001 says, "I know Jews enough to like them"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and... I am looking at the biography of Mahavira"
rahul248001 says, "They Withstood the cruelty of Nazis, arabs and people like u MM to come up VICTORIOUS again MM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and it does mention one set of legends which contend that Mahavira was conceived in the womb of a Brahmin woman.. but Lord Indra transfered the embryo to another womb.. knowing that it would become a Tirthamkara"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "his original name was Vardhamana (meaning "increase")"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "it says as a child of eight , he took the twelve vows prescibed for a jain layman... I is not mentioning his taking the sacred thread..."
rahul248001 says, "Brahmin women, a HINDU I believe, OM"
rahul248001 says, "Do u call yourself a HINDU or a JAIN , OM???????"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "well.. there is one legend mentioned.. asserting that he was conceived in the womb of a brahmin woman.. as I said. but that Lord indra transfered the embryo.. but there is no mention of a Hindu upbringing.. or sacred thread ceremony...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "there doesnt seem to be anything in Jain tradition to assert that Mahavira EMBRACED hindu beliefs. ... but at some point rejected them... as seems to be asserted concerning Sidhartha Gautama..."
rahul248001 says, "OM , tell me why my friends who r jains call themselves HINDU"
rahul248001 says, "HIndu as WELL"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and certainly.. Mahavira is considered to be the 24th Tirthamkara.. which means there was an established.. lineage.. or tradition... if you will... his predecessor Parsva was the 23rd Tirthamkara... by contrast Sidhartha is portrayed as the first Buddha... Awakened One...."
Crow71_98 says, "*watching Om's posts with interest... educational... *"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "what can I tell you .... im a poor white man in booklyn... with a few books by Jain scholars.. I can only tell you what I read in my books..."
MerryMerryQuiteContrary says, "Crow - always from Om - he is very well versed in his traditions"
rahul248001 says, "ITS like ARYASAMAGIS they r hindu but dont follow HINDU rituals laid down by BRAHMINS"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i just have a bunch of books.. thats all. but.. they are very good books... very reliable...."
rahul248001 says, "ITS like the Congress telling the SIKHS that they arnt part of HINDUISM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im looking up VEDIC RELIGION in the Jain history book now.. lets see what it says..."
rahul248001 says, "trying to create a divide"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "actually.. it is amusing.. last week in chat.. I met a young woman who described herself as "a Jain/Hindu"... or "hindu/jain" (i forget)"
rahul248001 says, "THat,s exactly the point OM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and of course.. the Rhadasuoami Sikhs have a distinctly Hindu flavor.. and are rejected by other members of the Sikh Panth..."
rahul248001 says, "Hinduism has given birth to three religions"
rahul248001 says, "Never believed in CONVERTING"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im looking to see if this Jain text... considers the Vedas to be sacred texts..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i would think if the Jains do not consider Vedas sacred.. that it would be inaccurate to call them Hindus..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "much nicer that arguing with christians.. I might add.. and now to look at the history of postings"
rahul248001 says, "PLEASE do OM , or i,ve wasted my time"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "well.. I have looked back at some of the postings... as for myself.. I am just a white man in brooklyn who reads Tulsidas and worships Moortys.... and reads Gita.. what can I say... I am waiting for my next birth..."
rahul248001 says, "who and where r u Om"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i see what you are saying Rahul..... I hear Jains describing themselves as Hindu.. and I always feel like im with hindus when I talk with pious Sikhs.... but.. I dont see anything in Jain literatures.. so far.. asserting that Mahavira was hindu.... not in the sense that Sidhartha Gautama was hindu..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "no one would be more tempted than I to assert that all things flow from the primordial source of Vedic religion...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul.. you initially thru me for a loop when you asked "who is sidhartha gautama"..."
rahul248001 says, "who r u and where from, OM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im in brooklyn ny.. you can look at my website.. but.. im just a white man who has been attending a guyanese hindu mandir in brooklyn for six years..."
rahul248001 says, "sorry , dident mean to do that"
rahul248001 says, "really OM, what made u do that"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "click here to see my website on my experiences and thoughts concerning hinduism and religion -> http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Atlantis/3425/index.html"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "if you look at my website.. there are more than 200 pages there.. click on INDEX OF PAGES to see everything..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and you will know all about my thoughts and experiences... for whatever its worth.."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "well.... I was raised with no religion by nominally protestant parents.. of dutch ancestry.. who never took me to church once..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "so.. I began exploring religions as a teenager..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i think my subjective experiences are just as valid as anyone elses.... what can I say...."
rahul248001 says, "well i,ve met people trying to understand Hinduism before, but with no conviction or belief, it was more out of comparison and timepass"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "and... it seems to me that Jains have made some great contributions to the world with their religion and philosophy.. I am especially fond of Anekantavada.... "The doctrine of manifold causes""
rahul248001 says, "they never get to the heart of it"
rahul248001 says, "frankly, OM all I know is that if one spends one,s life not being decietful, not harming anyone, rather than going and praying in temples . , one has attained the stage where a monk or a priest cant go"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "im reading your posts rahul"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i have this new CHEETAH CHAT sofware for Yahoo.. and it allows me to save entire chat dialogues to disk files.. and edit them later"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "so.. I am saving these chats.. rahul.. and I can go back and read your posts at leisure"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "it is available for free www.cheetah.com I believe"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i like to save religious chat dialogues.. and study the concepts...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i think that.. in dialogue.. many people around the world.. together.. bring out.. key issues.. regarding the religious nature of mankind...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul... if you have a chance.. visit my page 14... it is one of the nicest with religious pictures and music...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i based page 14 on something nice that I found while reading.... from the lineage of Vallabacharya and tha Asta Chap poets of the Braja dialect"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "yes rahul.. I agree... with you there..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i hope there will be some way for me to spend my last few years.. in meditation... japa... etc...."
