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(Total activity, all pages, all sites, in page reloads, since 9/21/2000)
(12-11-98)
EasyRider: hi, can I ask you a question about hinduism?
Sitaram: yes
Sitaram: are you doing a paper for school?
EasyRider: yes
Sitaram: I help many students with such papers...
EasyRider: this is the question posed to me--To Americans, the traditional Hindu caste system - with its segregation, its inequalities, its rules about what is pure and what is impure - can appear very strange, perhaps even distasteful. The caste system, nonetheless, is a social expression of feelings and attitudes that all humans have.
Sitaram: its ok...
EasyRider: Look at everyday modern American life. What do we find to be "pure" and "impure"? Aren't there things, perhaps people, that we feel uncomfortable about touching or being near or thinking about? Aren't there things or people that are seen to be special, in whose presence we would want to be?
Sitaram: so.. the question is... what in american attitudes... corresponds to or resembles.. the Hindu Caste system..??
Sitaram: am I correct?
EasyRider: yes
EasyRider: I understand the question but I am not sure how to begin to answer ti!!
Sitaram: ok... off the top of my head.. let me throw out some ideas...
EasyRider: ok
Sitaram: first... lets look at Greek and Russian Orthodox Christian church.. which is present in this country...
Sitaram: when a woman gives birth.. she is not allowed to enter the church for 40 days.... she is considered "unclean"
Sitaram: on the 40th day.... she enters the church... and the priest performs a "churching" ceremony... part of which is to sprinkle her and symbolically cleanse her...
Sitaram: and... in Orthodox Judaism.... after a woman has her period... she enters the Mikvah... for cleansing........ it is a pool of running water....
Sitaram: now... of course... there are concepts in this country of... clean and unclean.. in the sense that food companies mark foods as Kosher....
Sitaram: and also.. for Moslems... food which is acceptable is called Halal...
Sitaram: but.. of course.. anything from the pig.. is considered unclean..... both by Jews and Muslims...
Sitaram: now... because of aids and other diseases.. in recent years.... there is a concept of clean... and unclean with regard to body fluids....
Sitaram: now.... with regard to caste... let us look and the Old Testament...... in religious practice
Sitaram: only one Tribe amongst the 12 jewish tribes.. was declared to be the Priestly tribe.. and this was the Levites..
Sitaram: so.... in reality.... Judaism .. in the time of moses.. had something resembling a caste system... with the Levite corresponding to the Brahmin... or priestly class...
Sitaram: now... also... consider prejudices.... both in this country now... and in ancient times... with regard to male versus female gender...
Sitaram: when is your paper due???
Sitaram: I hope not tomorrow
EasyRider: monday...and it is only a 400 word essay.
Sitaram: ok... is this helping you so far???
EasyRider: yes...
Sitaram: are you high school or college?
EasyRider: college
Sitaram: and how old.. are you ... just curious
Sitaram: and what year.. and what is your major
EasyRider: 21
Sitaram: ok.. and a senior???
Sitaram: perhaps
Sitaram: just curious
EasyRider: I am a junior sociology and political science major
Sitaram: im in brooklyn ny... male... age 50
Sitaram: what city state...??
EasyRider: wilmington NC
Sitaram: ok... well.. back to our topic
EasyRider: lol
EasyRider: what about culturally in US...i was thinking the homless or the diseased made american feel uncormfortable ??
Sitaram: oh.. by the way.. incase you dont know... you may click on the upper IM box... click control A to highlight the entire dialogue... click control C to clip to clip board "cut"... and then control V to paste into a wordpad document
Sitaram: yes... I was thinking about that too....
EasyRider: oh good, I am not an idiot!!
Sitaram: also.. let us consider homosexuality..... people tend to feel uncomfortable..
Sitaram: well. some people dont know...
EasyRider: you dont have to tell me that!
Sitaram: I didnt know until last month
Sitaram: I was so happy to find out....
Sitaram: also.. you must realize .. many students that I help are in high school.. or junior high.. and dont know
Sitaram: I just didnt want you to be scrambling nervously... doing something else... if you were unaware of these tricks...
EasyRider: what trick?
Sitaram: I guess young folks in college teach one another all these tricks..
Sitaram: cutting and pasting... and control A
Sitaram: my 14 yr old step son didnt even know... about control A
Sitaram: anyway... no offense intended
EasyRider: oh no, when I said you dont have to tell me that I was talking about people uncomfortable with homosexuality!!
Sitaram: so.... our society considers homosexuals to be unclean.... quite a bit of homophobia...
Sitaram: Ohhhhhhhhhh
Sitaram: well... you see... I spend quite a bit of time in Yahoo Religion chat.. and Christian chat....
Sitaram: and also.. in AOL Hindu Beliefs chat...
EasyRider: I spent alot of time in the gay christians room!!
Sitaram: and.. in Christian chat in Yahoo especially.. I watch long debates about homosexuality..... and the FUndies.. fundamentalists are very much against it
Sitaram: not to pry.. but .. are you gay?
EasyRider: I debate with them all the time...it gets very frustrating...yes I am a lesbian.
Sitaram: I am very... positive towards gays and lesbians... I am not homophobic
EasyRider: thats good!
Sitaram: in fact.. I just found a wonderful URL.... for a ste called GOD LOVES GAYS
Sitaram: WHICH I can give you
EasyRider: cool
Sitaram: which must obviously.. be in combat to that horribly viscious Godhatesfags.... which you must have heard of and which I dont even want to visit
Sitaram: and im straight...
Sitaram: I thought you were insulted cause I was telling you about control A.... ha ha
Sitaram: you can see how far my mind is from homophobia
EasyRider: thats is pretty funny!
Sitaram: the funny thing.... the act of... for example ... oral sex.... is neither uniquely straight nor gay.... and is inherent in much mamallian behaviour....
Sitaram: but im sure you have considered and discussed such issues
Sitaram: I would like to give you the URL to my website on Hinduism... and Interfaith Dialogues....
Sitaram: and.. you can see my photo as well... also you may find things of interest there...
EasyRider: well, I was actually wondering about the topic in relation to the paper...i wasnt sure if it was relevant
Sitaram: well.. since it has occured to me.... it must have some relavence....
EasyRider: good
Sitaram: also.. now that you mention it... our societies concept of the uncleaness of sexuality in general.. witness the Clinton phenomenon
Sitaram: hold on one minute
EasyRider: ok
Sitaram: Click here: A Hindu Dream - seeing GOD - Page 1
Sitaram: thats my website
EasyRider: ok
Sitaram: and I emailed it for convenience.. now for the God loves Gays...
Sitaram: Click here: God loves Gays
Sitaram: and I also emailed as well
Sitaram: and.. now.. one more... a very good url .. on hinduism...
EasyRider: thanks
Sitaram: Click here: HINDUISM PAGE
Sitaram: regarding the Clinton issue... it is interesting.. I ment some europeans.. and asked their opinion of the scandal here
Sitaram: and.. they said... "Americans are so Childish
Sitaram: in europe.. they said.. we have so many in high and powerful positions.. who are... (im quoting their exact words)... "having affairs.. mistresses.. illigitamet children, GAY....
Sitaram: AND no one thinks anything of it...
Sitaram: also... the notion that only a MALE.. may serve as a priest.... this too .. it seems to me.. is related to the caste system notion.. and concepts of clean and unclean
Sitaram: and of course.. when people are predjudiced... even 100 yrs ago.. what do they say..."filthy injun.... filthy nigger... etc etc..." connecting concept of unclean.. with the outcaste
Sitaram: even... when we call that which we dislike "a pig"... whether a cop is a pig.. .. or a male chauvenist pig.... it goes back to this concept of unclean.... versus clean...
EasyRider: wow, thats one I never would have thought of
Sitaram: now.. on the other side of the coin... that which is CLEAN DESIRABLE.... Hmmm..... well.. movie stars ... role models.. are our IDOLS....
Sitaram: WE worship them...
Sitaram: we want to TOUCH THEM...
Sitaram: and.. if they touch our hand.. we say.. OH I WILL never wash that hand again....
EasyRider: lol
Sitaram: and.. our habit of keeping souveneers.. locks of hair.. from what we love or admire...
Sitaram: and.. we say... if we love someting... thats PURE.. heaven.... PURE genious
Sitaram: so.. concepts of PURE have entered into our language
Sitaram: of course.. we do say... that is PURE EVIL....
Sitaram: of course 1955 wasnt so long ago.. when Rosa Parks.... sat in the FRONT OF the bus.... as an act of civil disobedience...
Sitaram: and .. prior to that.. there was segregation of blacks.. in busses resteraunts....
EasyRider: and separate water fountains
Sitaram: bathrooms.. drinking fountains....
EasyRider: thats a good point too
Sitaram: and.. the whole concept that WHITE IS PURE... and black is dirty
Sitaram: and.. in the New testament.. in the book of revelations.. the vision of christ in very white robes... etc...
Sitaram: and.. in the old testament.. in the book of Jeremiah.. the verse which says.... "The leopard cannot change its spots... nor the Ethopian.. the color of his skin..."
Sitaram: I can find that verse... if necessary.. but.. im pretty sure the prophet is talking about sinful nature...
Sitaram: and.. in the new testament.. the motifs of light and darkness... "those who were sitting in darkness.. have seen a great light..."
Sitaram: light one candle rather than curse the darkness
Sitaram: and.. hmm... even blindness...
Sitaram: and.. our societies hesitancy to come near to the handicapped
Sitaram: imperfection makes us uncomfortable...
Sitaram: so.. hence.. all of our equal rights legislations... points out or highlights.. our in herent "caste system " mentality
Sitaram: have you passed out yet???
EasyRider: LOL
Sitaram: think we have 400 words yet
Sitaram: ;-)
Sitaram: this is fun
Sitaram: I think I will write a book
Sitaram: ;-)
Sitaram: just teasing
EasyRider: I think so, how I have too much info!!
Sitaram: it is an interesting question
Sitaram: I certainly hope you can come to manhattan one day. and we can meet
Sitaram: im sure you would enjoy NYC
EasyRider: my gf and I are planning to go the times squear for the 2000 new years
Sitaram: oh.. wonderful.. well.. but thats a ways away.. anyway... keep my email...
EasyRider: I definately will
EasyRider: THANK YOU SO MUCH
Sitaram: in Yahoo I am Om_Namah_Shivaya@yahoo.com
Sitaram: my pleasure
Sitaram: I know you must have found me by scanning profiles
Sitaram: for hindu
EasyRider: yep, I will put you on my buddylist if you dont mind
Sitaram: my entire profile is Hindu keywords... so I will be found... and I am often found...
Sitaram: not at all.. im adding you to mine... right now...
EasyRider: ok
Sitaram: so... do you feel good about your paper.. now
Sitaram: like you have a good handle
Sitaram: arnt computers ..amazing
Sitaram: do you feel like you have know me for a long time?
EasyRider: yes I think so, just have to organize my thought-your thoughts!
EasyRider: yeah , I love computers!
Sitaram: ok... you are in my buddy list
EasyRider: so are you. thanks again
Sitaram: I think we have known each other in past lives
Sitaram: ;-)
EasyRider: probably
Sitaram: IM me anytime... and do visit my website
EasyRider: I will...buh bye
Sitaram: and let me know.. how the paper turns out...
Sitaram: bye bye
EasyRider: I will
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