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i think that hindus and buddhists and jains and sikhs are constantly attacked and criticized unfairly by christians and muslims... so I think its nice to have a website... which demonstrates the weaknesses and vulnerability of christianity and islam..."
rahul248001 says, "Quite right , OM"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "i have met many young people from india who complain that in schools and colleges.. the christians have subtle ways to make them feal unclean.....dirty..... I think thats a form of opression..."
rahul248001 says, "we been chatting for bout an hour now"
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "rahul.. here are some of the points that I freequenly throw out during.... religious arguments..."
Om_Namah_Shivaya .The past 2000 years shows that Christian and Islamic peoples are no more moral or ethical or loving or peaceful that Hindus/ Buddhist. In light of German Jewish Holocaust, Spanish Inquisition, conquests of North & So. American Indians, the rise of Communism, the African slave trade, witch burnings, and Islamic conquests... Christian and Islamic peoples are considerably less nice than Hindu and Buddhist peoples.
Om_Namah_Shivaya . India gave refuge in 180 B.C. to Jews fleeing Antiochus Epiphanes.. the Jews were well received, are in Bombay to this day.. and there is no history of anti-semitism in India.
Einulf says, "Not less nice, Om. Just more successful."
Om_Namah_Shivaya Since Hinduism and Buddhism were well established during the lifetime of Jesus... and since Jesus is believed to be God, and therefore, omniscient, knowing all future events, then why is there not one single mention of Buddhism or Hinduism ... or their alleged falsehood... in any of the Gospels... since there is much mention and warning of false teachers, and deception in the last times?
Om_Namah_Shivaya .Since God has Omniscient foreknowledge of all future events, if TRUE DOCTRINE were so important, then... God, foreknowing the various disputes regarding Trinity, or Christ's Divinity, or Purgatory, or Transubstantiation... God would have inspired additional, more detailed scriptural verses, to elimnate doubts and disputes on key doctrines.
Om_Namah_Shivaya ..Worship of God, under threat of eternal torment for failure to believe, or worship, is analogous to romance at gun-point..... its called RAPE. It violates the free-will. And convenants or contracts agreed to under such duress are null and void under most systems of jurisprudence.
Om_Namah_Shivaya I do not care to worship a god which resembles the god that the Judeao-Christian-Islamic West envisions, tormenting souls for eternity with no hope of reform. Worshiping such a god, under threat of punishment, would compromise my basic human dignity..I would prefer enternal torment from such a god...thant to worship it for the paultry pleasures of such a vindictive god's paradise.
Om_Namah_Shivaya .Hindu Suti, (widow voluntarily dying on funeral pyre), can be compared to the long tradition in greek orthodoxy of people who actively sought martyrdom by provoking Turks, saying "Mohammed is a horse-thief"... so as to cleanse their sins, or become a quick saint.
Om_Namah_Shivaya It is the West's failure to understand duality, which leads to the folly of trying to eliminate evil, and have only good, eliminate poverty and have only wealth, or convert all people to ONE TRUE FAITH, in one lifetime. It is a very evident historical fact that such unanimous agreement has never been reached in the past 2000 yrs, and will never be reached. This provides evidence for the necessity of rebirth, and gradual spiritual ripening of individual souls.
Om_Namah_Shivaya in the Gita 7:3... Lord Krsna says.."Of thousands of people, scarecely anyone strives for spiritual perfection; and even of the striving and perfected, scarcely anyone knows ME in truth." ... this indicates that God does not expect all humanity to come to some unanimous one single true faith, within a single lifetime..but suggests a gradual process of ripening..over many lifetimes.. with only a small knowlegable minority existing at any one time.
Om_Namah_Shivaya If God is eternal and unchanging...then what does it mean when the Old Testament says that God becomes ANGRY, or REGRETS (for it is written that God REGRETTED making Saul king), or that God forgives... since REGRET, ANGER, FORGIVENESS... all imply CHANGE AND TEMPORALITY.
Om_Namah_Shivaya If God is complete and perfect...then He had no need to create the universe... but that means He performed a senseless and purposeless act... which detracts from God's Wisdom... but... if God DID have a purpose, a potive for creation... then that means God LACKED something... and was therefore not always complete and perfect.
Om_Namah_Shivaya says, "so anyway.. rahul.. those are some of the ideas I have been working with.. and I can preprogram them in CHEETAH chat... as macros.. and repeat them with the click of a button...."
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